UC-NRLF 


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OF  THE 

UNIVERSITY 

OF 


Recommendations  for 

Reorganization  of  the  Public  School  System 
of  the  City  of }  Chicago. 

Report  of 

An  Investigation  by  the  Committee  on 
Schools,  Fire,  Police  and  Civil  Service  of 
the  City  Council  of  the  City  of  Chicago. 

Testimony  of 

Educational  Experts  who  Appeared  before 
the  Committee. 


CONCURRED  IN  BY  THE  CITY  COUNCIL 
DECEMBER  7,  1917 


Recommendations  for 

Reorganization  of  the  Public  School  System 
of  the  City  of  Chicago. 

Report  of 

An  Investigation  by  the  Committee  on 
Schools,  Fire,  Police  and  Civil  Service  of 
the  City  Council  of  the  City  of  Chicago. 

Testimony  of 

Educational  Experts  who  Appeared  before 
the  Committee. 


CONCURRED  IN  BY  THE  CITY  COUNCIL 
DECEMBER  7,   1917 


EXCHANG1 


Ml 

V 


BARNARD  £  MILLER 


137 


CV/923 


COMMITTEE  ON  SCHOOLS,  FIRE,  POLICE 
AND  CIVIL  SERVICE 


THOMAS  J.  LYNCH,  Chairman 

OSCAR  DE  PRIEST  THOMAS  O.  WALLACE 

CHARLES  MARTIN  HERMAN  E.  GNADT 

FRANK  KLAUS  JOHN  C.  KENNEDY 

HERMAN  KRUMDICK  THOMAS  F.  BYRNE 

JOHN  POWERS  ROBERT  R.  PEGRAM 

HERMAN  E.  MILLER  ROBERT  M.  BUCK 

WILLIAM  P.  ELLISON  JOSEPH  C.  BLAHA 


SUBCOMMITTEE 

ROBERT  M.  BUCK.  Chairman 
JOHN  C.  KENNEDY  THOMAS  F.  BYRNE 


TABLE  OF  CONTENTS. 


Page 

Beport  of  the  Committee 1-8 

Findings   of  the   Committee 2 

Eecommendations :    4 

For  new  legislation   4-6 

To  the  Board  of  Education 6-8 

For  an  administrative  code 7 

Testimony: 

Ben  Blewett,  Supt.  of  Public  Instruction,  St.  Louis,  Mo 9 

Charles  E.  Chadsey,  Supt.  of  Schools,  Detroit 23 

Frank  E.  Spaulding,  Supt.  of  Schools,  Minneapolis 42 

Prof.  Charles  H.  Judd,  University  of  Chicago   61 

Prof.  F.  W.  Eoman,  Syracuse  University 66 

William  H.  Maxwell,  Supt.  of  Schools,  New  York 72 

Dr.  Leonard  P.  Ayres,  Eussell  Sage  Foundation    75 

Bibliography    84 


CITY  COUNCIL  SCHOOL  PLAN. 


The  report  of  the  Committee  on  Schools,  Fire,  Police  and 
Civil  Service  of  the  City  Council,  containing  recommendations 
for  new  state  legislation  and  reorganization  of  the  school  system, 
was  concurred  in  by  the  City  Council  of  the  City  of  Chicago, 
December  7, 1916,  pages  2387-2401  of  the  proceedings. 

The  following  is  the  report  as  adopted: 

Chicago,  November  25,  1916. 

To  the  Mayor  and  Aldermen  of  the  City  of  Chicago  in  Council  Assembled: 

Your  Committee  on  Schools,  Fire,  Police  and  Civil  Service,  which  was 
ordered  (June  30,  1916,  page  4151  of  the  Proceedings)  to  "make  a  thorough  in- 
vestigation into  the  causes,  methods  of  adoption,  purposes  and  results  of  the 
so-called  Loeb  rules,  adopted  by  the  Board  of  Education  and  to  investigate  the 
actions  of  the  Board  of  Education  and  other  bodies  or  persons  contributing  to, 
or  responsible  for,  the  present  disorganization  in  the  management  of  the  public 
schools,"  begs  leave  to  report  as  follows: 

Numerous  hearings  were  conducted  during  the  course  of  which  the  committee 
came  to  believe  that  the  condition  of  Chicago's  education  system  with  reference 
to  discipline,  organization  and  efficiency  was  not  alone  or  even  chiefly  attributable 
to  the  controversies  raging  in  and  around  the  Board  of  Education. 

Thereafter,  throughout  the  summer,  plans  were  drawn  to  direct  the  attention 
of  the  Council,  through  its  committee  and  the  community  through  the  Council, 
away  from  the  controversial  features  of  our  situation  and  toward  the  constructive 
side.  The  committee  is  especially  indebted  to  Prof.  Charles  H.  Judd,  head  of 
the  school  of  education  of  the  University  of  Chicago,  and  to  Prof.  George  H.  Mead 
of  the  same  university  for  help  in  interesting  prominent  educators  from  other 
cities  in  our  situation. 

ADVICE  OF  EXPERTS  SOUGHT. 

Invitations  were  sent  to  educational  experts  to  discuss  problems  of  school 
administration  with  the  committee  and  a  number  of  them  came  at  no  expense  to 
us  except  their  railway  fare,  giving  generously  of  their  time  and  talents,  so  that 
the  committee  had  the  advantage  of  the  following  program  of  discussions: 

October  14,  Ben  Blewett,  Superintendent  of  Instruction  of  St.  Louis,  outlined 
the  features  of  the  school  charter  of  that  city  under  which  its  schools  have 
advanced  to  a  prominent  position  in  the  educational  world. 

October  24,  Charles  E.  Chadsey,  Superintendent  of  Schools  of  Detroit,  de- 
scribed an  intensely  interesting  period  of  transition  of  the  school  system  of  his 
city,  where  rapid  progress  is  being  made  under  his  leadership. 

October  28,  Frank  E.  Spaulding,  Superintendent  of  Schools  of  Minneapolis, 
told  the  committee  how  the  present  high  efficiency  of  that  system  was  built  up 
by  the  establishment  of  correct,  modern  principles  of  school  management. 

October  30,  Prof.  F.  W.  Boman  of  Syracuse  University  told  of  his  study  of 
vocational  education  development  in  Germany,  and  Prof.  Judd  described  modern 
methods  of  measuring  efficiency  of  schools  and  teachers. 

November  4,  Dr.  Leonard  P.  Ayres,  director  of  the  education  department  of 
the  Eussell  Sage  Foundation  of  New  York  City,  leading  educational  expert,  dis- 
cussed and  made  plain  for  the  committee  fundamental  principles  of  correct  school 
administration.  At  the  same  hearing  letters  were  read  communicating  ideas  of 
William  H.  Maxwell,  Superintendent  of  Schools  of  New  York  City,  who  was  pre- 
vented from  coming  only  by  poor  health. 

In  its  studies  made  subsequent  to  the  testimony  of  the  experts  from  other 
cities,  the  committee  is  deeply  indebted  to  Prof.  John  F.  Bobbitt,  of  the  school 
of  education,  University  of  Chicago. 


CONSTRUCTION  MUST  REPLACE  STRIFE. 

Testimony  of  these  experts  confirmed  the  opinions  of  the  committee  that 
fundamental  theories  and  practices  are  in  need  of  correction;  that  Chicago's 
school  system  is  improperly  organized;  that  the  real  faults  and  causes  of  present 
discord  lay  far  beneath  the  surface  and  that  the  Loeb  rules,  the  battles  between 
Board  and  Superintendent,  Board  and  teachers,  teachers  and  Superintendent, 
principals  and  janitors,  Board  and  City  Council,  Secretary  and  Superintendent, 
Secretary  and  teachers,  to  say  nothing  of  skirmishes  involving  the  independent  and 
semi-independent  bureau  and  department  heads  with  any  or  all  of  these,  were  not 
causes,  but  effects. 

Grave  difficulties  have  followed  in  the  wake  of  long  years  of  controversy. 
It  is  time  for  controversy  to  cease.  Eancor  and  bitterness  have  sapped  at  the 
life  of  our  schools,  which  are  the  foundation  of  Americanism.  Sad  will  be  the 
conceptions  of  civic  duty  and  patriotism  of  our  future  citizens  if  controversy  and 
rancor  are  not  eliminated. 

Continued  fighting  of  individuals  and  factions  cannot  possibly  result  in 
cessation  of  bitterness,  but  must  increase  the  poisonous  effects  of  continued 
intolerance. 

The  committee  believes  that  the  schools  and  the  civic  life  of  our  city  would 
best  be  served  by  the  harmonizing  of  the  energetic,  struggling  forces  of  the 
community  and  that  if  those  forces  could  apply  their  splendid  energies  to  pulling 
together  instead  of  pulling  and  hauling  apart,  destruction  would  give  way  to 
construction,  animosities  would  be  replaced  by  reasoning  together  and  recognition 
of  the  rights  of  each  by  each  would  emerge  in  the  process  of  union  to  build  up 
instead  of  scrambling  to  tear  down. 

The  committee  realizes  that  the  system  of  management  that  now  obtains  in 
Chicago  schools  is  one  of  long  standing — the  heritage  of  many  past  boards  of 
education.  The  members  of  the  committee  were  surprised  to  find  out  how  many 
things  they  had  to  learn.  The  more  fundamental  of  these  are  here  listed  as 
findings  of  the  committee: 

OPINIONS  OF  THE  COMMITTEE. 

First.  The  Board  of  Education  of  Chicago,  consisting  of  twenty-one  members, 
is  too  large  to  govern  the  school  system  efficiently.  Educators  are  unanimous  in 
the  opinion  that  large  boards  of  education  cannot  operate  satisfactorily. 

Second.  The  Board  of  Education  of  Chicago  udertakes  close  administrative 
control  of  the  schools.  This  is  an  expert's  work  and  should  be  delegated  to  the 
Superintendent  of  Schools.  The  Board's  work  properly,  according  to  all  recog- 
nized educators,  should  be  to  legislate,  inspect  and  exercise  custody  of  school 
property  and  finances.  The  executive  work  should  be  lodged  in  the  hands  of 
trained  educators.  The  result  of  the  present  practice  in  Chicago  is  a  confused 
situation  which  is  not  conducive  to  developing  the  full  efficiency  of  either  Superin- 
tendent or  Board. 

Third.  Lack  of  definition  of  functions,  powers  and  duties  exists  to  a  de- 
structive degree  in  the  Chicago  school  system.  The  field  of  the  Board  overlaps 
that  of  the  Superintendent.  The  status  of  the  Superintendent's  assistants  and 
of  teachers  is  not  clearly  defined.  The  distribution  of  functions  of  school  man- 
agement among  school  officials  and  Board  committees  is  confusing,  to  say  the 
least.  No  logical  plan  seems  to  have  been  followed  in  the  assignment  of  bureaus 
to  the  respective  departments  under  which  they  operate.  In  fact,  the  most 
unfortunate  feature  of  this  lack  of  definition  is  the  division  of  the  Chicago 
school  system  into  two  departments — educational  and  administrative.  These  have 
separate  heads,  neither  responsible  to  the  other.  The  Superintendent  is  the  educa- 
tional head  and  the  secretary  is  the  administrative  chief.  The  business  manager 
is  under  the  latter  as  also  are  the  chief  engineer,  the  superintendent  of  supplies 
and  other  bureau  heads.  This  is  by  no  means  the  only  division  of  authority  how- 
ever. The  committees  of  the  Board  infringe  on  the  territory  of  both  departments. 
For  instance,  under  the  rules  of  the  Board,  the  Committee  on  Buildings  and 
Grounds  each  year  invites  "proposals  from  dealers  in  stationery,  slates,  pencils, 


pens  and  other  articles  and  materials  used  in  school  work"  and  "with  their 
proposals,  dealers  shall  furnish  the  business  manager  samples  of  all  articles  or 
materials  proposed  to  be  supplied."  It  is  not  apparent  why  the  committee  should 
invite  the  proposals,  but  it  is  incomprehensible  that  the  samples  of  ' '  articles  and 
materials  used  in  school  work"  should  be  supplied  to  the  business  manager  who 
is  subordinate  to  the  secretary  and  not  to  the  Superintendent  of  Schools—  The 
School  Management  Committee  is  charged  similarly  with  the  duty  to  solicit 
proposals  for  textbooks  and  the  bidders  supply  samples  of  these  to  the  business 
manager  also.  The  same  defective  organization  removes  the  janitors  in  school 
buildings  from  any  responsibility  to  the  principals  in  charge  of  the  schools.  This 
system  is  of  many  years  standing. 

SCHOOL  AUTHORITY  IS  DIVIDED. 

Fourth.  The  division  of  authority  between  the  Board  of  Education  and  the 
City  Council  in  the  financial  affairs  of  the  Board  constitutes  an  intolerable  com- 
plication, prevents  location  of  responsibility,  causes  delay  in  the  transaction  of 
business  and  makes  efficient  management  extremely  difficult. 

Fifth.  The  fact  that  the  Board  is  appointed  by  the  Mayor,  subject  to 
ratification  by  the  City  Council  and  not  removable,  makes  it  easy  for  the  members 
to  consider  that  they  are  responsible  to  the  Mayor  instead  of  to  the  people  and 
again  creates  division  of  responsibility.  A  large  majority  of  trained  school  men 
recommend  that  Board  members  be  elected  at  large.  If  the  Board  is  to  control 
its  own  finances  and  the  Council  is  to  surrender  that  control,  it  seems  clear  that 
the  Board  should  be  elected  by  the  people  upon  whom  it  will  have  the  power 
to  levy  taxes. 

Sixth.  The  election  of  a  Superintendent  from  year  to  year,  with  the  result 
that  he  automatically  resigns  his  position  annually  and  is  required  to  line  up 
every  year  eleven  affirmative  votes  in  order  to  hold  his  place,  is  a  grave  error 
of  school  administration  in  the  view  of  every  educator  who  advised  with  the 
•committee.  There  seems  to  be  no  logical  reason  why  he  should  not  be  uninter- 
rupted in  his  employment  as  long  as  he  renders  satisfactory  service,  as  the  head  of 
any  similarly  large  enterprise  would  be  in  private  business. 

Seventh.  The  Board  of  Education  has  not  only  provision  for  an  educational 
expert  at  the  head  of  the  system,  but  has  also  a  large  corps  of  trained  educators 
employed  as  assistant  superintendents,  supervisors,  principals  and  teachers.  The 
aid  of  these  is  not  regularly  sought  in  passing  upon  questions  of  school  policy. 
The  committee  believes  that  much  more  of  the  dissatisfaction  and  distrust  in  the 
teaching  force  is  due  to  this  lack  of  confidence  and  co-operation  than  to  questions 
of  salary  or  pensions.  The  experts  .in  the  educational  field  are  unanimous  in 
declaring  in  favor  of  consultation  with  the  teaching  staff  on.  educational  questions. 

DESTRUCTION  OF  MERIT  RULE  WRONG. 

Eighth.  A  grave  administrative  error  was  committed  by  the  Board'  in  de- 
stroying continuity  of  tenure  of  teachers  based  on  satisfactory  service.  Every 
educator  that  appeared  before  the  committee  stated  the  opinion  that  tenure  of 
teachers  should  be  uninterrupted  during  efficient  service. 

Ninth.  The  educators,  including  superintendents  of  schools,  were  a  unit  in 
declaring  that  seeking  to  control  by  rule  or  otherwise  the  organizations  or  kinds 
of  organizations  to  which  a  teacher  may  or  may  not  belong,  is  not  a  proper 
function  of  a  Board  of  Education. 

Tenth.  The  experts  were  unanimous  in  denouncing  the  dismissal  of  teachers 
by  failure  to  elect  or  otherwise,  without  charges,  without  hearing,  without 
opportunity  to  improve  if  inefficient  and  without  notice. 

Eleventh.  There  is  no  adequate  machinery  in  the  Chicago  school  system  for 
recording  efficiency  of  teachers,  although  such  machinery  is  easily  devised  and 
although  much  material  showing  recent  progress  in  that  field  is  readily  available. 

Twelfth.     A  still  more  unfortunate  lack  has  followed  the  failure  to  provide 


means  of  measuring  the  efficiency  of  the  schools.  The  educators  informed  the 
committee  that  definite  modes  have  been  devised  for  reaching  accurate  and 
reliable  conclusions  on  the  effectiveness  of  the  schools. 

SCHOOL  REORGANIZATION  RECOMMENDED. 

Based  upon  these  findings  and  the  testimony,  books  and  documents  supporting 
them,  the  committee  recommends: 

1.  That  the  City  Council  adopt  as  its  policy  the  constructive  program  herein- 
after set  forth  and  seek  to  unite  the  forces  of  the  city  who  are  patriotically,  loyally 
and  unselfishly  interested  in  the  welfare  of  the  greatest  of  our  institutions — the 
public  school — in  a  campaign  to  obtain  the  recommended  legislation  at  Springfield; 
to  induce  the  Board  of  Education  to  enact  an  administrative  code  such   as  is 
hereinafter  recommended  and  which  it  can  now  do  under  its  present  powers  with- 
out waiting  for  new  legislation;  and  in  a  city- wide  effort  to  educate  the  voters  of 
the  city  to  an  awakened  understanding  of  the  progress  that  has  been  made  in  the 
science  of  education  and  to  train  them  in  efficiency  in  government  of  the  school 
system  that  moulds  our  future  citizens  and  makes  them  American  or  not  as  it  is 
efficient  or  inefficient. 

2.  That  the  Legislature  be  requested  to  amend  at  this  session  the  school  law 
governing  cities   of  more  than   100,000  population,   so  that  it  shall  provide  as 
follows: 

(I)  The  Board  of  Education  shall  consist  of  seven  members  elected  at  large, 
subject  to  recall. 

(II)  The  term  of  office  of  members  of  the  Board  of  Education  shall  be  six 
years.    At  the  first  election  three  members  shall  be  elected  for  six  years;  two  shall 
be  elected  for  four  years  and  two  for  two  years.    Thereafter  there  shall  be  elected 
every  two  years  for  six-year  terms  the   number  of  members  whose   terms   are 
about  to  expire. 

(III)  Each  member  shall  receive  a  salary  of  $5,000  a  year. 

NONP ARTISAN  ELECTION  OF  BOARD  MEMBERS. 

(IV)  The  members  of  the  Board  of  Education  shall  be  elected  at  the  regular 
city  election  each  even-numbered  year  on  a  non-partisan  ballot.     If  the  election 
of  other  city  officers  is  placed  upon  a  non-partisan  basis,  they  shall  be  elected  upon 
the  regular  city  ballot.    In  the  absence  of  a  non-partisan  election  for  other  city 
officers,  the  names  of  candidates  for  member  of  the  Board  of  Education  shall  be 
placed  upon  a  separate  ballot  bearing  no  party  name,  symbol,  circle  or  column. 
At  the  regular  city  primary  election  the  same  practice  shall  prevail,  the  names 
appearing  on  the  primary  ballot  by  petition,  the  same  ballot  being  used  by  the 
voters  of  all  parties.    If,  at  the  primary  election,  any  candidates  obtain  a  majority 
of  all  the  votes  cast,  they  shall  be  declared  elected.    The  names  of  twice  as  many 
as  fail  to  obtain  a  majority  shall  be  placed  upon  the  ticket  at  the  election  in  the 
order  of  the  number  of  votes  received  at  the  primary,  beginning  with  the  one 
receiving  the  greatest  number.     The  names  shall  be  rotated  upon  the  ballots  by 
wards  or  precincts,  both  at  the  primary  and  at  the  election,  the  top  name  in  one 
division  being  dropped  to  the  bottom  in  the  next.    Women  may  vote  for  members 
of  the  Board  of  Education  and  are  eligible  to  be  elected  to  membership.    Vacancies 
may  be  filled  by  the  Board  until  the  next  regular  city  election,  when  they  shall 
be  filled  by  the  voters. 

(V)  The  powers  of  the  Board  'of  Education  shall  be: 

a.  To  control  such  of  the  finances  and  property  of  the  city  as  are  for 
educational  purposes; 

"b.  To  appropriate  money  for  all  educational  purposes,  but  for  no  other 
purpose; 

c.  To  acquire  property  for  school,  playground  or  other  educational  sites 
by  purchase  or  under  the  law  of  eminent  domain,  taking  title  for  the  city 
in  trust  for  educational  or  playground  purposes; 


d.  To  erect,  purchase  or  lease  buildings  for  educational  purposes; 

e.  To  furnish  schools,  playgrounds,  libraries  and  other  educational  com- 
munity centers  and  to  employ  and  fix  the  compensation  of  the  necessary  per- 
sons to  conduct,  maintain  and  manage  the  same;   provided,  that  the  Board 
shall  not  be  required  to  appoint  or  employ  any  person  annually  or  for  a  term 
of  only  one  year,  except  teachers  during  their  period  of  probationary  service; 

f.  To  improve  and  lease  school  property  and  to  lend  moneys  belonging 
to  the  school  fund; 

g.  To  grant  the  use  of  any  portion  of  the  educational  equipment  for 
public  lectures,  concerts  or  other  social  or  community  interests; 

h.  To  install  and  maintain  a  system  of  health  inspection  for  employes  and 
pupils; 

i.  To  have  and  possess  all  the  rights,  powers  and  authority  required  for 
proper  government  of  the  education  system,  with  power  to  enact  such  ordi- 
nances as  may  be  deemed  necessary  and  expedient  for  such  purposes; 

j.  To  appoint  an  attorney  and  a  comptroller  who  shall  be  directly  re- 
sponsible to  the  Board  in  the  discharge  of  its  legislative,  inspectorial  and 
custodial  functions  and  who  shall  not  be  under  the  control  of  the  Superintend- 
ent; 

k.  To  appoint  disinterested  experts  from  time  to  time  to  report  directly  to 
the  Board  concerning  the  efficiency  of  the  schools  and  the  employes  of  the 
Board; 

FOUR- YEAR  CONTRACT  FOR  SUPERINTENDENT. 

1.  To  execute  a  contract  with  the  General  Superintendent  of  Schools  for 
not  to  exceed  four  years;  such  contract  to  contain  provisions  for  cancellation 
for  cause;  also  for  inefficiency  or  for  neglect  of  duty  in  determining  which 
the  decision  of  the  Board  shall  not  be  subject  to  review  by  the  courts;  pro- 
vided, however,  that  the  charge  of  inefficiency  or  neglect  of  duty  shall  be 
based  upon  data  compiled  by  a  bureau  of  inspection  and  appraisal,  created 
by  ordinance,  or  by  a  commission  of  disinterested  experts;  and,  provided 
further,  that  such  charges  shall  be  presented  in  writing  to  the  General 
Superintendent  of  Schools  at  least  ninety  days  prior  to  a  decision,  and  that 
the  General  Superintendent  of  Schools  shall  have  opportunity  to  present  a 
written  answer  and  shall  have  the  right  to  cause  publication  of  the  charges 
and  answer  within  the  said  ninety  days; 

m.  To  submit  questions  of  educational  policy  to  the  people  by  referendum 
either  by  passing  ordinances  contingent  upon  approval  by  referendum  or  by 
submitting  questions  of  public  policy; 

n.  Eepeal  of  Sections  132  and  133  of  the  present  School  Act  (Kurd's  Re- 
vised Illinois  Statutes,  1913)  for  which  new  sections  containing  the  foregoing 
provisions  shall  be  substituted. 

(VI)     It  shall  be  the  duty  of  the  board: 

a.  To  organize,  maintain  'and  control  a  free  system  of  public  education 
and  report  annually  or  oftener  to  the  people  the  results;  provided,  that  such 
free  system  of  public  education  shall  be  for  all  the  people  without  discrimina- 
tion against  any  class; 

"b.  To  legislate  for  the  city  on  all  school  questions,  to  inspect  the  results 
of  its  policies  and  control  and  to  exercise  custody  of  such  of  the  property  and 
moneys  of  the  city  as  are  for  school  purposes  and  such  as  belong  to  the 
school  fund; 

c.  To  enact  by  ordinance  an  Administrative  Code  to  govern  the  education 
system,  which  shall  define  the  functions,  powers  and  duties  of  the   General 
Superintendent  of  Schools,  his  assistants,  teachers  and  other  employes; 

d.  To  appoint  a  General  Superintendent  of  Schools  to  whom  shall  be 
delegated    by    ordinance   power    to    organize   and    administer   the    education 
system; 

NEW  POWERS  FOR  SUPERINTENDENT. 

e.  By  ordinance  in  the  Administrative  Code,  to  invest  authority  in  and 
impose   the    duty   upon   the    General    Superintendent    of    Schools,    subject    to 


6 

approval  by  the  Board  of  Education,  to  initiate  courses  of  study,  choice  of 
textbooks,  supplies  and  equipment,  appointment,  dismissal  and  disciplining 
of  all  employes  who  are  not  under  civil  service  and  preparation  of  the  annual 
•budget  and  of  building  plans;  provided  that  he  shall  consult  with  the  trained 
educators  of  his  staff  on  all  questions  of  courses  of  study  and  textbooks, 
making  of  permanent  public  record  the  recommendations  (althcagh  not  bound 
by  them)  of  each  group  including  all  groups  of  teachers  concerned  in  the 
courses  of  study  or  textbooks  under  consideration;  and  provided,  further, 
that  he  may  refer  to  the  education  staff  any  other  questions  of  school  policy 
at  his  discretion; 

f.  To  provide  by  ordinance  for  the  organizing  of  self-governing  councils 
of  supervisory  officials,  principals  and  teachers,  consisting  of  representatives- 
chosen  by  all  members  of  each  group;  provided,  that  in  addition  to  the  duty 
of  recommending  concerning  questions   of  policy   submitted  by   the   general 
superintendent  of  schools,  the  councils  may  initiate  recommendations  of  school 
policy  to  the  Superintendent; 

g.  To    establish    by    ordinance    standardized    salary    schedule    for    all 
employes; 

(VII)  Eepeal  Section  134  of  the  present  School  Act  (Kurd's  Eevised  Illinoi? 
Statutes,  1913),  for  which  the  foregoing  section  is  to  be  substituted. 

COUNCIL  TO  SURRENDER  SCHOOL  POWERS. 

(VIII)  All  of  the  powers  of  the  Board  shall  be  its  own  powers  independent 
of  the  City  Council  except  as  to  the  levying  and  collection  of  needed  taxes.    None 
of  the  powers  of  the  Board  shall  be  exercised  except  in  public  meetings  of  the 
Board.    Eecords  of  the  education  system  shall  be  public  records. 

(IX)  The  Board  shall  elect  a  chairman  who  shall  preside  at  all  its  meetings, 

(X)  Eepeal  Section  130  of  the  present  School  Law  (Kurd's  Eevised  Illinois 
Statutes,  1913)  thereby  abolishing  the  statutory  requirements  to  elect  a  secretary 
and  a  president. 

(XI)  Eepeal  Section  139  of  the  present  School  Law  (Kurd's  Eevised  Illinois 
Statutes,  1913),  which  provides  that  the  City  Council  shall  not  exercise  the  powers 
of  the  Board  and  which  is  unnecessary  under  the  proposed  plan  which  gives  the 
Board  exclusive  powers  of  self-government  free  of  financial  or  other  control  or 
interference  by  the  City  Council. 

(XII)  Amend  first  paragraph  of  Section  61   of  the  Cities  and  Villages  Act 
(Kurd's   Eevised   Illinois    Statutes    1913),'   only    if   necessary,   to    limit    the    City 
Council's  control  of  the  finances  and  property  of  the  city  so  that   it  shall  not 
include  the  finances  and  property  which  are  for  school  purposes. 

(XIII)  All  'employes  of  the  Board  of  Education  except  the  education  staff 
shall  be  under  civil  service  administered  by  a  civil  service  commissioner  appointed 
by  the  Board  of  Education. 

(XIV)  Teachers  shall  be  appointed  from  year  to  year  for  a  probationary 
period  of  three  years,  after  which  they  shall  be  removed  only  for  cause  following 
a  full  hearing;  or  for  inefficiency  or  neglect  of  duty  after  notice  of  unsatisfactory 
service  and  opportunity  to  improve  their  work.     On  the  charge  of  inefficiency  or 
neglect  of  duty,   after  notice   and   opportunity  to  improve,  the   decision   of   the 
Board  shall  not  be  subject  to  review  by  the  courts;  provided,  however,  that  such 
decision  shall  be  based  upon  the  written,  detailed  recommendation  of  the  general 
superintendent  of  schools  and  upon  the  teacher's  answer,  which  recommendation 
shall  be  filed  simultaneously  with  the  Board  and  with  the  teacher  against  whom 
the  charge  is  made,  at  least  thirty  days  before  a  decision  by  the  Board;    and 
provided,  further,  that  the  teacher  shall  have  opportunity  to  answer  in  writing 
and  shall  have  the  right  to  cause  publication  of  the  recommendation  and  answer 
within  the  said  thirty  days. 

3.  That  the  Board  of  Education  devote  its  attention  more  to  consideration 
of  broad  policies  of  general  application  and  devote  less  time  to  deciding  small 
details  of  specific  application.  The  habit  of  boards  for  many  years  has  been  the 
reverse  of  this  recommendation. 


4.  That  the  Board   of  Education  make  use   of   its  power   numbered  six  in 
Section    133    of   the   school   act   " generally   to   have    and   possess    all    the   rights, 
powers  and  authority  required  for  the  proper  management  of  schools,  with  power 
to   enact   such  ordinances  as  may  be   deemed  necessary  and  expedient   for   such 
purpose,"  and  enact  by  ordinance,  which  cannot  be  temporarily  suspended  as  can 
its  rules,  an  administrative  code,  denning  the  powers,  duties  and  functions  of  its 
officers  and  employes  and  of  itself;  that  it  proceed  to  do  this  at  once. 

ABOLITION  OF  STANDING  COMMITTEES. 

5.  That,  if  the  Legislature  shall  give  Chicago  a  new  school  law  reducing  the 
size  of  the  Board  as  requested,  the  Board  then  abolish  all  standing  committees, 
in  accordance  with  the  opinions  of  a  large  majority  of  the  educational  experts 
of  the  country,  as  a' measure  to  prevent  interference  with  the  administrative  work 
of  the  Superintendent  of  Schools. 

6.  That    a    budget    system    be    established   which    shall   place    the    detailed 
estimates  for  all  expenditures  in  a  single  budget  instead  of  in  two  separate  ones 
as  now,  the  budget  to  be  prepared  by  the  Superintendent  of  Schools  before  the 
tax  levy  rather  than  afterwards. 

7.  That  the  Board  abandon  the  practice  of  electing  annually  its  Superintend- 
ent. 

8.  Establishment    of   health   inspection    independently    of    the    City    Health 
Department  and  in  connection  with  hygiene  instruction. 

9.  Greater  co-operation  with  the  public  library  and  development  to  the  fullest 
extent  of  this  splendid  agency  for  aiding  the  work  of  the  schools. 

10.  Appointment  of  a  system  of  accredited  advisory  committees  to  voice,  for 
the  aid  of  the  Board,  the  special  educational  interests  of  the  various  constituent 
social  groups  or  classes  of  which  the  city  is  composed. 

11.  That  a  representative  commission  be  appointed  to   conduct   a  thorough 
and  expert  study  of  Chicago's  needs  for  vocational  education. 

12.  Continuation   and   development   of  the  policy  of  the  present   Board   of 
Education  of  establishing  community  centers  generally  throughout  the  city. 

13.  That  the  Board  take  steps  before  the  Legislature  to  secure  more  funds 
for   current   expenditure  to  permit  the  scope  of  its  work  to  be   enlarged   to  fit 
modern   eduactional  methods,   even  to   the   extent   of  reversing   its   tax   arrange- 
ment and  reducing  the  amount  available  for  buildings  and  which  never  is  levied 
to  the  limit,  to  secure  a  corresponding  increase  of  the  tax  available  for  educational 
purposes. 

14.  That   the  Board  place  more   emphasis   on  instruction   in   the   duties   of 
citizenship   and  patriotism,  to   the   end  that  our  boys   and   girls   will  leave   our 
public  schools  imbued  with  love  of  flag  and  country,  of  democracy  and  justice 
and  able  to  approach  the  problems  of  self-government  with  understanding   and 
inspiration. 

15.  The   committee  has  recommended  that  the   Council  be   stripped   of  any 
and  all  functions  and  control  with  reference  to  school  matters,  also  that  activities 
in  all  departments  be  separated  from  corresponding  activities  in  the  city  depart- 
ments.    These  recommendations  are  made  on  the  basis  of  the  present  scheme  of 

,  organization  of  our  city  government.  The  abolition  of  Council  financial  control 
in  school  matters  must  be  done  by  legislation  and  this  recommendation  is  embodied 
in  the  various  sections  of  proposed  school  law  amendment.  If  this  legislation  is 
not  passed  and  the  Council  still  is  required  to  exercise  financial  control,  the  com- 
mittee recommends  that  in  that  event  the  Council  require  a  detailed  budget  from 
the  Board  of  Education  before  levying  a  tax  or  appropriating  money  for  school 
purposes. 

ADMINISTRATIVE  CODE  UNDER  PRESENT  LAW. 

16.  That  the  administrative  code   enacted  by  the  Board  by  ordinance   re- 
organize the  school  system  along  the  following  lines: 

a.  Abolish   the    dual   system    of   organization    and    establish    a    general 
Superintendent  of  Schools  at  the  head  of  the  entire  system,  with  the  adminis- 
trative as  well  as  the  education  department  under  his  management. 

b.  Define  by  ordinance  his  functions,  powers  and  duties,  conferring  upon 
him  authority  to  select  (subject  to  appointment  by  the  Board)   an  associate 


superintendent  in  charge  of  business  affairs,  an  associate  superintendent  in 
charge  of  health  inspection  and  instruction  and  such  other  associate  and  dis- 
trict superintendents  and  department  and  bureau  heads  as  may  be  necessary. 
He  should  have  a  salary  of  not  less  than  $10,000  a  year,  should  be  the  best 
educational  expert  available  in  the  United  States  and  should  be  a  citizen 
of  the  United  States. 

c.  The  general  superintendent  should  have  authority  and  the  duty  to 
initiate  courses  of  study  and  choice  of  textbooks  after  consultation  with  such 
portions  of  the  teaching  staff  as  are  concerned  in  the  courses  of  study  or 
textbooks  under  consideration. 

d.  Teachers'  councils  should  be  created  strictly  according  to  the  plan 
outlined  in  No.  Vlf  of  the  recommendations  for  state  legislation  contained  in 
this  report. 

e.  The  general  superintendent  should  have  authority  and  the  duty  to 
initiate  appointment,  subject  to  existing  civil  service  regulations,  of  all  em- 
ployes including  teachers,  the  re-election   of  teachers   during  the   period   of 
probation  and  the  dismissal  or  disciplining  of  all  employes,  subject  to  the 
approval  of  the  Board. 

f.  The  Board  should  establish  standardized  salary  schedules  by  ordinance. 

g.  With  reference  to  courses  of  study,  choice  of  textbooks  and  appoint- 
ment, dismissal  and  disciplining  of  employes,  the  Board  should  retain  only 
the  right  to  confirm  or  reject  the  recommendations  of  the  general  superin- 
tendent; in  case  of  rejection,  returning  these  matters  to  him  for  new  recom- 
mendations. 

METHODS  TO  MEASURE  EFFICIENCY. 

h.  The  Superintendent  should  be  required  by  ordinance  to  devise  methods 
for  measuring  the  efficiency  of  the  schools  and  the  Board  should,  upon  his 
recommending  efficient  methods,  establish  the  necessary  machinery  by  ordi- 
nance. The  Superintendent  should  be  required  to  make  reports  annually  or 
more  frequently  on  the  educational  efficiency  of  the  schools,  based  on  the 
most  modern  methods  of  measuring  such  efficiency.  These  reports  should 
include  statistics  and  analysis  of  nonpromotions. 

i.  The  Superintendent  should  devise  and  the  Board  adopt  by  ordinance, 
a  supervisory  organization  over  the  teachers  that  shall  furnish  personal  contact 
and  mutual  encouragement  and  inspiration  between  the  superintendents  and 
teachers,  a  cardinal  principle  of  which  should  be  that  no  criticism  of  a 
teacher's  or  principal's  work  should  be  made  without,  in  the  document  that 
records  it,  a  recommendation  of  how  to  overcome  the  fault. 

j.  The  Superintendent  should  devise  and  the  Board  should  adopt  by 
ordinance  a  standard  for  recording  the  efficiency  of  teachers  which  should 
furnish  a  permanent  record  to  which  the  teacher  should  have  access  with 
freedom  to  discuss  the  markings  with  the  supervisory  official  who  gave  the 
mark. 

k.  The  general  superintendent  should  have  power  to  transfer  teacher? 
without  reference  to  the  Board  except  upon  appeal  by  a  teacher. 

In  accordance  with  the  foregoing  recommendations  for  new  legislation,  the 
committee  recommends  the  adoption  of  the  following  order: 

Ordered,  That  the  Committee  on  Schools,  Fire,  Police  and  Civil  Service 
prepare  and  submit  to  the  Council  for  its  approval  drafts  of  a  bill  or  bill? 
embodying  the  proposed  amendments  to  the  school  law.  And  be  it  further 

Ordered,  That  any  Bill  or  Bills  submitted  to  the  City  Council  covering  thi? 
subject  shall  provide  for  a  referendum  by  the  people  of  the  City  of  Chicago. 

We  transmit  herewith  a  stenographic  report  of  the  hearings  of  the  committee, 
together  with  a  bibliography  of  the  most  recent  and  reliable  publications  on 
school  organization  and  administration,  brought  to  the  attention  of  the  committee 
by  the  educators  who  contributed  their  co-operation;  and  other  documents  related 
to  the  investigation. 

Respectfully  submitted, 

(Signed)     EGBERT  M.  BUCK, 

Acting  Chairman. 


TESTIMONY  OF  EXPERTS. 


Stenographic  report  of  appearance  of  educators  before  the 

committee : 

MR.  BEN  BLEWETT, 

Superintendent  of  Public  Instruction,  St.  Louis,  Mo. 

Mr.  Blewett  appeared  October  14,  1916. 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Chairman,  the  sub-committee  that  has  had  in  charge  the 
preparation  of  a  program  for  the  hearing  now  in  progress,  adopted  during  the 
summer  months,  a  policy  of  trying  to  bring  to  the  attention  of  the  committee  the 
fundamental  things  that  are  at  fault  in  our  school  system. 

The  sub-committee  thought  that  perhaps  the  committee  would  want  to 
recommend  a  complete  program  of  legislation,  so  that  while  we  have  this  situa- 
tion, with  pressure  of  public  opinion,  we  could  cure  as  many  as  possible  of  the 
ills  that  center  in  the  school  law. 

With  that  in  mind  your  sub-committee  asked  two  of  America's  well  known 
educators  here  in  Chicago  to  co-operate  with  us — Professors  Judd  and  Mead  of 
the  University  of  Chicago — and  the  subject  was  canvassed  as  to  how  we  could 
get  the  information  before  the  committee  as  to  what  other  cities  were  doing 
who  have  struggled  with  these  problems.  Some  of  the  cities  have  mastered  them 
at  least  in  part;  and  so  finally  the  sub-committee  invited  several  widely  known 
educational  experts  from  various  sections  of  the  country  to  come  here.  With 
splendid  public  spirit  a  number  of  these  gentlemen  have  responded. 

We  have  with  us  today  Mr.  Ben  Blewett,  the  first  of  these  experts  to  be 
presented  to  the  committee,  superintendent  of  instruction  of  St.  Louis,  Missouri. 
St.  Louis  has  perhaps  the  most  complete  school  charter  of  any  large  city  in  the 
country  at  the  present  time,  under  the  provisions  of  which  they  have  worked 
out  to  more  satisfaction  than  perhaps  any  other  city  of  its  size  many  of  the 
problems  that  we  are  struggling  with  here;  St.  Louis  has  also  a  very  highly 
efficient  and  harmonious  school  organization — the  teaching  force.  Mr.  Blewett 
has  consented  to  discuss  these  two  propositions  for  us  in  the  order  in  which  I  have 
named  them,  first,  to  outline  the  provisions  of  the  St.  Louis  school  charter,  and, 
second,  the  organization  of  the  teaching  force  of  St.  Louis  and  how  it  is  kept 
efficient  and  harmonious. 

ST.  LOUIS  SCHOOL  CHARTER. 

Mr.  Blewett:  Mr.  Chairman  and  gentlemen,  I  had  not  expected  to  do  other 
than  answer  questions  this  morning,  getting  right  at  the  things  that  concern  the 
City  of  Chicago  and  your  committee.  I  shall,  however,  endeavor  to  follow  the 
suggestion  of  Mr.  Buck,  and  I  shall  ask  you  to  interrupt  me  if  you  choose  to  do  it. 

I  realize  that  I  have  a  great  opportunity  here  in  trying  to  be  of  service  to 
what  I  believe  is  the  greatest  institution  of  the  second  city  of  our  nation.  I  do 
not  believe  that  there  is  any  institution  that  Chicago  or  any  other  great  city  holds 
in  such  dear  regard  as  its  public  school  system,  and  it  is  entirely  natural  that  in 
the  management  of  a  great  institution  of  this  kind,  with  all  the  varied 
interests  that  are  involved  in  it,  that  difficulties  should  arise.  It  seems  to  me 
quite  as  evident,  out  of  experience,  that  there  are  no  reasons  why  these  difficulties 
should  not  be  composed  and  why  a  great  school  system  in  any  of  our  great  cities 
might  not  be  managed  for  the  comfort  of  all  those  engaged  in  the  work  to  the  end 
that  we  may  efficiently  educate  our  young  people.  May  I  now,  as  suggested  by 
the  chairman,  tell  you  of  the  charter  under  which  the  public  schools  of  St.  Louis 
work? 

St.  Louis  had  troubles  of  its  own,  you  can  readily  imagine,  and  19  years  ago 
those  troubles  had  become  so  acute  that  it  was  necessary  for  the  people  of  the  city 
to  get  together  in  a  concerted  endeavor  to  better  the  situation.  They  went  be- 
fore the  state  legislature  with  a  charter  that  had  been  prepared  by  men  of  long 
experience  in  actual  connection  with  the  school  work  and  men  of  large  experience 


10 

in  affairs  generally.  The  charter  was  adopted  and  put  into  force  in  1897  and 
our- institution  has  been  working  under  that  charter  since.  I  believe  it  will  be 
generally  admitted  as  a  fact  that  after  the  initial  troubles  of  the  introduction 
of  the  work  under  that  charter  we  have  moved  along  to  a  better  efficiency  in  the 
administration  of  the  schools  and  have  accomplished  the  things  very  well  that 
I  said  a  moment  or  two  ago  we  ought  to  attempt  to  accomplish. 

FUNCTIONS  AND  DUTIES  DEFINED. 

The  charter  places  the  complete  control  of  the  schools  in  the  Board  of 
Education, — as  the  title  reads,  "In  the  Board  of  Education  and  Superintendent 
of  Instruction,  and  a  Commissioner  of  School  Buildings."  It  was,  of  course  I 
presume  you  will  understand,  granted  by  the  state  legislature,  so  that  the  board  is 
working  under  a  statute  provision.  The  charter  defines  certain  officers,  certain 
departments,  and  names  by  title  these  officers  and  specifically  outlines  their  powers 
and  their  responsibilities.  In  these  different  departments  the  officer  has  com- 
plete initiation  in  anything  that  refers  to  his  department.  This  holds  in  the 
instruction  department  and  all  that  touches  it,  applying  to  even  such  things  as 
supplies  that  pertain  to  the  work  of  instruction. 

In  the  building  department  it  places  complete  initiative  in  the  hands  of  the 
commissioner  of  school  buildings,  and  in  the  commissioner  of  school  supplies  it 
places  complete  initiative  in  the  work  that  pertains  to  his  department.  Of  course 
the  board  has  veto  power  upon  any  recommendation  that  either  of  these  officers 
may  make.  The  board  itself  may,  under  the  provisions  of  the  charter,  levy  a 
tax  to  the  maximum  amount  of  6  mills,  or  as  you  probably  will  be  familiar 
with  it,  60  cents.  This  tax  money  is  collected  by  the  city  collector  and  is  paid 
over  to  the  treasurer  of  the  board  of  education. 

PREPARATION  OF  ST.  LOUIS  BUDGET. 

At  the  end  of  the  school  year,  looking  forward  to  the  coming  school  year, 
the  board  requires  of  the  heads  of  departments  estimates  of  their  needs  for  the 
following  year  and  then  the  joint  committee  of  instruction  and  finance  goes  over 
these  recommendations  of  the  heads  of  departments  and  does  what  the  committees 
may  feel  could  be  done  in  recognition  of  the  request.  When  these  appropriations 
have  been  agreed  upon  and  made  in  that  committee,  the  heads  of  the 
department  are  instructed  and  are  required,  in  the  administration  of  their  work 
for  the  coming  year,  to  keep  within  those  appropriations;  they  have  no  power 
to  expend  money  outside  of  those  appropriations.  There  is  always  an  unappropri- 
ated balance  held  at  the  disposal  of  the  board  to  meet  emergencies  that  may 
come  up,  and  if  a  head  of  a  department  has  an  emergency  that  he  wants  to  present 
it  is  presented  and  if  the  request  is  approved  by  the  board  the  additional  allow- 
ance is  made. 

BOARD  IS  ELECTED  AT  LARGE. 

The  board  divides  itself  into  four  important  committees,  consisting  of  three 
members  each.  The  board  itself  consists  of  12  members  elected  at  large  by  the 
city.  May  I  say  that  by  what  is  called  "a  gentleman's  agreement "  that  has 
prevailed  for  all  of  these  years,  with  rare  exception,  that  the  parties  have 
agreed  that  the  board  shall  be  bi-partisan  in  politics.  The  term  of  the  mem- 
bers of  the  board  is  six  years,  and  four  members  are  elected  by  the  two  great 
parties.  It  is  the  practice  of  the  two  great  parties  in  making  their  nomina- 
tions to  put  up  four  men,  four  republicans  and  four  democrats,  but  the  committees 
get  together  before  the  election  and  agree  that  two  of  the  names  of  democrats 
shall  be  taken  off  and  the  names  of  two  republicans  shall  be  taken  off,  so  that 
the  ballot  has  gone  through  all  these  years,  with  the  rare  exception  I  speak 
of,  to  the  people  with  two  republicans  and  two  democrats  named.  It  is  my  candid 
belief  from  many  years  of  experience  with  the  work  that  the  question  of  politics 
does  not  come  at  all  into  the  administration  of  school  affairs.  This  is  an  ideal 
to  which  the  city  has  become  devoted,  and  I  think  that  any  man  or  woman  in  the 
city  of  St.  Louis  who  would  suggest  a  departure  from  the  custom  would  imme- 
diately draw  down  popular  censure  upon  himself  or  herself. 


11 

ORGANIZATION  OF  ST.  LOUIS  BOARD. 

The  committee  on  instruction  consists  of  three  members;  the  committee 
on  finance  of  three  members;  the  committee  on  buildings  of  thr^e  members,  and 
the  committee  on  supplies  of  three  members.  The  president  of  the  board  is  elected 
by  the  board  annually.  He  appoints  these  committees  annually,  and  each  com- 
mittee is  the  advisory  and  controlling  committee  of  the  board  touching  that  de- 
partment. By  control  I  do  not  mean  tha.t  they  have  any  legislative  authority  what- 
ever, but  the  officer  of  that  department  makes  his  report  to  the  committee,  which 
sits  only  once  a  month,  and  that  committee  approves  or  disapproves  the  recom- 
mendation and-  makes  report  to  the  board  at  the  following  meeting  of  its  approval 
or  disapproval  of  the  recommendation  of  the  officer;  but  the  committee  itself 
has  no  authority  to  initiate  any  legislation  or  to  initiate  any  act  pertaining  to 
the  schools  at  all. 

The  report  of  the  officer  and  the  report  of  the  committee  are  put  in  galley 
form  and  are  sent  to  all  the  members  of  the  board  some  two  or  three  days  before 
the  meeting  of  the  board  of  education,  so  that  each  member  has  an  opportunity 
to  canvass  carefully  and  minutely  every  suggestion  that  is  made  and  comes  up 
for  action  at  the  meeting  of  the  board.  The  committee  meetings  last  through 
two  or  three  hours  of  discussion  and  the  members  follow  with  minute  care  the 
points  that  are  brought  out. 

While  the  committee  of  three  conducts  the  business,  in  most  instances  the 
majority  or  the  whole  of  the  board  is  in  attendance  as  listeners  and  as  coun- 
sellors at  times.  The  committees'  reports  go  before  the  board  at  a  subsequent 
meeting,  and  the  usual  course  is  that  the  board's  entire  business — and  you  can 
imagine  that  it  would  be  a  large  business,  the  board  only  meeting  once  a  month — 
is  transacted  in  from  15  to  30  minutes;  but  all  of  the  work  has  been  previously 
canvassed  in  the  way  I  have  pointed  out. 


SUPERINTENDENT  RECOMMENDS  TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Buck,  I  hope  if  I  am  not  proceeding  in  the  line  of  information  that  you 
want  that  you  will  just  stop  me  and  ask  questions.  It  may  be,  and  I  think  it  will 
be,  of  interest  to  the  gentlemen  to  have  me  state  the  minute  workings  of  the 
department  with  which  I  am  immediately  connected.  I  have  suggested  what 
authority  the  statute  gives  the  superintendent.  Under  the  statute  the  superin- 
tendent has  the  sole  nomination  of  teachers.  Neither  a  member  of  the  board,  a 
committee  of  the  board,  nor  the  board  itself  can  nominate  a  teacher,  nor  can  a 
committee  of  the  board  nor  a  member  of  the  board,  nor  the  board  itself  dismiss 
a  teacher.  All  of  that  responsibility  and  authority  is  placed  upon  the  shoulders 
of  the  superintendent;  so  that  should  a  condition  arise  in  any  one  of  the  schools 
that  was  evidently  wrong  the  superintendent  cannot  hide  behind  a  committee 
or  the  board  itself  and  say  "If  I  had  been  left  alone  things  would  have  been 
different. "  The  board  can  say  "You  have  the  authority,  you  have  the  entire 
authority  of  initiative  and  if  things  are  not  right  you  are  responsible  for  it.'7 

I  presume  you  gentlemen  are  familiar  with  the  complications  in  school  systems 
that  come  up  from  such  questions  as  text  books.  You  know  how  important  a 
part  it  has  played  in  great  city  school  administrations,  and  in  small  city  school 
administrations,  and  in  town  and  district  administrations.  You  know  the  things 
that  have  been  said,  some  true  and  some  untrue,  in  regard  to  that.  The  law  and 
the  rule  of  the  board,  following  the  fundamental  provisions  of  the  law,  places 
upon  the  superintendent  the  responsibility  of  the  recommendation  for  any  text 
book  or  any  supply  that  is  to  be  used  in  connection  with  the  work  of  instruc- 
tion, and  if  there  is  any  text  there  that  is  not  right,  or  if  there  is  any  supply 
there  that  in  its  adaptation  to  the  work  of  the  school  is  not  right,  or  anything 
questionable,  the  superintendent  of  instruction  is  made  responsible  for  it.  This 
not  only  is  the  law,  but  it  has  been  the  practice  under  the  law  through  these 
years,  and  the  observance  of  this  provision  of  law  has  been  one  of  the  things 
that  has  made  possible  a  smooth  administration  of  the  schools, 


12 

THINGS    THE    BOARD   MAY   NOT    INITIATE. 

Alderman  Buck:  Let  me  interrupt,  to  emphasize  that  point.  The  Board  of 
Education  is  not  permitted  under  the  charter  to  recommend  teachers,  nor  to 
recommend  the  dismissal  of  teachers,  nor  to  select,  nor  to  initiate  the  selection 
of  text  books,  that  is,  to  make  recommendations,  nor  to  recommend  courses  of 
study,  but  they  can  only  pass  on  those  questions  after  they  have  been  started 
by  the  proper  department  heads? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Of  course  every  act  of  an  officer  is  subject  to  veto  by  the 
board  and  is  vetoed  if  the  board  thinks  it  should  be. 

Alderman  Buck:  If  the  superintendent  designs  one  course  of  study  and  sub- 
mits it  to  the  board,  or  one  text  book,  and  the  board  rejects  that,  can  the  board 
submit  another  to  the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  cannot.  The  superintendent  would  have  to  come  back  with 
another  recommendation.  The  initiation  is  actually  in  the  hands  of  the  super- 
intendent. 

I  do  not  know  how  much  it  will  suit  your  purpose  to  have  me  go  into  the 
details  of  the  employment  of  teachers,  regarding  their  efficiency  or  the  reports 
upon  inefficiency  and  upon  dismissal.  If  those  matters  are  of  vital  interest 
to  you  I  shall  be  glad  to  tell  them. 

Alderman  Buck :  Very  much,  if  we  might  hold  those  until  we  finish  the  whole 
question  of  the  relations  of  the  superintendent,  the  tenure  of  the  superintendent 
and  manner  of  his  selection  and  so  on. 

FOUR-YEAR  TERM  FOR  SUPERINTENDENT. 

Mr.  Blewett:  The  superintendent  is  selected  by  the  board  of  education  for 
a  term  of  four  years.  Under  the  provisions  of  the  law  his  salary  cannot  be  de- 
creased during  the  time  of  his  term  of  office,  and  under  the  rules  of  the  board 
it  can  be  neither  decreased  nor  increased.  The  superintendent,  as  any  public 
officer  ought  to  be,  is  subject  to  dismissal  by  the  board  if  there  is  reason  for  his 
dismissal.  He  is  held  in  the  spot  light,  of  course,  of  public  attention,  as  he  ought 
to  be.  He  would  not  last  very  long  if  he  did  not  try  to  do  right. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  is  the  method  of  getting  rid  of  a  superintendent  if 
he  does  not  behave  himself? 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  have  never  seen  it  tried  there.  I  will  say  this,  at  the  be- 
ginning of  this  great  work  in  St.  Louis  it  was  under  the  administration  of  Dr. 
Soldan,  one  of  our  great  educators,  and  it  was  to  his  tact  and  power,  and  to  the 
wisdom  of  the  board  of  education  that  was  first  elected  by  the  people,  that  the 
provisions  of  the  charter  were  started  right.  I  presume  the  gentlemen  here  would 
agree  with  me  that  it  does  not  make  any  difference  how  exactly  right  a  statute 
may  be  or  a  charter  may  be,  unless  those  who  are  charged  with  the  administra- 
tion of  the  charter  are  competent  and  honest,  the  thing  will  go  to  pieces,  and 
St.  Louis  was  fortunate  in  having  as  its  superintendent  at  the  initiation  of  this 
work  Dr.  Soldan  and  a  group  of  great  men  on  its  Board  of  Education. 

Alderman  Powers:     Are  your  teachers  under  civil  service? 

Mr.  Blewett:  They  are  not,  I  presume,  in  what  you  might  think  was  the 
best  way. 

Alderman  Buck:     What  is  the   salary  of  the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Blewett:     Eight  thousand  dollars. 

Alderman  Buck:  Is  there  anything  in  the  charter  to  provide  the  manner  in 
which  he  shall  be  elected  by  the  board? 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  just  provides  that  the  board  shall  elect  him;  no  limitation 
upon  the  board. 

Alderman  Buck:  Is  a  method  set  forth  for  the  disciplining  of  a  superintendent 
against  whom  there  may  be  charges? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  only  it  provides  that  any  citizen  may  bring  the  board 
of  education  into  court  to  answer  for  any  unsatisfactory  situation  in  the  school 
administration. 

Alderman  Buck:  You  have  said  something  about  the  manner  in  which  the 
budget  is  prepared;  you  have  an  annual  budget,  have  you? 

Mr.  Blewett:     Yes,  sir. 


13 

Alderman  Buck:  Can  you  go  into  detail  a  little  more  with  respect  to  that, 
bearing  in  mind  that  we  have  here  a  separate  fund,  one  for  educational  purposes 
and  one  for  building  purposes  and  that  our  school  board  attempts  to  make  a 
budget  for  each  fund? 

BOAED  FINANCIALLY  INDEPENDENT. 

Mr.  Blewett:  All  of  the  school  moneys  as  I  have  said  are  in  the  hands  of 
the  board  of  education.  They  are  not  under  the  necessity  of  going  to  another 
municipal  body  to  make  requests  for  money  for  the  maintenance  of  the  schools 
or  for  any  other  purpose,  so  that  the  money  is  under  the  board's  complete  control. 
I  have  to  go  into  my  committee  with  a  detailed  statement  showing  what  moneys 
will  be  needed  for  principals,  what  moneys  will  be  needed  for  assistant  teachers, 
what  moneys  will  be  needed  in  all  of  the  different  departments  of  my  work.  The 
building  commissioner  has  to  do  the  same  thing;  the  supply  commissioner  the 
same  thing,  and  so  far  as  he  is  in  need  of  a  budget  the  auditor  would  have 
to  do  the  same  thing. 

Alderman  Buck:  Are  there  any  department  heads  except  the  three  you  have 
mentioned? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Four,  the  secretary  and  treasurer  in  addition  to  those  already 
named.  He  is  at  the  head  of  the  finance  department,  but,  of  course,  he  has  to 
make  the  same  kind  of  a  detailed  request. 

Alderman  Buck:    Is  his  position  provided  for  in  the  statute? 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  is;  and  also  the  commissioner  of  supplies  and  the  commis- 
sioner of  school  buildings. 

Alderman  Buck:     Are  they  all  elected? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Only  by  the  board,  in  the  same  manner  as  the  superintendent 
is  elected. 

Alderman  Buck:  Their  relations  in  their  departments  are  the  same  as  those 
of  the  superintendent  to  the  board? 

Mr.  Blewett:     In  general. 

Alderman  Buck:     They  have  the  initiative  and  so  on. 

Mr.  Blewett:  They  have,  for  instance  the  commissioner  of  buildings  has 
absolute  authority  to  dismiss  a  janitor  without  having  to  make  recommendation 
to  the  board;  the  board  does  not  review  his  work. 

Alderman  Buck:  Has  the  superintendent  of  schools  that  power  over  the 
teachers? 

METHOD  OF  RE-ELECTING  TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Blewett:  No.  The  teachers  are  appointed  annually,  and  at  the  end  of 
the  year  he  reports  the  entire  body  of  teachers  as  reappointed,  with  the  excep- 
tion of  those  whom  he  cannot  recommend  and  does  not  recommend.  Then  the 
board  cannot  place  those  teachers  that  the  superintendent  does  not  recommend 
upon  the  list,  but  can  refuse  to  approve  of  his  recommendation  for  reappoint- 
ment.  The  board  safeguards  its  right  in  that  particular  by  requiring  of  the 
superintendent  that  his  recommendations  for  reappointment  shall  be  made  in  May 
and  shall  lie  over  until  the  June  meeting,  giving  the  board  a  month's  time  to 
review  his  recommendation  and  to  disclose  any  defects  in  it. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  the  commissioner  of  supplies  and  the  secretary- treasurer 
have  the  same  power  that  the  commissioner  of  buildings  has  over  the  employment 
of  janitors,  as  to  employes  in  their  department? 

Mr.  Blewett:     They  have. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  are  the  relations  of  these  department  heads  to  each 
other? 

SUPERINTENDENT  INITIATES  BUILDING  PROJECTS. 

Mr.  Blewett:  They  are  independent  in  all  matters  that  pertain  solely  to 
the  departments,  if  such  a  thing  is  possible,  or  as  near  as  such  a  thing  is  possible. 
Their  work  must  necessarily  connect  up  closely  with  the  work  of  the  school  sys- 
tem. For  instance,  no  building  can  be  initiated  except  by  the  recommendation 
of  the  superintendent  of  instruction.  No  committee  will  come  in  and  recom- 


14 

mend  that  a  building  be  located  here  or  a  site  be  purchased  there.  That  recom- 
mendation for  the  building  has  to  be  made  by  the  superintendent,  and  he  has  to 
show  the  actual  needs  for  that  building.  That  is  provided  for  by  the  rules  of 
the  board. 

Alderman  Buck:     But  not  by  law. 

Mr.  Blewett:     Not  by  law. 

Alderman  Buck:  Does  the  law  make  any  provision  as  to  how  a  new  building 
shall  be  equipped,  the  charter  itself? 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  throws  upon  the  superintendent  and  gives  him  the  authority 
to  make  that  recommendation  initially.  It  makes  it  his  duty,  yes  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:  The  commissioner  of  buildings  cannot  initiate  a  proceeding 
for  a  new  building  without  the  approval  of  the  superintendent  of  instruction. 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  he  cannot,  nor  can  a  member  of  the  board  nor  a  committee 
of  the  board,  nor  can  the  board  itself. 

Alderman    Miller:      Without    the    recommendation    of    the    superintendent? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Bight.  The  rules  of  the  board  provide  further  that,  if  any 
material  alteration  of  the  building  is  necessary,  the  recommendation  shall  pro- 
ceed initially  from  the  superintendent  of  instruction. 

Alderman  Buck:  With  reference  to  the  care  of  buildings  by  janitors  and 
engineers,  has  the  superintendent  of  instruction  any  authority  or  any  responsibili- 
ties for  that? 

Mr.  Blewett:     He  has  not. 

Alderman  Buck:  Another  subject  that  we  are  interested  in  here  is  the  method 
for  having  the  engineering  and  janitor  service  performed  in  the  schools,  what  is 
the  arrangement  there,  is  it  done  by  contract  or  are  the  engineers  paid  as  they 
are  here,  by  the  cubic  foot,  and  permitted  to  employ  their  own  help,  or  are  all  of 
the  employes  hired  directly  by  the  board? 

JANITORS  UNDER  CIVIL  SERVICE. 

,Mr.  Blewett:  All  of  them  are  employed  directly  by  the  board  and  under 
regulations  of  the  board,  which  are  observed  by  the  commissioner.  An  examina- 
tion is  made  for  all  of  these  positions,  an  examination,  that  is  a  suitable  test  of 
their  proficiency  or  fitness  for  the  work  they  are  to  undertake,  and  that  eligible 
list  is  reported  to  the  board  of  education  as  a  matter  of  its  records  in  its  printed 
proceeding,  and  the  commissioner  has  to  make  his  selection  for  these  positions 
from  it.  A  man  who  is  put  in  charge  of  the  heating  plant  has  to  be  selected 
from  a  group  that  has  been  passed  upon,  and  the  commissioner  has  to  take  the 
men  in  the  order  of  their  rank  in  examination.  He  has  to  select  the  men  out  of 
the  group  as  he  thinks  a  man  will  fit  the  particular  position  best.  The  only  ap- 
pointments under  the  building  commissioner  that  are  not  under  that  kind  of  civil 
service  regulation  are  the  scrub  women. 

Alderman  Buck:  Are  the  other  employes  of  the  other  departments  under  civil 
service  or  any  kind  of  a  merit  system? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Not  as  being  on  a  list,  on  an  accredited  list.  The  official 
takes  the  responsibility  of  their  being  suitable  people.  He  is  responsible  to  the 
board  for  evidence  that  he  has  made  the  right  selection. 

Alderman   Buck:      Is    there   a   regular   schedule    of    salaries? 

Mr.  Blewett:  A  regular  schedule  of  salaries  for  all  of  the  kinds  of  janitors; 
that  is,  a  man  who  is  in  charge  of  a  moderate  heating  plant  and  a  janitor  who 
simply  does  ordinary  janitor  service.  There  are  different  scales  for  the  different 
kinds  of  work,  but  men  are  appointed  on  the  scale  and  they  do  not  have  any 
right  to  appoint  sub-workers  under  them. 

Alderman  Buck:  Is  there  a  regular  scale  of  salaries  in  the  education  de- 
partment? 

Mr.  Blewett:     Oh,  yes,  sir,  a  scale  of  salaries. 

Alderman  Powers:     The  only  examination,  however,  is  for  engineers? 

Mr.  Blewett:     No,  the  janitors  are  put  on  the  list  after  the  examination. 

Alderman  Powers:  The  superintendent  can  select  anybody  he  thinks  is  eligible 
upon  that  list. 

Mr.  Blewett:  The  commissioner  of  school  buildings  is  the  title  of  the  office, 
yes,  sir. 


Alderman  Buck:     He  may  dismiss  those  men  without  trial? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Yes,  sir,  he  takes  the  sole  responsibility  and  has  the  authority 
under  the  law  to  do  that  and  does  it. 

Alderman  Buck:     And  without  review  by  the  board? 

Mr.  Blewett:  He  simply  reports  to  the  board.  The  board  has  no  authority 
under  the  law  to  reverse  his  action. 

Alderman  Buck:  To  what  extent  does  the  charter  set  forth  the  status  or 
duties  of  the  various  officers,  the  superintendent  and  the  other  three? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Only  in  such  general  terms  as  I  have  presented  here.  Its 
general  terms  cover  the  situation  and  locate  the  responsibility  in  him.  For  in- 
stance, it  names  such  things  as  I  have  given,  as  pertaining  to  the  department 
of  instruction  and  definitely  locate  the  authority  in  the  superintendent,  making 
him  responsible  to  the  board  of  education  for  the  administration  of  his  de- 
partment. 

Alderman  Buck:  Will  you  tell  us  about  the  relations  of  the  teachers  to  the 
board  and  the  superintendent,  how  they  are  selected? 

METHOD  OF  SELECTING  TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Blewett:  Under  the  present  rules  of  the  board  all  of  our  teachers 
for  our  elementary  schools  must  be  graduates  of  the  Harris  Teachers  College,  which 
is  the  training  school  for  teachers  for  the  elementary  grades  maintained  by  the 
board  of  education.  That  limitation  is  made  because,  in  spite  of  the  fact  that 
our  standard  for  admission  to  the  college  is  very  high,  the  graduates  of  the 
college  are  an  ample  supply  of  teachers  for  the  elementary  grades.  The  board 
does  not  maintain  training  schools  for  teachers  for  the  higher  work.  The  rule 
of  the  board  merely  sets  up  this  standard,  that  the  teacher  selected  shall  have 
what  is  equivalent  to  the  education  that  is  indicated  by  a  university  degree, 
and  it  is  liberal  as  to  that.  It  does  not  say  there  must  be  a  degree,  but  there 
must  be  that  standard  of  scholarship.  It  requires,  further,  that  he  shall  have  a 
reasonable  number  of  years  of  practical  school  experience  before  he  may  be 
appointed  to  that  work. 

Alderman  Buck:     Is  that  set  forth  in  the  rules? 

Mr.  Blewett:     Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:     How  many  years  experience  are  they  required  to  have? 

CHOOSING   HIGH   SCHOOL   TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  is  left  indefinite,  throwing  the  responsibility  upon  the 
superintendent.  Then  the  rule  opens  the  entire  country  to  the  superintendent 
for  selection  of  teachers.  It  does  not  require  that  an  examination  for  these  high 
school  positions  be  held,  the  theory  being  that  if  such  a  requirement  were  made 
only  a  very  limited  number  of  people  would  present  themselves  for  the  exam- 
ination, and  that  the  city  would  be  deprived  of  the  opportunity  of  getting  the 
best  that  could  be  had  from  any  part  of  the  country.  Applications  are  made  and 
they  are  placed  on  file  in  the  office  with  all  the  testimonials  attached  in  reference 
to  scholarship  and  to  practical  success.  When  a  vacancy  comes  up  in  a  certain 
subject  the  filling  of  it  is  taken  up  by  the  assistant  superintendent  who  is  in 
charge  of  high  schools.  He  goes  over  the  applications  and  brings  to  the  super- 
intendent a  group  of  papers,  indicating  the  ones  he  thinks  are  suitable  for  the  posi- 
tion. The  superintendent  and  his  assistant  superintendent  go  over  and  make  the 
selection  and  the  superintendent  reports  the  recommendation  to  the  board  of 
education.  All  teachers  for  special  work,  manual  training,  physical  training, 
domestic  science  and  so  forth  are  selected  with  the  same  sort  of  a  liberal  oppor- 
tunity to  the  superintendent  to  make  what  seems  to  be  the  best  selection  for 
the  interest  of  the  schools.  That  covers  the  entire  field  of  the  selection  of 
teachers. 

Alderman  Buck:     The  teachers  in  the  elementary  schools;  are  they  examined? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No.  They  are  placed  on  the  list  in  the  order  of  time  and  in 
the  order  of  their  standing  in  their  class  and  they  are  called  out  without  excep- 
tion in  the  order  in  which  they  stand  upon  that  list. 


16 

Alderman  Buck:     Is  that  a  board  rule? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Yes.  They  are  then  sent  into  service  and  are  held  as  sub- 
stitutes for  a  period  of  eight  months,  getting  the  same  salary  that  a  regular 
teacher  in  that  work  would  get,  but  not  being  appointed  until  eight  months  of 
successful  service  has  proven  that  they  are  promising  material  for  future  work — 
eight  months  on  probation  and  with  a  salary  that  is  the  same  salary  that  they 
would  have  in  the  first  year's  service.  We  divide  our  elementary  teachers  into 
three  classes  or  ranks. 

SALARY  SCHEDULES  FOR  TEACHERS. 

Alderman  Powers:  But  the  elementary,  it  is  all  one  salary  for  the  ele- 
mentary teachers? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  oh  no,  they  begin  with  the  same  salary.  We  have  head 
assistants — first  assistants,  and  second  assistants — assigned  to  schools.  The  quota 
of  each  rank  in  each  school  is  determined  by  the  size  of  the  school.  The  salaries 
run  in  each  rank  over  a  gradually  increasing  schedule. 

Alderman  Buck:    The  board  fixes  the  salaries  of  teachers? 

Mr.  Blewett:  By  schedule  and  appointing  to  a  certain  rank.  The  teachers 
advance  theoretically  upon  that  schedule  without  any  action  of  the  board  at  all, 
but  promotion  to  a  higher  r^ank  is  on  the  recommendation  of  the  superintendent 
to  fill  a  vacancy  in  that  rank.  It  is  reported  first  to  a  committee  which  approves 
or  disapproves;  then  it  goes  to  the  board;  then  the  final  action  is  by  the  board 
with  the  exception  I  have  told  you  in  the  building  department  and  clerical  assist- 
ants in  the  other  departments. 

Alderman  Buck:  Having  fixed  the  salary  schedule  the  board  takes  no  further 
action  in  the  matter  of  salary;  it  does  not  fix  it  from  year  to  year  except  in  the 
budget  when  they  pass  the  budget. 

Mr.  Blewett:  As  I  stated,  when  financial  conditions  actually  showed  con- 
ditions that  suggest  to  the  board  the  propriety  of  improving  salaries, — 

Alderman  Buck:     They  have  no  periodical  readjustment? 

Mr.  Blewett:    No. 

Alderman  Powers:  If  they  increased  the  salaries  in  one  place  would  they 
increase  all  the  salaries  all  along  the  line? 

Mr.  Blewett:  In  all  of  the  cases,  where  the  schedules  have  been  changed, 
there  has  been  little  exception  to  that.  There  have  been  some  cases  in  which 
there  was  evidently  a  part  of  a  schedule  that  was  not  equitable,  and  the 
board  has  under  such  conditions  addressed  itself  to  fixing  that,  equalizing  it. 

HOW  PRINCIPALS  ARE  CHOSEN. 

School  principals  are  selected  in  the  same  way  that  the  high  school  teachers 
are  selected — by  the  superintendent  who  makes  the  nomination.  We  have  free 
access  to  all  the  educators  of  the  world  to  select  from.  The  natural  procedure 
is  to  promote  from  the  lower  ranks  where  they  are  worthy  of  promotion.  Our 
accessions  to  our  principals'  positions  are  usually  from  the  lower  ranks  of  young 
people  who  have  the  quality  and  promise  in  them. 

Alderman  Buck:  Is  it  your  practice  to  select  them  from  the  teaching  force, 
promote  them  from  teachers,  or  head  assistants? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Sometimes  the  selection  is  made  from  those  in  the  high  school 
force  who  have  had  the  advantage  of  a  study  of  administrative  problems;  and 
not  infrequently,  from  those  teachers  who  have  prepared  themselves.  We  do  not 
pick  out  a  teacher  who  has  just  simply  drifted  along  with  the  current,  without 
any  consideration  of  the  fact  that  she  needs  to  make  herself  or  he  needs  to  make 
himself  bigger,  to  occupy  a  position  of  that  kind;  but  we  have  these  teachers 
who  are  fitting  themselves  by  professional  study  for  that  work,  and,  of  course, 
those  are  our  natural  choices  for  those  positions.  But  there  is  no  simply 
slipping  on  into  a  principalship  because  you  have  held  a  position  lower  than  that. 

Alderman  Buck:  The  matter  of  the  selection  of  head  assistants,  second  as- 
sistants, etc.,  is  that  done  in  the  same  way? 

Mr.  Blewett:     The  first  appointment  is  as  a  substitute,  as  I  have  said,  for  a 


17 

period  of  probation  of  eight  months.  If  that  has  been  successful  they  are  ap- 
pointed to  the  lower  rank  of  second  assistant,  and  then  they  proceed  automatically 
to  the  maximum  salary,  and  stay  there,  unless  promoted  to  the  rank  of  first 
assistant. 

RECORDING  EFFICIENCY  OF  TEACHERS. 

Years  ago,  it  was  in  St.  Louis  as  I  presume  it  was  in  all  of  the  large-cities. 
The  matter  of  the  efficiency  of  teachers,  of  all  ranks  of  teachers,  principals, 
assistants,  assistant  teachers,  kindergarteners  and  kindergarten  assistants,  was 
merely  a  matter  of  the  memory  that  held  in  the  minds  of  the  administrative 
officers.  The  board  of  education  of  St.  Louis  that  had  on  it  some  men  of  great 
practical  experience  saw  the  unfairness  of  a  plan  of  that  kind  to  the  schools, 
first,  and  to  the  teachers  quite  as  well — probably  unfairness  to  them  as  much  as 
to  the  schools  themselves — of  depending  upon  a  man's  memory,  the  principal's 
memory,  or  the  assistant  superintendent's  memory,  or  the  superintendent's  mem- 
ory, of  what  this  teacher  had  been  doing  through  all  of  those  years,  and  saw  that 
it  was  an  unsafe  reliance.  No  man  would  conduct  any  part  of  his  large  business 
in  any  such  way.  So  the  suggestion  was  made  that  there  ought  to  be.  in  the 
office  of  the  superintendent  a  permanent  card  record  of  the  efficiency  of  teachers, 
and  twice  a  year  the  principals  of  the  schools  are  required  to  make  a  report  upon 
the  points,  six  points,  that  are  given,  upon  the  efficiency  of  teachers  in  the 
work. 

The  assistant  superintendents  are  required  to  make  a  report  of  the  same  nature 
upon  the  principals  of  the  schools,  and  the  heads  of  departments  upon  others  in 
the  employ  of  the  board  that  are  not  covered  by  the  cases  that  I  have  already 
spoken  of.  Those  reports  are  recorded  in  a  card  catalog  of  the  teachers,  and  the 
report  of  the  principal  coming  in  is  subject  to  the  review  of  the  assistant  super- 
intendent, who,  if  he  does  not  approve  of  the  report  made  by  the  principal,  records 
his  objection,  and  his  estimate.  So  that  when  a  question  of  promotion  comes  up, 
there  is  the  permanent  record  in  the  office  of  the  board,  that  was  made  without 
any  regard  to  a  particular  case.  We  make  out  a  list  ready  for  the  inspection 
of  the  board  in  the  spring,  showing  the  people  whose  efficiency  stands  on  a  high 
record;  and  when  a  vacancy  occurs,  the  promotion  is  made  from  that  list.  It  is  not 
confined  to  the  selection  of  a  teacher  from  the  school  in  which  the  particular 
vacancy  occurs.  Of  course,  it  is  good  administration,  we  believe,  to  have  the  pro- 
motion occur  out  of  that  corps,  if  there  is  any  reasonable  approach  to  the  best 
standing  there.  I  mean  by  that,  there  might  be  in  the  system,  in  some  other 
school,  a  teacher  whose  record  would  show  that  she  was  a  more  efficient  teacher 
than  the  particular  teacher  in  that  school;  but  if  that  teacher's  efficiency  is  of 
a  high  order,  we  believe  it  to  be  to  the  best  advantage  of  the  work  of  the 
schools  to  advance  that  teacher  there.  Other  things  being  equal,  length  of 
service  is  an  important  element  in  determining  the  promotion.  The  cards,  the 
record  of  the  teachers,  are  accessible  to  the  teachers.  If  the  principal  feels  some 
hesitation,  as  they  used  to  do — although  I  hope  they  do  not  any  longer — in  talking 
frankly  with  a  teacher  about  his  estimate  of  her  work,  and  his  report  upon  her 
work,  the  teacher  may  come  to  the  superintendent's  office,  and  the  whole  thing 
will  be  gone  over  with  her. 

BASIS  FOR  GRADING  ST.  LOUIS  TEACHERS. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  What  are  the  points  covered  in  those  reports,  Mr. 
Blewett,  and  what  weight  have  those  reports? 

Mr.  Blewett:  In  a  general  way,  these  natural  points.  First,  of  the  teacher's 
professional  skill.  That  shows  itself  in  her  relation  to  her  pupils;  it  shows  itself 
in  her  relation  to  the  administration  of  the  school  itself,  and  her  cooperation 
with  the  principal  in  the  plan  of  work.  It  shows  itself  in  her  relation  to  the 
parents.  And  then,  with  all  the  other  points  that  are  recorded,  comes  the  question: 
Is  she  dead  or  alive?  Is  she  realizing  the  fact  that  she  has  got  to  be  improving 
all  the  time?  Is  she  taking  the  sort  of  an  interest  in  the  work  that  will  make 
her  want  to  be  progressive?  They  arc  just  the  same  kind  of  things,  gentlemen, 
I  think  that  any  man  in  charge  of  a  great  business  would  want  to  know  in 
regard  to  the  efficiency  of  the  people  who  were  working  for  him. 


18 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Are  those  reports  on   a  percentage  basis? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  no.  It  is  just  a  grouping  by  excellent,  good,  moderate, 
poor,  unsatisfactory. 

Alderman  Buck:     Is  it  a  matter  of  guesswork,  fixing  those  five  grades? 

Mr.  Blewet:  It  ought  not  to  be,  surely.  Of  course,  it  has  got  to  be  a  mat- 
ter of  judgment.  You  attempt  to  measure  the  work  of  a  teacher,  and  say,  "She 
is  a  99  per  cent  teacher, "  or  "She  is  a  99.8  per  cent  teacher, "  and  you  get 
into  a  ridiculous  situation.  And  then  when  you  get  into  even  such  a  rough  classifi- 
cation as  "She  is  excellent/'  or  "She  is  good,"  you  have  got  to  remember  that 
you  are  handling  a  very  delicate  question.  Great  care  must  be  used  in  that 
kind  of  classification.  For  instance,  there  has  got  to  be  a  marked  distinction  that 
would  carry  the  teacher  into  the  group  of  excellent.  She  ought  to  stand,  or  he 
ought  to  stand,  quite  head  and  shoulders  above  the  others  who  are  marked,  as  the 
great  body  of  us  would  be,  of  course,  as  good. 

Alderman  Buck:     Is  there  any  standardization? 

Mr.  Blewett:  There  is  an  attempt  to  make  a  standardization,  and,  of  course, 
you  can  plainly  realize  the  difficulty  of  doing  that.  We  have  120  principals,  say. 
Now,  the  certainty,  unless  that  is  carefully  handled,  of  there  being  nearly  120 
different  standards,  is  very  great.  That  we  seek  to  overcome  by  talking  with 
the  teachers  and  by  talking  with  the  principals  as  to  what  these  letters  signify, 
and  we  reduce  the  element  of  human  mistakes  in  it  by  such  processes  as  much  as 
we  can.  Of  course,  we  realize  that,  do  all  that  we  can,  there  must  be  some  of 
that  in  it.  But  with  all  of  that  possibility,  there  is  the  certainty  that  the  record 
which  the  principal  of  a  school  and  the  superintendent  may  be  held  responsible 
for,  is  a  great  deal  fairer  arrangement  for  the  teachers  than  to  just  say,  "I 
remember  so  and  so.  This  was  Miss  So  and  So's  work  or  Mr.  So  and  So's  work,  a 
year  or  two  ago."  There  is  the  record  made  at  the  time,  and  it  ought  to  be  made 
impartially,  and  it  ought  to  be  made  with  the  best  judgment  that  the  man  or 
woman  has  who  is  making  it. 

TEACHER  HAS  ACCESS  TO  EFFICIENCY  RECORD. 

Alderman  Buck:     Does   the   teacher   have   access   to   it? 

Mr.  Blewett:  The  teacher  may  have  access  to  it  at  any  time  she  wants 
to;  and,  as  I  say,  if  there  is  any  case  in  which  the  principal  of  a  school  refuses 
to  tell  the  teacher  just  exactly  how  he  has  marked  her,  if  she  will  come  to  the 
superintendent's  office,  she  will  see  the  whole  record,  and  we  will  canvass  the 
whole  record  for  her,  just  as  we  know  we  ought  to  in  our  relation  to  her,  and 
in  our  relation  to  the  great  work. 

Alderman  Buck:     Do  you  have  district  superintendents  there? 

Mr.  Blewett:  We  call  them  assistant  superintendents.  They  are  practically 
superintendents,  in  their  own  geographic  fields. 

Alderman  Buck:    How  do  they  review  these  efficiency  markings? 

Mr.  Blewett:  They  take  the  markings  as  they  come  in  twice  a  year,  and 
go  over  them  carefully  one  by  one,  and  scrutinize  them,  and  make  any  recorded 
objection  that  they  think  ought  to  be  made,  relying  on  their  own  observation 
of  the  work,  right  in  the  school  room. 

Alderman  Buck:  Have  you  any  other  assistant  superintendents  except  those 
who  have  geographic  districts? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No.  We  have  supervisors  of  special  subjects,  though.  Eeally, 
the  proper  term  for  them  is  ' '  special  teachers, ' '  I  think. 

Alderman  Buck:  You  have  no  one  whose  particular  business  it  is  to  assign 
teachers  to  sundry  schools? 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  is  all  done  from  the  office.  You  see,  the  assignment  to  the 
elementary  schools  takes  place  in  an  automatic  way.  A  vacancy  occurs  in  a 
school;  for  instance,  there  may  be  a  vacancy  for  a  day.  There  is  our  list  of 
the  graduates  of  the  Harris  Teachers  College.  Those  teachers  must  be  called 
out  in  the  order  in  which  they  appear  on  that  list;  and  we  have  telephonic 
communication  with  all  of  those  teachers,  and  the  teachers '  clerk  calls  up  the 
next  teacher,  and  sends  her  to  that  temporary  vacancy;  and  that  may  develop 
into  a  permanent  vacancy.  They  are  on  the  list  in  the  order  of  the  time  they 
graduated  from  the  Teachers  College,  and  in  the  order  of  their  standing  in  their 


19 

class  at  the  end  of  their  two  years  in  the  college.  They  are  called  out  in  that 
order. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  the  teachers  ever  object  against  their  markings  as 
unjust? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Naturally.  There  are  cases  of  that  kind,  but  I  am  glad  to 
say  that  they  are  rare. 

Alderman  Buck:     What  happens  then?    To  whom  does  the  teacher  object? 

Mr.  Blewett:  She  naturally  would  first  make  objections  to  her  principal, 
and  next  to  her  assistant  superintendent,  and  next  to  the  superintendent.  And 
when  objection  is  made,  there  is  no  question  in  our  minds  but  that  very  careful 
attention  ought  to  be  paid  to  the  objection,  and  that  it  ought  to  be  reviewed,  to 
see  whether  it  is  justified  or  not.  If  it  is  an  injustice  it  will  be  corrected. 

TEACHER  MAY  APPEAL  TO  BOARD. 

Alderman  Buck:     Does  she  ever  go  as  far  as  board  members? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Oh  yes,  of  course.  Their  practice  is  to  present  the  matter  to 
the  superitnendent,  and  ask  him  to  look  into  the  matter,  and  see  if  there  is  any 
injustice  done.  I  can  make  as  strong  a  statement  as  this,.  I  believe  the  actual 
practical  working  out  of  the  plan  is  such  that  it  does  not  occur  once  in  a  year 
that  a  member  of  the  board  of  education  comes  to  the  superintendent's  office  in 
urgent  insistence  upon  something  being  done  for  a  particular  teacher.  If  he 
comes,  the  whole  situation  is  laid  before  him,  as  it  ought  to  be.  Of  course,  he 
has  a  right  to  know  the  whole  situation,  for  he  is  a  trustee,  and  has  some  respon- 
sibility, so  the  ground  for  the  superintendent's  action,  and  the  ground  for  the 
principal's  action,  is  laid  before  that  member  of  the  board  and  he  has  the  same 
opportunity  to  judge,  insofar  as  his  experience  would  allow  him,  as  the  officer 
has.  But  it  is  my  happy  experience  that  the  gentlemen  of  the  board  are  not 
under  the  necessity  of  urging  the  reappointment  or  retention  of  a  teacher  to  whom 
the  officer  has  objected,  or  rather,  of  whom  the  officer  has  taken  the  responsibility 
of  saying  that  it  is  not  to  the  interest  of  the  schools  to  return  him  or  her. 

Alderman  Buck:     Is  anyone  eligible  to  election  on  the  board? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Well,  there  are  certain  conditions  of  citizenship,  you  know, 
the  ordinary  conditions  of  that  kind,  but  nothing  else. 

Alderman  Buck:     Are  women  eligible? 

Mr.  Blewett:     No. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  In  the  efficiency  markings,  does  it  very  often  happen 
that  the  assistant  superintendent  or  the  superintendent  has  changed  the  markings? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Barely.  You  see,  those  things  are  all  a  matter  of  consulta- 
tion at  the  school,  with  the  principal  and  with  the  teacher.  They  ought  to  be, 
too.  Those  are  things  that  touch  vitally  the  interests  of  the  school.  No  interest 
is  subserved  by  having  inefficiency.  The  teacher's  interest  is  not  subserved  by 
remaining  inefficient.  A  teacher  may  be  inefficient  because  of  inexperience;  she 
may  be  inefficient  because  she  has  not  been  properly  helped.  But  if  the  oppor- 
tunity is  taken,  as  it  should  be  taken,  of  taking  the  matter  right  up  with  hei 
in  the  school,  so  that  the  final  record  may  be  made  there,  as  it  ought  to  be,  then 
that  has  been  very  carefully  gone  over  beforehand. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Occasionally,  I  suppose,  as  the  result  of  the  markings 
a  teacher  is  removed  from  the  force? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Yes.  The  process  is  for  the  superintendent  not  to  recommend 
her  reappointment  at  the  end  of  the  year. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Is  there  any  appeal  to  the  board,  or  any  trial,  or  any 
thing  of  that  sort? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  that  is  the  final  action,  as  I  explained  before.  Thf 
superintendent  is  charged  with  the  responsibility  of  making  the  nominations, 
and  if  he  does  not  nominate,  the  teacher  cannot  be  appointed,  and  if  he  does 
nominate,  she  can  be  rejected  by  the  board. 

Alderman  Powers:  That  does  not  very  often  happen,  though,  does  it,  for 
the  board  to  take  action  of  that  kind — not  to  concur  in  the  recommendation  of 
the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  sir.  And, ' of  course,  it  ought  not  to  happen  very  often 
If  a  man  in  charge  of  this  work  is  not  competent  he  ought  not  to  stay  there. 


20 

HELP  INEFFICIENT  TEACHERS  TO  IMPROVE. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  happens  when  a  teacher  begins  to  slide  down  tho 
scale  in  her  efficiency  markings,  and  she  finally  gets  to  unsatisfactory  corre- 
sponding to  our  "inefficient"  here? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Why,  of  course,  all  down  that  process  of  decay  there  is  a 
consultation  with  her,  an  attempt  to  help  her,  and  to  restore  her  to  efficiency,  to 
build  her  up.  In  other  words,  our  relations  with  the  teachers  are  what  they  ought 
to  be.  We  are  there  as  helpers  of  the  teacher,  we  believe. 

Alderman  Buck:  When  a  teacher  is  marked  down  from  one  grade  to  a  lower 
grad«,  is  there  any  kind  of  notice  required  to  be  given  to  a  teacher? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Not  required — that  is,  not  by  rule  of  the  board  nor  by  rule  or 
regulation  of  the  department;  but  the  practice  is  that,  and  it  ought  to  be. 

Alderman  Buck:     Are  your  principals  afraid  to  mark  down  teachers? 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  do  not  think  so — with  rare  exception,  possibly,  of  course. 
But  I  think  the  relations  are  the  proper  relations  of  honorable  people  to  each 
other,  both  the  assistants  and  the  principals. 

Mr.  Buck:     Do  teachers  generally  keep  track  of  their  marks? 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  do  not  think  they  concern  themselves  greatly  about  their 
marks.  I  do  not  think  that  they  have  occasion  to  concern  themselves  greatly 
about  their  marks.  I  think  the  whole  situation  is  so  plain  to  the  teaching  corps, 
as  a  whole,  that  they  know  whether  they  are  doing  efficient  work  or  not;  and  I 
think  the  case  is,  as  it  ought  to  be,  very  rare  when  a  teacher  is  anxious  about 
whether  justice  is  being  done  her,  or  not. 

DROP   ONE   PER    CENT   AS  INEFFICIENT. 

Alderman  Powers:  About  what  percentage  do  you  eliminate  each  year  of  your 
teachers? 

Mr.  Blewett:  About  one  per  cent.  I  suppose,  in  fifteen  years,  that  would  be 
about  the  average.  The  elimination  in  recent  years  has  been  where  it  ought  to 
be,  before  a  long  period  of  inefficiency.  At  the  beginning  of  this  system  there 
was  naturally  a  lot  of  inefficiency  that  had  accumulated.  Now  our  whole 
thought  of  proper  administration  is  to  keep  inefficiency  out.  The  inefficiency  that 
is  already  in  is  reduced  to  the  minimum.  We  take  the  young  teacher,  and  give 
her  a  proper  opportunity  to  show  whether  she  is  likely  to  prove  to  be  an  efficient 
teacher,  or  not;  and  if  within  a  reasonable  time  she  does  not  show  that  she  is 
likely  to  be  efficient,  we  simply  say  that  we  do  not  recommend  her  to  be  con- 
tinued. So  there  is  where,  even  of  this  small  percentage,  the  large  amount  of  it  is, 
in  keeping  out  inefficiency  rather  than  putting  out  inefficiency. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  What  percentage  of  substitutes  fail  to  get  appointments 
after  the  eight  months  time? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Oh,  I  have  not  got  it  in  per  cent,  but  I  do  not  suppose  it  is  a 
quarter  of  one  per  cent.  Those  women  are  all  trained  in  that  college,  and  we  do 
not  admit  them  to  the  college  unless  they  stand  in  the  upper  two-thirds  of  their 
high  school  classes,  or  are  able  to  pass  an  examination  that  will  come  up  to  the 
average  of  that.  They  are  all  selected  people,  in  the  first  place.  They  have  been 
selected  by  processes  of  elimination,  until  they  get  into  the  high  school,  and  then 
they  have  got  to  maintain,  for  their  four  years,  such  standing  as  to  give  them  a 
rank  in  the  upper  two-thirds;  and  then  they  are  subjected  to  two  years  of  as 
excellent  professional  training  as  we  can  give  them;  so  the  percentage  of  failure 
is  very  small. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  And  in  admitting  students  to  the  teachers  college,  are 
graduates  of  St.  Louis  high  schools  given  preference? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No — well,  they  are  given  preference  in  this  way,  that  the  upper 
two-thirds  are  admitted  without  examination.  The  lower  third  has  to  submit 
itself  to  an  examination,  as  candidates  from  the  outside  have  to  submit  themselves 
to  an  examination. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Have  the  members  there  formed  themselves  into  any 
organization? 

Mr.  Blewett:    A  number  of  organizations. 

Alderman  Kennedy:    What  is  the  type  of  organization? 


21 

Mr.  Blewett:  A  type  of  professional  people  getting  together  for  their  own 
improvement,  and  for  the  improvement  of  their  profession. 

Aldermen  Kennedy:  You  have  never  had  any  trouble  with  them  in  the  way 
of  lack  of  harmony — like  the  controversy  in  Chicago,  for  instance? 

Mr.  Blewett:     No. 

Alderman  Powers:  Do  you  object  to  your  teachers  organizing  for  mutual 
protection,  or  becoming  members  of  such  an  organization? 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  would  object  to  a  situation  where  they  would  have  to 
organize  for  mutual  protection. 

Alderman  Powers:  But  you  would  not  object  to  their  becoming  members 
of  the  Federation  of  Labor,  would  you? 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  do  not  believe  that  we  in  public  offices  ought  to  be  asso- 
ciated with  an  organization  that  may  draw  us  into  a  situation  that  will  make 
us  disregard  some  or  all  of  the  interests  that  we  have  in  our  charge.  I  am  a 
democrat,  and  I  vote  the  democratic  ticket,  and  I  believe  in  it  thoroughly;  but 
I  do  not  get  out  and  preach  it,  and  I  do  not  think  it  is  my  business  to  do  it. 
I  do  not  think  it  is  proper  for  me  to  serve  on  committees  of  my  party.  I 
think  it  is  my  business  to  be  there  as  a  teacher,  and,  while  maintaining  my  own 
rights  as  a  man,  not  to  put  myself  in  a  position  where  I  will  be  possibly,  by 
somebody  else's  act,  forced  into  a  lack  of  consideration  for  the  great  interests 
that  I  have  in  my  charge.  That  is  my  profession  and  confession.  I  believe  I  have 
never  made  it  before  in  public. 

BOARD  SHOULD  NOT  FORBID  ORGANIZATION. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  have  any  rules — does  your  board  of  education  have 
any  rules — prescribing  the  conduct  of  teachers  outside  of  the  class  room? 

Mr.  Blewett:     No,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  believe  in  such  rules,  as  an  educator?  For  instance, 
do  you  think  that  the  board  of  education  should  pass  a  rule  prescribing  what 
kind  of  an  organization  a  teacher  should  or  should  not  have  membership  in? 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  do  not  believe  that  it  should.  I  do  not  believe  that  the 
selection  of  the  teachers — answering  you  in  somewhat  the  same  way  that  I  did 
before — ought  to  make  it  possible  for  that  kind  of  thing  to  be  necessary.  If 
the  man  or  woman  in  charge  of  a  class  room,  or  in  charge  of  one  of  these 
schools,  Cannot  by  his  walk  or  her  walk  before  the  people  of  the  great  city 
that  he  or  she  is  serving,  show  that  he  or  she  is  a  worthy  person  in  every  respect, 
and  that  he  or  she  has  no  other  concern  but  to  be  of  service  to  that  great  in- 
stitution, I  think  he  or  she  ought  to  be  out  of  the  service.  It  ought  to  be  a  matter 
of  devotion  to  our  work;  and  if  our  lives  do  not  show  that  it  is,  I  think  we 
ought  not  to  be  kept;  but  then,  if  our  lives  do  show  that,  it  is  for  no  man  to 
question  to  what  we  belong,  or  what  we  do. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  think  that  it  is  a  question  to  be  solved  by  a  rule 
of  the  board  of  education,  as  to  what  rights  of  citizenship  teachers  shall  exercise? 

Mr.  Blewett:     No,  sir,  I  do  not. 

Alderman  Buck:  Are  your  rules  governing  the  members  of  the  education 
department,  and  their  conduct,  complicated  or  simple? 

Mr.  Blewett:    Oh,  they  are  simple. 

Alderman  Buck:    Are  they  numerous,  or  few? 

Mr.  Blewett:     Few. 

Alderman  Buck:  Have  you  any  merit  system  for  teachers  there,  prolonging 
their  tenure,  or  making  it  continuous,  contingent  on  satisfactory  service? 

Mr.  Blewett:  There  is  no  rule  to  that  effect.  You  see,  the  teachers  are 
appointed  annually,  but  the  practical  result  is  what  I  have  said.  A  teacher  who 
is  efficient  in  our  schools  has  as  sure  a  tenure  of  office  as  the  sun  has. 

Alderman  Buck:     Under  the  present  management? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Oh,  yes,  and  under  any.  I  have  been  with  those  schools  for 
forty  years,  and  I  have  never  known  any  other  condition. 

Alderman  Buck:  Well,  would  it,  in  your  judgment,  be  possible  for  a  super- 
intendent of  instruction — 

Mr.  Blewett:  It  might  be  entirely  possible;  but  under  the  proper  organiza- 
tion of  schools,  with  the  responsibility  located  upon  a  man  or  woman  at  the  head 


22 

of  the  schools,  such  location  of  responsibility  is  as  I  have  said,  such  that  a 
man  or  woman  cannot  hide  behind  someone  else.  If  there  is  a  wrong  act  done,  it 
can  be  said,  ''Here  you  have  done  an  ^injustice.  You  have  done  it."  A  man  or 
woman  could  not  maintain  a  position  "at  the  head  of  one  of  these  great  school 
systems,  if  the  school  system  was  properly  organized,  and  continuously  act  weakly 
or  unjustly.  He  could  not  possibly  do  it.  He  would  not  last  a  year,  and  he 
ought  not  to. 

ELIMINATE  SHIFTING  OF  RESPONSIBILITY. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  think  that  the  biggest  thing  that  the  new  charter 
has  done  for  the  public  schools  of  St.  Louis  is  to  define  the  relations  and  duties 
of  the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Unquestionably.  There  is  no  escaping  responsibility.  There  is 
broad  authority,  but  there  is  no  escaping  responsibility. 

Alderman  Buck:  That  is  to  say,  there  are  not  so  many  different  agencies 
that  participate  in  doing  the  same  thing,  that  one  may  shift  responsibility  to 
another? 

Mr.  Blewett:  There  is  no  participation  in  the  essential  conduct  of  any  part  of 
the  work, — that  is,  in  the  initiative  of  it.  No  man  or  woman  in  any  part  of  the 
work  can  say  that  it  is  the  other  fellow's  fault. 

Alderman  Buck:  I  believe  you  said,  in  the  early  part  of  your  statement — 
and  if  yo*i  did,  1  should  like  to  emphasize  it,  if  I  am  correct — that  the  average 
business  session  of  the  school  board  lasts  about  20  minutes. 

Mr.  Blewett:  I  do  not  think  it  is  much  longer  than  that.  Half  an  hour  is 
a  long  session  of  the  board,  but  it  is  not  a  long  session  for  a  committee.  The 
committee  addresses  itself  with  minute  care  to  the  report  of  the  officer,  and  to 
all  of  the  business  that  is  presented  to  it,  to  review  it,  criticise  it,  and  discuss 
it;  and  in  most  instances  the  majority  of  the  board  are  present  at  that  committee 
meeting,  listening  to  the  whole  procedure;  and  they  are  sometimes  asked  to  take 
part,  and  give  opinions,  before  final  action  of  the  committee  is  recorded. 

Alderman  Miller:     Mr.  Blewett,  are  the  board  members  on  salary? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  sir.  I  was  saying  to  one  of  the  gentlemen  out  here  that 
I  do  not  believe  that  anybody,  not  placed  in  a  situation  similar  to  the  one  that 
I  have  been  placed  in  during  all  these  years,  has  any  realization  of  the  services 
that  men  on  boards  of  that  kind  render  to  the  great  city,  and  frequently  render 
without  any  adequate  recognition  on  the  part  of  the  city,  of  the  sacrifice  of  time, 
and  the  very  great  discomfort  that  often  comes  to  them.  Now,  I  sit  with  those 
people,  and  I  work  with  them,  and  I  know  that  their  other  business  is  pressing 
upon  them,  and  all  that;  and  I  see,  and  have  been  through  all  these  years,  how 
faithful  they  have  been  to  this  public  work. 

TEACHERS  WARNED  OF  UNSATISFACTORY  WORK. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  the  teachers  receive  notice  of  unsatisfactory  service,  or 
of  their  reappointment  each  year,  or  of  their  failure  to  be  reappointed? 

Mr.  Blewett:  A  teacher  is  talked  with,  worked  with,  counselled  with,  and 
helped,  whenever  conditions  are  such  as  show  that  her  work  is  questionable. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  It  would  not  be  possible  for  a  teacher  in  your  schools 
to  be  dismissed  without  warning,  or  without  notice? 

Mr.  Blewett:     No,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:     Well,  those  that  are  reappointed,  are  they  notified? 

Mr.  Blewett:  All  of  them,  yes,  sir.  They  are  notified  after  the  board  has 
appointed — that  is,  the  notices  of  appointment  are  already  made  out,  ready  to  put 
into  the  mail  immediately  after  the  board,  in  the  June  meeting,  has  approved 
the  recommendations  of  the  superintendent.  It  goes  over  from  May  to  June,  you 
understand.  Action  is  taken  in  June,  and  then  immediately  after  the  meeting 
of  the  board  in  June,  taking  action,  these  appointments  are  all  put  in  the  mail, 
and  the  teachers  have  them  the  next  morning. 

Alderman  Powers:  What  is  the  extent  of  your  system  there?  In  other  words, 
how  many  schools  and  teachers  have  you  in  St.  Louis? 

Mr.  Blewett:  We  have,  roughly  speaking,  120  schools,  2,500  teachers,  and  an 
enrollment  of  100,000. 


23 

BOARD  INDEPENDENT  OF  CITY. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Is  there  any  connection  whatever  between  the  city 
council,  or  the  mayor,  or  any  other  public  official  of  St.  Louis,  and  the  manage- 
ment of  the  schools,  outside  of  the  board  of  education,  Mr.  Blewett1? 

Mr.  Blewett:  None  whatever.  The  board  is  an  independent  body,  esta Wished 
by  this  charter,  granted  by  the  legislature.  It  has  the  independent  authority  to 
levy  taxes  up  to  the  constitutional  limit.  The  only  connection  that  the  board  of 
education  has  with  the  other  municipal  officers  is  that  the  law  requires  the  mayor 
of  the  city  to  appoint  annually  an  expert  accountant,  who  shall  go  over  the  entire 
accounts  of  the  board  of  education,  and  report  back  to  the  mayor  and  to  the 
public. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Is  there  any  sort  of  a  pension  system? 

Mr.  Blewett:  No,  sir,  there  is  no  public  pension  system.  There  is  an  asso- 
ciation of  teachers,  about  half  the  body  of  teachers  there.  They  are  in  an  asso- 
ciation that  is  taking  care  of  a  very  considerable  number  of  needy  teachers. 

Alderman  Miller:  How  do  you  determine  or  establish  the  age  of  teachers  for 
retirement? 

Mr.  Blewett:  Well,  that  need  not  necessarily  be  caused  by  age.  We  just 
simply  determine  whether  the  teacher  is  inefficient,  or  not.  There  is  no  age  limit 
of  service.  In  promotion,  all  other  things  being  equal,  length  of  service  is  the 
deciding  question. 

MR.  CHARLES  E.  CHADSEY, 

Superintendent  of  Public  Schools,  Detroit,  Mich. 

Mr.  Chadsey  appeared  Oct.  14,  1916. 

Alderman  Buck:  Today  we  have  with  us  Mr.  C.  E.  Chadsey,  superintendent 
of  public  schools,  Detroit,  Michigan.  Mr.  Chadsey  was  formerly  superintendent 
of  schools  at  Denver,  Colorado,  and  has  been  active  in  educational  work.  He 
is  chairman  of  a  committee  on  the  relation  of  school  superintendents  to  boards 
of  education  of  the  department  of  superintendence  of  the  National  Educational 
Association.  He  has  a  very  general  knowledge  of  school  matters  and  is  one  of 
the  noted  educators  of  the  country,  and  he  has  come  this  morning  to  advise  with 
with  this  committee  concerning  questions  of  school  policy,  and  if  the  committee 
please,  I  shall  ask  him  to  make  a  stataement  of  his  views  concerning  questions 
of  educational  administrataion,  relations  of  boards  of  education  ^  to  the  people 
and  the  city  government,  relations  of  superintendents  to  the  boards  of  educa- 
tion, and  then  the  relataions  of  teachers  to  the  superintendents  and  the  schools 
generally.  We  have  with  us  this  morning,  I  am  happy  to  announce,  a  member  of 
the  board  of  education,  Mr.  Max  Loeb.  The  sub-committee  sent  invitations  to 
all  of  the  members  of  the  board  of  education,  including  the  superintendent  and 
the  assistant  superintendent,  to  attend  these  hearings  and  participate  in  them. 
Mr.  Max  Loeb  is  the  only  member  who  has  taken  advantage  of  the  invitation  so 
far  as  I  know,  and  I  trust  the  committee,  Mr.  Chairman,  will  do  him  the  courtesy 
to  invite  him  to  participate  in  the  discussion,  and  to  ask  questions  of  Mr.  Chadsey 
whenever  there  is  something  he  wants  to  bring  out. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Gentlemen  of  the  committee,  I  will  state  that  I  received  a 
letter  from  the  chairman  of  your  sub-committee  asking  me  to  come  here  and  I 
agreed  to  come,  not  knowing  at  all  definitely  what  I  was  expected  to  say,  and  I 
appear  before  you  this  morning  without  any  preparation  of  any  sort,  not  knowing 
even  now  exactly  about  what  you  wish  me  to  speak. 

I  understand,  after  conversation  this  morning  with  Mr.  Buck,  that  this  com- 
mittee has  before  it  the  general  idea  of  framing  a  law  that  can  be  acted  upon 
by  the  state  legislature  which  may  bring  about  a  condition  that  will  make  foi 
more  efficient  school  administration  than  is  practical  unless  some  changes  of  some 
sort  are  made. 

In  general  I  wish  to  say  that  I  have  a  very  meager  acquaintance  with  the 
local  conditions  in  Chicago.  What  I  am  saying  or  may  say  will  have,  so  far  as  1 
am  concerned,  no  particular  relation  to  Chicago  conditions.  I  am  generalizing  in 
nearly  all  I  have  to  say. 


24 

STATUS  OF  SUPERINTENDENT  OF  SCHOOLS. 

The  office  of  superintendent  of  schools  is  historically  comparatively  a  new 
one,  and  there  does  not  as  yet  exist  any  definite  standardized  ideal  as  to  what  his 
powers  and  duties  should  be  as  contrasted  with  the  powers  and  duties  and  limi- 
tations of  a  board  of  education.  In  the  majority  of  cases  the  superintendent  isr 
an  official  who  has  no  powers  whatever  save  such  as  may  be  given  him  formally 
by  Jthe  board  of  education  either  through  certain  rules  which  may  have  been 
adopted,  or  through  what  might  be  called  a  usurping  of  powers  which  ^  properly 
speaking  belong  to  the  board  of  education.  The  active,  aggressive  superintendent 
in  most  of  our  city  school  systems  is  doing  much  of  his  work  as  a  usurper,  that  is, 
he  simply  assumes  the  power  and  his  assumption  of  power  is  acquiesced  in  more 
or  less  unconsciously  by  a  board  of  education,  and  the  active  constructive  work  of 
schools  goes  on  in  that  way.  If  a  superintendent  does  not  happen  to  be  active 
and  aggressive  there  often  arise  conditions  which  may  make  him  little  more  than 
a  figurehead  or  a  clerk  of  the  board  of  education.  The  board  of  education  in  those 
cases  will  actively  do  those  things  which  in  other  places  or  with  superintendent? 
of  a  different  caliber  would  be  done,  and  I  think  should  be  done,  by  the  superin 
tendent. 

That  is  my  first  general  conclusion:  that  in  some  form  or  other  there  should  be 
established  in  every  school  system  a  definite  statement  of  the  powers  and  limita- 
tions of  the  board  of  education  and  an  almost  equally  definite  statement  of  the 
powers  and  limitations  of  the  superintendent  of  schools. 

There  are  certain  powers  which  should  be  possessed  by  superintendents,  and 
which  should  not  be  possessed  by  the  board  of  education,  and  certainly  the  con- 
verse is  equally  true.  The  question  as  to  how  those  laws  should  be  passed  is  largely 
a  local  one,  depending  upon  the  limitations  of  the  city  charter  under  which  the 
school  system  may  be  operated  or  the  statutory  requirements  of  a  state,  and  in 
some  cases  possibly  by  limitations  of  the  constitution  itself.  But  whether  these 
laws  should  be  passed  by  the  legislature,  or  should  be  in  the  form  of  ordinances 
passed  by  city  councils  is  from  my  point  of  view,  with  reference  to  the  relative 
powers  and  duties  of  the  superintendent  and  board  of  education,  of  minor  impor- 
tance. 

BOARD  OF  EDUCATION  SHOULD  BE  SMALL. 

A  board  of  education,  as  I  conceive  it,  should  be  of  a  reasonably  small  size. 
It  should  be  a  board  whose  duties  are  largely  legislative.  The  executive  part  of  the 
work  of  the  city  school  system,  in  my  judgment,  should  be  entrusted  to  the  super- 
intendent of  schools,  and  he  should  be  held  responsible  by  the  board  of  education 
for  the  proper  conduct  of  those  duties,  and  he  should  in  some  definite  way  make 
reports  which  will  enable  the  board  of  education  from  meeting  to  meeting  to  be 
advised  of  the  executive  work  of  the  superintendent,  but  it  should  be  the  duty  and 
function  of  the  board  of  education,  as  a  board  or  in  committees,  to  perform  these 
executive  acts.  The  failure  to  discriminate  between  legislative  and  executive  duties 
is  in  many  cases  the  cause  of  inefficiency  in  school  administration. 

In  that  connection  I  would  also  add  that  the  question  of  the  tenure  of  office 
of  a  superintendent  is  a  matter  of  considerable  importance.  I  am  aware  of  the 
fact  that  in  the  City  of  Chicago  the  school  superintendent  is  elected  annually.  It 
seems  to  me  that  if  we  were  looking  for  one  particular  thing  that  ought  to  be 
changed  it  would  be  that  particular  thing;  that  is,  I  cannot  see  how  you  can  hope, 
in  the  City  of  Chicago,  to  have  a  definitely  constructive  policy  in  operation  unless 
the  executive  officer  has  some  reasonable  assurance  of  a  tenure  of  office  sufficiently 
long  for  him  to  show  to  his  board  of  education  and  to  the  city  at  large,  which  is  of 
even  more  consequence,  that  his  policies  and  his  ideas  are  correct.  Under  normal 
conditions  superintendents  are  human.  Bear  in  mind,  I  have  no  reference  to  the 
past  or  present  conditions  in  Chicago,  but  all  superintendents  have  a  reasonable 
ambition  to  remain  in  their  position,  at  any  rate  not  to  be  compelled  to  withdraw. 

EVILS  OF  ONE- YEAR  SUPERINTENDENT'S  TERM. 

If  the  question  of  the  election  of  superintendents  is  more  or  less  of  a  political 
issue  every  year,  it  follows  that  a  considerable  time  and  energy  of  a  superintend- 


25 

ent  may  be  given  to  the  securing  of  a  sufficient  number-  of  votes  to  secure  his  re- 
election. At  any  rate,  his  policy  may  be  somewhat  modified  by  the  fact  that  within 
a  very  few  weeks  or  a  month  it  is  going  to  be  necessary  for  him  to  have  the 
friendly  support  of  a  certain  number  of  board  members.  I  think  a  superintendent 
unconsciously  may  be  influenced  by  that  fact  and  may  fail  aggressively  to  de- 
mand those  things  which  are  for  the  welfare  of  the  school  system,  if  he  realizes 
that  there  does  exist  a  strong  active  opposition  to  these  policies.  There  might  be  a 
tendency  to  postpone  any  of  these  things  until  the  election,  and  then  often  a 
policy  cannot  be  worked  out,  and  be  successful  within  the  comparatively  few 
months  of  his  term  that  remain.  I  know  in  my  own  case,  having  been  elected  for 
a  term  of  three  years,  that,  at  the  conclusion  of  the  three  years  of  my  first  term, 
despite  my  very  best  efforts  I  could  not  avoid  a  great  many  people  coming  to  me 
and  discussing  with  me  the  situation.  I  could  not  prevent  the  papers  discussing 
the  question  as  to  just  how  many  votes  I  was  going  to  have,  and  with  the  very 
best  efforts  on  my  part  I  could  not  avoid  feeling  it  was  rather  hard  to  accomplish 
effective  work  with  so  much  agitation  and  so  much  talk  in  the  school  system.  I 
submit  that  a  condition  of  that  sort,  even  if  the  superintendent  is  absolutely  honest 
in  his  actions,  is  not  best  for  the  school  system,  because  of  the  uncertainty  which 
exists  in  the  minds  of  teachers  in  general,  and  an  uncertainty  which  will  be  re- 
flected in  many  cases  in  the  actual  efficiency  of  the  work. 

The  question  as  to  whether  there  should  be  a  long  term  of  office  or  whether 
there  should  be  an  indefinite  tenure  of  office  is  a  somewhat  different  one.  I  have 
felt  that  probably  in  large  cities  a  reasonably  long  term  of  office  was  somewhat 
better  than  an  indefinite  tenure,  although  I  do  not  wish  to  go  on  record  as  being 
absolutely  convinced  as  to  which  is  the  better  policy.  I  can  see  some  strong  argu- 
ments in  favor  of  the  indefinite  tenure.  By  indefinite  tenure  I  mean  that  the 
question  of  re-election  does  not  come  up  unless  there  is  a  definite  desire  to  dis- 
miss a  superintendent.  In  the  case  of  indefinite  tenure  I  think  that  the  law  govern- 
ing the  appointment  of  the  superintendent,  or  his  dismissal,  should  demand  more 
than  a  plurality  of  the  votes  of  the  board  of  education.  If  a  superintendent  cannot 
be  dismissed  save  by  a  reasonably  large  majority,  three-fourths  for  example,  it  may 
be  perfectly  proper  indeed  to  have  him  subject  to  a  termination  of  his  term  at 
any  time.  In  general,  though,  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  the  long  term  of  office 
is  the  better  solution.  Certainly  it  is  far  better  than  having  every  year  a  definite 
issue  as  to  whether  a  school  superintendent  can  command  a  certain  number  of 
votes  in  order  to  be  able  to  remain  in  his  position.  I  repeat  that  in  my  judgment 
that  particular  reform  is  one  of  the  fundamentally  necessary  things  if  there  is  to 
be  definitely  constructive  work  in  this  or  in  any  other  city  which  has  the  annual 
term. 

INEFFICIENCY  OF  LARGE  BOARDS  OF  EDUCATION. 

The  question  as  to  the  appointment  of  boards  of  education  is  again  a  very  de- 
batable one.  Most  educational  thinkers  agree  that  the  most  efficient  board  of 
education  is  the  small  board  of  education.  The  term  "small"  however  is  more  or 
less  flexible.  In  many  cases  "small"  is  interpreted  to  mean  five,  and  we  have 
cases  of  boards  of  education,  such  as  Indianapolis,  Denver,  Boston,  and  others, 
where  we  have  a  board  of  education  of  five.  In  my  judgment  a  large  city  cannot 
do  its  business  to  the  best  advantage  with  a  board  as  small  as  five,  unless  there 
is  a  very  radical  change  as  to  the  limitation  of  the  duties  of  the  board  of  educa- 
tion. Any  large  city,  such  as  Chicago,  should  have  more  than  five.  It  should  not 
have  a  large  board,  but  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  the  board  of  twenty-one  as  we 
have  in  Detroit,  and  I  understand  you  have  the  same  in  Chicago,  is  rather  larger 
than  can  work  efficiently.  There  is  a  tendency  to  have  more  committees  than 
there  should  be,  and  there  is  a  pretty  strong  tendency  to  have  the  activities  of 
those  committees  work  in  such  a  way  that  a  superintendent  or  administrative 
official  is  compelled  to  work  with  what  amounts  to  two  or  three  boards  of  educa- 
tion more  or  less  ignorant  of  the  activities  of  each  other. 

I  know  that  is  true  to  a  very  great  extent  in  Detroit,  that  the  various  com- 
mittees are  practically  supreme  in  their  work  and  are  practically  ignorant  of  the 
equally  important  work  of  other  committees.  A  small  board  has  an  opportunity 
to  work  out  important  things,  which  are  directed  and  determined  in  the  committee 
of  the  whole,  and  there  is  a  general  appreciation  of  the  problem  of  the  school  sys- 


y  v.  26 

tern.  There  has  been  a  tendency  to  give  to  board  committees  the  detailed  work 
which  always,  in  my  judgment,  should  be  transacted  by  those  who  are  expert 
in  their  field,  rather  than  by  those  whose  tenure  of  office  is  necessarily  limited  and 
who  enter  into  responsible  duties  without  training  of  any  kind. 

SEPARATE  BUSINESS  DEPARTMENT  UNSOUND. 

In  almost  all  cities  at  the  present  time  another  element  of  weakness,  in  my 
judgment,  is  found  in  the  complete  separation  of  the  educational  and  business 
functions  of  the  board,  or  of  the  officials  appointed  by  the  board.  A  very  common 
condition  is  the  existence  of  the  office  of  the  superintendent  of  schools,  who  is 
more  or  less  in  charge  of  the  educational  side  of  the  work,  and  of  the  business 
manager,  and  often  of  the  supervisor  of  buildings,  some  times  the  two  latter 
positions  being  combined  into  one;  the  two  or  three  officials  being  coordinate  in 
power,  each  reporting  directly  to  the  board  of  education.  From  my  point  of  view 
efficiency  in  management  can  be  secured  only  when  there  is  one  chief  executive 
officer  to  whom  all  other  officers  are  subordinate.  A  business  manager,  in  my 
judgment,  in  other  words,  should  be  necessarily  equal  in  authority  to  any  other 
subordinate  officer,  but  directly  under  the  authority  of  the  superintendent,  the 
board  of  education  dealing  directly  with  the  superintendent  of  schools.  Under 
those  conditions  we  have  a  framework  out  of  which  efficiency  arises. 

Alderman  Buck:  The  same  principle  that  you  would  apply  to  the  business 
manager,  would  you  apply  to  all  the  department  heads  outside  of  the  teaching 
force?  I  mean  such  as  secretary  or  treasurer,  or  whatever  official  it  might  be,  the 
head  of  the  janitor  service,  and  all  that,  you  would  have  all  those  under  the  super- 
intendent? •  , 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Yes,  I  would  have  the  superintendent  the  chief  officer  and  en- 
trusted with  the  executive  work,  all  other  officers  being  subordinate  to  him.  I 
will  add  that  the  superintendent  should  have  the  nomination  of  all  his  officers, 
subject  in  all  cases  to  the  approval  of  the  board  of  education.  I  make  a  very 
sharp  distinction  there  because  it  is  a  power  which  I  do  not  have  at  the  present 
time,  which  I  think  results  in  relative  inefficiency  in  Detroit.  In  Detroit  the 
superintendent,  as  in  many  places,  has  no  power  definitely  except  such  as  may  be 
given  him  by  implication,  and  the  power  of  nominating  the  officials  and  principals 
is  not  his.  So  far  as  the  appointment  of  teachers  is  concerned,  he  has  had  no 
difficulty  in  having  all  of  his  nominations  accepted  by  the  board  of  education,  and 
practically  in  all  cases  the  promotions  to  principalship  or  to  positions  of  greater 
responsibility.  This,  however,  at  all  times  is  merely  a  usurpation.  The  rules  do 
not  require  that  the  superintendent  shall  nominate.  I  think  the  superintendent 
should  nominate,  and  if  there  is  any  reason  for  thinking  that  there  is  a  miscarriage 
of  justice,  or  that  his  judgment  is  at  fault,  there  can  be  a  check  upon  Jiim  by  the 
failure  to  confirm.  So  I  think  the  same  thing  should  be  true  of  the  business  side. 

BUSINESS  MANAGER  SHOULD  BE  AN  EDUCATOR. 

I  am  inclined  to  think  that  a  custom,  which  is  very  common  in  our  cities,  of 
appointing  a  man  as  business  manager  who  is  more  or  less  successful  as  a  business 
man  but  is  not  an  educator,  is  a  great  mistake,  because  a  man  who  has  had  his 
experience,  who  has  lived  his  life  in  different  surroundings,  and  in  studying  other 
problems,  is  not  in  a  position  to  know  definitely  the  needs  of  a  school,  not  nearly  so 
much  so  as  those  who  have  risen  to  their  positions  from  the  ranks  of  the  school, 
and  therefore  know  the  necessities  of  the  school  and  the  urgent  needs  of  the  things 
which  will  be  demanded.  A  business  manager,  in  my  judgment,  should  be  an  edu- 
cator, who  has  shown  in  other  ways  qualifications  which  will  enable  him  to  per- 
form the  business  work.  In  a  large  city  there  is  no  difficulty  in  securing  such  indi- 
viduals. In  the  first  place  teachers  are  educated  to  their  trade,  and  their  numbers 
in  large  cities  are  so  great  that  among  them  will  always  be  found  those  who  have 
the  capacity,  who  have  shown  their  ability  in  educational  work  as  well  as  their 
ability  to  serve  in  positions  of  executive  responsibility. 

Alderman  Buck:  On  the  question  of  the  relations  of  the  board  of  education 
to  the  city  council  under  circumstances  such  as  we  have  here,  for  instance,  do  you 


27 

think  that  the  control  of  the  financial  affairs  of  the  schools  should  be  divided  in 
that  way,  between  two  bodies,  such  as  the  council  and  the  board  of  education? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  You  are  speaking  about  the  present  condition  or  an  "ideal" 
condition? 

Alderman  Buck:    No,  I  am  speaking  about  an  ideal  condition. 

ELECTED  OFFICIALS  SHOULD  CONTROL  FINANCES. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  am  inclined  to  think  that,  in  the  last  analysis,  individuals 
who  are  elected  by  the  people  should  have  the  final  responsibility  of  determining  as 
to  the  amount  of  expenditure  which  the  city  may  incur.  If  a  board  of  education  is 
elected  by  the  people,  and  the  methods  of  nomination  and  election  are  such  that 
the  people  are  really  represented,  I  see  no  objection  whatever  to  that  board  of  edu- 
cation having  the  power  of  levying  the  tax.  If  the  board  of  education  is  an 
appointive  board,  and  therefore  is  further  away  from  the  people,  I  am  inclined  to 
believe  that  it  is  wise  for  some  other  body  to  have  the  veto  power — some  elective 
body,  for  the  preservation  of  the  rights  of  the  people,  and  that  body  should  have  a 
veto  upon  the  financial  acts  of  the  board  of  education. 

The  school  system  is  in  all  respects  the  most  important  branch  of  government. 
It  involves  the  largest  expenditure  of  money;  it  is  nearest  to  the  hearts  of  the 
people.  Educators  can  appeal  to  the  people  for  financial  support  with  a  greater 
assurance  of  a  hearty  response  than  can  any  other  group  of  public  servants,  and 
therefore  they  should  be  willing  to  trust  the  wisdom  of  the  people,  and  in  a  large 
community  the  people  have  to  be  represented  by  some  group  of  elected  officials. 
Does  that  answer  your  question? 

Alderman  Buck:  Yes,  I  would  like  to  follow  it  with  another  question.  In  the 
event  of  a  board  that  is  appointed  and  that  should,  in  your  view,  be  subject  to  veto 
power  in  fiscal  matters  by  an  elected  body,  to  what  degree  should  that  co-operation 
extend,  to  what  degree  of  detail  should  the  elected  body  go  in  understanding  the 
fiscal  situation  with  which  it  has  to  deal  in  connection  with  schools? 

DETAILED  BUDGET  TO  PRECEDE  TAX  LEVY. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Let  us  assume  as  a  concrete  example  that  we  have  a  board  of 
education  which  prepares  an  annual  estimate  of  expenditures,  and  that  we  have  a 
city  council  which  has  the  power  to  check  the  estimates  of  expenditures  of  the 
board  of  education.  In  such  a  case  I  think  that  the  board  of  education  should, 
through  its  officers,  prepare  each  year  a  reasonably  detailed  budget  showing  the 
proposed  expenditures  along  the  various  lines  of  school  expenditure,  before  the 
tax  levy.  When  is  the  tax  levy  made  here? 

Alderman  Buck:  Before  the  first  of  January,  1916,  the  board  of  education 
submits  its  estimate  for  the  1917  tax  levy.  The  city  council  makes  that  tax 
levy  during  the  first  three  months  of  the  year. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Before  the  first  of  January,  1917,  the  board  of  education  should 
submit  an  estimate  for  the  money  to  be  expended  in  1918.  Then  the  board  of  edu- 
cation would  be  making  an  estimate  in  the  fall  of  1916,  which  would  amount  to  a 
given  sum  of  money,  which  would  be  handed  over  to  the  council  and  would  be  cer- 
tified out  some  time  in  the  spring  of  1917  and  would  be  collected  during  the  year 
and  would  become  available  for  expenditure  by  the  schools  in  1918,  is  that  correct  1 
It  makes  the  problem  of  the  budget  somewhat  more  difficult.  I  think  that  it  should 
be  the  effort  of  the  board  of  education  to  submit,  before  January,  1917,  its  estimate 
of  the  various  expenditures  that  will  be  incurred  during  the  year  1918. 

Alderman  Buck:     An  estimate  based  upon  a  program? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  An  estimate  based  upon  the  present  necessary  expenditures,  let 
us  say,  for  teachers'  salaries,  with  as  careful  estimate  as  could  be  made  of  the 
probable  salaries  to  be  paid  in  1918;  the  number  of  new  teachers  that  under  normal 
conditions,  with  the  present  rate  of  growth,  could  be  assumed  to  be  necessary,  and 
should  include  all  probable  increases  in  salaries,  that  might  be  put  into  effect.  In 
a  similar  way,  based  upon  experience,  in  the  case  of  buildings,  the  amount  which 
had  been  secured  for  1917  could  be  considered,  and  the  am.ount  of  money  necessary 
for  buildings  could  be  estimated  for  1918,  also  the  amount  necessary  for  main- 


28  ;'-;- 

tenance,  extension,  educational  supplies,  and  other  special  expenditures,  whatever 
they  may  happen  to  be.  Having  done  that  as  well  as  possible,  let  it  be  made  a 
matter  of  record  and  published  in  the  proceedings  of  the  board  and  the  city 
council. 

COUNCIL  VETO  ON  BUDGET  OF  APPOINTIVE  BOARD. 

The  city  council,  in  my  judgment,  should  have  the  power  of  survey  of  the 
budget  and  should  determine  in  a  general  way  what  in  its  judgment  are  under- 
estimates and  what  are  over-estimates  and  modify  in  its  best  judgment  the  total 
appropriation.  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  there  should  be  an  appropriation  of  a 
sum  total  of  all  the  various  items,  and  if  the  total  was  greater  or  less  than  the 
estimate  which  had  been  submitted  it  should  be  made  a  matter  of  record  as  to  why 
these  changes  were  made.  If  the  city  council  felt  that  there  was  an  excessive 
appropriation  or  felt  that  there  was  an  insufficient  appropriation,  or  if  they  had 
misjudged  in  reference  to  the  number  of  teachers,  the  reason  should  be  given  for 
requesting  its  change.  There  I  think  the  authority  of  the  city  council  should  end, 
because  the  actions  of  the  board  of  education  are  or  should  be  public  property. 

It  should  be  possible,  at  the  expiration  of  the  business  year,  1918,  for  any 
interested  individual,  whether  public  official  or  private  individual,  to  see  just  to 
what  extent  the  actual  expenditures  have  varied  from  the  estimated  expenditures, 
and  the  board  of  education  should  be  able  and  should  be  willing  if  occasion  should 
arise  to  explain  why  the  .expenditures  have  been  different  from  what  was  antici- 
pated. It  is  bound  to  differ,  especially  in  a  growing  city,  for  it  is  impossible  for  a 
board  to  figure  any  one  of  these  amounts  with  anything  approaching  accuracy. 

When  it  comes  to  the  expenditure  of  the  money  I  believe  that  the  board  should 
be  supreme.  Controversies  will  be  apt  to  arise,  or  changes  of  condition  may  arise 
which  will  make  it  a  perfectly  feasible  matter  to  expend  less  on  certain  lines  than 
have  been  anticipated,  or  other  emergencies  might  arise  which  would  make  it 
necessary  to  expend  more  for  other  demands  than  had  been  anticipated,  and  the 
judgment  of  the  board  of  education  should  be  final  on  these  questions  and  it 
should  be  perfectly  proper  to  change  its  estimate — transfer  from  one  fund  to 
another  without  any  criticism  of  juggling,  but  at  the  same  time  the  matter  must  be 
a  matter  of  public  record. 

Alderman  Buck:  And  the  board  could  explain  if  there  was  anyone  interested 
or  felt  an  explanation  was  due? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  believe  personally  in  absolute  publicity  in  all  questions  that 
have  to  do  with  the  public,  and  the  officials  should  not  consider  the  demand  for  an 
explanation  in  any  way  an  impertinent  demand. 

BUDGET  REPLACES  VOTING  ON  EACH  EXPENDITURE. 

Alderman  Buck :  Having  made  a  budget  of  that  kind  based  upon  a  calculated 
program  before  the  tax  levy,  and  appropriations  based  upon  the  budget,  should 
the  board  of  education  then,  in  your  judgment,  consider  in  detail  each  expenditure 
throughout  the  year. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Decidedly  not.  If  we  do  that  we  drop  right  back  to  the  original 
condition  which  I  described  as  in  my  judgment  very  undesirable.  We  then  have 
committees  of  individuals  who  are  not  familiar  with  the  needs  of  schools  consid- 
ering in  detail  bills  and  expenditures,  expending  an  immense  amount  of  time  and 
doing  very  inefficiently  a  piece  of  work  which  can  be  done  efficiently  or  should  be 
done  efficiently  by  the  officials  of  the  board  of  education.  These  officials  should 
submit  to  the  superintendent  detailed  statements  as  to  their  expenditure  and  be 
able  and  willing  to  defend  any  individual  act.  The  main  duty,  however,  I  think,  of 
the  committee  on  finance  or  any  special  committee  of  the  board  of  education, 
should  consist  in  scrutinizing  these  reports  and  in  securing  information  where 
something  seems  questionable,  and  in  a  general  way  to  limit  the  total  expenditures 
for  a  given  purpose,  and  perhaps  in  a  way  checking  the  officer,  if  there  seem  to 
be  need  of  such  check.  In  other  words,  the  attitude  of  the  committees  of  the 
board  of  education  towards  the  superintendent  or  his  officials,  working  through  the 
superintendent,  should  be  almost  exactly  those  of  a  board  of  directors  with  refer- 
ence to  the  actions  of  the  officials  of  the  bank. 

Alderman  Buck:     You  suggest  that  the  business  management  should  not  be 


29. 

separated  from  the  educational  management.  What  would  you  think  of  the  ques- 
tion of  levying  two  separate  taxes,  one  for  educational  purposes  and  one  for 
building  purposes? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  If  it  is  possible  for  a  city  to  include  in  its  general  tax  levy 
the  moneys  that  are  necessary  for  the  erection  of  new  buildings — I  understand 
that  has  been  true  in  Chicago  in  the  past — I  should  still  feel  that  the  levy  should 
be  a  single  levy,  and  that  the  board  should  have  discrimination  in  amending  its 
estimate,  as  I  said  before,  subject  to  the  original  scrutiny  of  the  city  council 
whose  duties,  however,  are  finally  practically  limited  merely  by  the  power  to  raise 
or  lower  the  total  levy,  the  reasons  for  their  recommendations  as  to  the  details 
in  the  budget  which  should  be  changed  being  shown. 

From  the  Audience:     What  about  Detroit? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  feel  that  if  I  should  say  anything  about  Detroit  I  would  be 
holding  up  a  horrible  example.  The  Detroit  situation  is  worse  than  the  Chicago 
situation.  The  people  are  going  to  vote  in  November  on  the  question  of  abolishing 
the  present  board  of  education. 

Alderman  Buck:     That  is  the  present  scheme  of  organization? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Yes,  sir.  Nearly  everything  that  I  have  suggested  as  desirable 
are  things  gained  from  personal  experience,  and  having  experienced  the  opposite 
condition  so  long  I  am  convinced  that  they  are  necessary.  There  is  a  very  healthy 
sentiment  in  Detroit  as  to  its  schools,  and  I  think  that  the  school  people  of  Detroit 
can  nearly  always  trust  to  the  judgment  of  the  people.  When  I  said  that  the 
present  board  of  education  should  be  abolished,  I  was  casting  no  reflection  upon 
the  individual  members  of  the  board,  but  we  have  a  board  of  twenty-one  elected 
by  wards. 

Alderman  Buck:    One  from  each  ward? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  One  from  each  ward.  They  are  elected  on  a  partisan  ballot. 
The  democrats  have  no  show  at  all  in  most  of  the  wards  of  Detroit.  Most  of  our 
wards  are  strongly  republican.  The  children  in  one  ward  may  attend  schools  in 
another  ward.  It  brings  about  a  condition  also  where  many  members  of  the  board 
may  have  more  vital  interest  in  the  appointment  of  janitors  than  anything  else. 
Therefore  it  has  done  much  harm  because,  in  many  cases,  the  board  interests  have 
been  so  far  removed  from  the  interest  of  the  school.  They  have,  in  most  cases, 
permitted  the  superintendent  to  go  ahead  and  do  almost  anything  he  thought  was 
best. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  the  matter  of  finances,  if  I  understood  you  correctly  you 
thought  that  the  superintendent  should  be  the  executive  not  only  on  the  educa- 
tional side  but  on  the  administrative  side,  for  example,  he  would  have  supervision 
over  janitors'  supplies  and  of  things  in  the  building  department? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  felt  that  the  officer  who  purchased  the  supplies  should  be 
recognized  as  a  subordinate  official  and  recognize  the  superintendent  as  the 
superior  official.  If  the  purchasing  agent  is  not  a  subordinate  official  he  may  delay 
unduly  the  purchase  of  certain  supplies  where  promptness  is  absolutely  necessary, 
because  in  his  judgment  it  is  not  worth  while,  or  he  is  a  little  too  busy.  If  he  was 
a  subordinate  official  to  the  superintendent  he  could  not  do  this. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb :  Would  that  expect  to  go  so  far  as  to  allow  the  superintendent 
to  veto  the  acts  of  the  business  manager? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  think  the  superintendent  should  have  the  power  of  veto,  yes, 
always,  subject  to  appeal  to  the  board  of  education. 

CIVIL  SERVICE  FOR  SCHOOL  EMPLOYES. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  As  to  civil  service  now,  does  civil  service,  in  your  opinion, 
often  result  in  stagnation,  or  do  you  think  it  works  out  better  than  a  system  in 
which  civil  service  is  combined  with  power — 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Do  you  mean  by  civil  service  that  there  would  be  an  examina- 
tion and  that  the  officials  should  be  compelled  to  appoint  those  individuals  who 
have  passed  an  examination? 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     Yes,  sir. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  My  judgment  has  been  that  so  far  as  civil  service  in  Detroit  in 
concerned  it  has  not  been  effective  in  the  employment  of  officers,  and  it  seems  to 
me  that  it  is  necessary  on  the  business  side  in  Detroit  to  have  some,  method  of  se- 


30 

curing  competent  officials  and  some  method  of  their  promptly  getting  rid  of  incom- 
petent officials.  We  have  no  civil  service  in  the  public  schools  in  Detroit.  Any 
employe  other  than  teachers  may  be  dropped  at  any  time  for  cause. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     Has  that  led  to  abuses  in  practice? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  No,  I"  think  the  abuses  we  have  had  have  been  of  the  other 
kind,  that  it  has  been  rather  hard  to  get  rid  of  incompetent  employes  under  a 
system  which  is  tremendously  political,  as  it  is  when  you  have  a  ward  system  of 
election. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     Who  appoints  them  now? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  In  theory  the  board  of  education  appoints  them,  but  it  appoints 
them  upon  the  recommendation  of  the  committee  on  janitors,  which  in  practice 
generally  defers  to  the  inspector  of  the  ward.  I  have  no  doubt  myself  that  I 
could,  if  I  had  the  authority,  hire  all  the  janitors  in  Detroit  and  get  better  service 
and  save  $50,000  to  $75,000  a  year. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  find  that  the  appointment  of  employes  other  than 
teachers  without  civil  service  is  more  conducive  to  efficiency  than  it  would  be  with 
civil  service  and  is  it  less  difficult  to  get  rid  of  inefficient  employes  without  civil 
service  than  it  would  be  with  civil  service? 

Mr.  Chadsey:     I  said  that  with  reference  to  conditions  in  Detroit. 

Alderman  Buck:  That  is  what  I  mean.  You  based  your  whole  answer  on 
civil  service  on  conditions  in  Detroit. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Yes,  I  think  that  with  the  business  manager  an  assistant  or  as- 
sociate superintendent  with  a  supervisor  of  engineers  and  janitors,  that  had  the 
power  of  appointment  and  had  the  power  of  removal  subject  to  the  approval  of  the 
superintendent,  we  would  have  something  approximating  civil  service  without  its 
weakness.  The  great  difficulty  with  the  ordinary  civil  service  is  that  the  examiner 
has  not  devised  an  examination  which  in  any  way  indicates  the  effectiveness  of 
the  candidate. 

Alderman  Buck:  But  as  to  the  difficulty  of  getting  rid  of  inefficients  where 
politics  prevail  in  the  absence  of  civil  service,  the  difficulty  is  as  great? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Yes,  where  politics  prevail  I  think  civil  service  probably  would 
improve  conditions.  I  will  say  with  reference  to  this  problem  that  I  think  it  is 
important  that  a  school  system  should  be  independent  of  the  local  political  situa- 
tion so  far  as  appointments  are  concerned. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  the  case  of  a  vacancy  on  the  board  of  education  is  it  im- 
portant whether  'or  not  it  should  be  filled  by  election? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  think  that  is  a  question  that  should  be  answered  with  refer- 
ence to  the  individual  case.  Personally  I  cannot  see  any  reason  why  the  school 
board  members  should  ever  be  elected  on  a  partisan  ticket.  It  would  be  perfectly 
ridiculous  to  think  of  a  man's  national  brand  of  politics  having  anything  whatever 
to  do  with  his  qualifications,  and  equally  ridiculous  to  believe  that  a  man  who 
happens  to  be  identified  with  a  political  party  which  is  not  in  control  in  his  ward, 
or  in  his  city,  being  thereby  debarred  from  a  position,  which  is  or  should  be  a 
position  of  great  honor  and  trust  in  the  community.  The  intelligent  voter,  in 
voting  for  a  board  member,  should  always  vote  for  the  woman  or  man  who  can  be 
trusted  as  having  the  genuine  interests  of  the  people  at  heart. 

The  Chairman:     Does  any  one  desire  to  ask  any  further  questions? 

Miss  Margaret  Haley:  I  would  like  to  ask  Mr.  Chadsey  who  appoints  the 
inspectors  who  pass  on  this — • 

Mr.  Chadsey:  The  inspector  in  Detroit  is  the  board  member.  We  have  that 
title  of  inspector.  We  have  a  board  of  education  of  twenty-one  school  inspectors. 
They  are  representing  each  a  single  ward;  there  are  twenty-one  wards  in  Detroit. 
These  men  are  nominated  at  a  partisan  primary,  and  are  voted  for  at  the  ordinary 
spring  election,  which  I  say  is  as. absolutely  bad  a  system  as  you  can  find  anywhere 
in  the  United  States. 

Alderman  Buck:     Are  those  board  members  salaried? 
Mr.  Chadsey:     They  are  not. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Did  I  understand  you  to  say,  Mr.  Chadsey,  that  that 
system  is  about  to  be  put  to  a  vote  at  the  next  election? 


31 

DETROIT  FOR   SMALL  BOARD   ELECTED  AT  LARGE. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Four  years  ago  the  state  legislature  passed  a  bill  abolishing  the 
present  board  of  education,  and  substituting  for  it  a  board  of  education  of  seven 
members,  elected  at  large,  with  a  referendum  provision,  that  this  should  be  voted 
upon  by  the  electors  of  Detroit  at  the  next  general  election.  At  the  time  oJLthe 
next  general  election  the  question  was  before  the  Supreme  Court,  and  was  not 
voted  upon.  Shortly  after  the  election  a  decision  was  handed  down  that  it  was 
a  perfectly  legal  thing  to  vote  upon,  but  it  postponed  the  effort  for  two  years; 
so  now,  after  four  years,  is  the  first  opportunity  for  Detroit  to  determine  whether 
it  wishes  to  have  the  present  board  of  education  abolished  or  not.  There  is  every 
prospect  that  a  large  vote  will  be  polled  in  favor  of  abolishing  it,  although,  of 
course,  I  could  not  predict  the  result  as  yet.* 

Alderman  Kennedy:     There  will  then  be  an  elected  board  of  seven  members? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  There  will  then  be  an  elected  board  of  seven  members,  yes, 
elected  at  large,  for  a  term  of  six  years;  two  of  them  being  elected  for  two  years, 
two  for  four,  and  three  for  six  years.  They  still,  however,  hold  a  partisan  pri- 
mary. These  people  will  be  nominated  at  partisan  primaries,  but  will  be  voted  for 
by  the  people  at  large  without  any  indication  on  the  ballot  as  to  the  politics  of 
the  individual.  If  there  are  two  parties  there  will  be,  therefore,  14  candidates  for 
the  people  to  vote  for,  they  voting  for  7,  and  the  7  having  the  largest  vote  being 
elected. 

Alderman  Buck:  Now,  if  you  will  proceed  to  discuss  the  relation  of  the 
teachers  to  the  system,  Mr.  Chadsey,  please. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  suppose  the  particular  matter  of  interest  with  reference  to 
that  has  to  do  with  appointments  and  tenure  of  office.  In  my  judgment  there 
should  be  very  definite  qualifications  established  for  the  position  of  teacher  in  -a 
school  system. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  Pardon  me  just  a  moment,  Mr.  Chadsey.  That  brings  to  my 
mind  a  question  I  wanted  to  ask  you. 

Mr.  Chadsey:     Certainly.    That  is  what  I  want  you  to  do. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  In  your  judgment,  in  cases  where  cities  have  elective  sys- 
tems, should  a  candidate  for  the  school  board  have  certain  definite  statutory 
qualifications? 

BOARD  MEMBERS  SHOULD  BE  LAYMEN. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  think  personally  that  qualifications  for  board  mem- 
bers should  differ  from  those  of  any  other  public  official,  because  we  are  anxious,  or 
should  be  anxious,  to  have  the  people  represented;  and  certainly  if  our  qualifica- 
tions for  other  officials  are  too  low,  we  should  go  ahead  and  change  those,  and 
have  them  all  the  same.  I  do  not  know  why  a  board  member  should  be  a  man  of 
a  different  character  than  a  member  of  the  common  council.  Certainly  they  are 
dealing  in  both  cases  with  matters  of  tremendous  significance  to  the  community. 

T  was  saying  that  I  thought  that  there  should  be  definite  standards  of  eligibility 
for  the  position  of  teacher  and  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  those  standards  should 
be  just  as  high  as  can  possibly  be  secured.  Most  of  our  larger  cities  now  have 
settled  that  problem  fairly  satisfactorily.  They  have  normal  training  schools,  or 
local  universities,  the  graduates  of  which  have  had  certain  specific  professional 
training,  who  are  eligible.  Some  cities  have  certain  definite  examinations;  others 
simply  have  the  definite  local  standard;  but  in  some  way  or  other  the  poorly  equip- 
ped individual  should  be  disqualified  from  consideration.  In  the  second  place,  I 
think  that  the  superintendent  should  be  definitely  responsible  for  the  nominations 
of  all  of  the  teachers.  No  person  should  be  imposed  upon  a  school  system  save 
through  the  superintendent.  I  do  not  think  that  that  implies  despotism  at  all  on 
the  part  of  the  superintendent;  nor  do  I  think  that  that  implies  the  foisting  of  any 
incompetents  upon  a  school  system;  because  I  would  add  to  that,  that  the  board  of 
education  should  have  a  veto  power  upon  the  nominations  of  any  individual,  so 
that  there  would  be  a  check  upon  the  superintendent  in  that  respect. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  Let  me  ask  you  one  question  right  there.  Would  you  place 
no  restriction  on  the  power  to  veto  such  nominations?  Would  you  make  it  abso- 
lute, or  would  you  require  some  stated  cause? 

*At  the  election  of  November  1916,  the  new  pjan  for  Detroit  was  adopted  bv  an  overwhelming 
majority  of  the  voters, 


32 

ELECTED  BOARD  RESPONSIBLE  TO  PUBLIC. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  go  right  back  to  my  fundamental  proposition,  that  the  board 
of  education,  an  elected  board  of  education  that  represents  the  city,  is  definitely 
responsible  to  the  city,  and  it  should  have  certainly  a  definite  check  upon  the 
superintendent.  I  think  that  that  particular  question,  as  to  whether  it  might  be 
necessary  to  state  a  cause,  rather  answers  itself.  I  think  they  would  be  forced  to 
state  a  cause.  I  do  not  believe  the  people  would  permit  the  arbitrary  rejection  of 
nominations  by  a  superintendent  for  positions  on  a  teaching  force,  without  some 
statement  as  to  why. 

My  own  experience  is  that  officials,  who  are  elected  directly  by  the  people, 
are  very  anxious  to  know  what  the  people  think;  and  that  about  all  that  is  neces- 
sary for  an  individual  who  wishes  to  have  a  good  thing  done  for  a  city  that  can 
be  done  by  an  elected  group,  is  to  persuade  that  group  that  the  people,  the  voters 
of  the  city  really  want  it.  I  believe  that,  with  the  public  schools  as  near  to  the 
heart  of  the  people  as  they  are,  if  the  board  of  education  attempted  to  prevent  a 
superintendent  from  putting  in  people  who  were  qualified  there  would  soon  be  such 
a  reaction  that  it  would  find  those  votes  reconsidered.  As  a  matter  of  detail,  it 
might  well  be  in  the  rules  of  the  board  of  education  that  in  such  cases  there  shall 
be  a  definite  statement  as  to  the  cause;  but  that,  I  think,  is  really  minor  to  the 
general  scheme.  Now,  the  teacher  having  been  put  to  work,  I  am  inclined  to  be- 
lieve that  there  should  be — 

Alderman  Buck:  Just  a  moment,  Mr.  Chadsey.  Pardon  me  for  the  interrup- 
tion. A  board  appointed  by  the  mayor,  with  the  concurrence  of  the  city  council, 
and  not  elected  by  the  people — should  that  board  have  the  veto  power  over  nomina- 
tions for  teachers  by  the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  believe  that  I  would  have  any  right  to  discriminate  be- 
tween the  powers  of  appointed  or  elected  boards  of  education.  If  the  appointed 
board  cannot  be  trusted  to  do  the.  right  thing,  then  it  is  certainly  up  to  the 
community  to  change  the  method  of  appointment. 

There  are  varying  schools  of  political  thought,  as  you  all  know,  some  of  which 
are  inclined  to  believe  that  the  powers  of  a  city  should  be  very,  very  sharply  lim- 
ited by  the  power  of  the  state;  and  that  a  city  should  have  little  power  to  deter- 
mine its  conduct  of  public  affairs,  and  that  everything  that  is  done  should  be  done 
as  a  result  of  statutory  requirement.  There  is  another  school  of  political  thought 
which  feels  that  practically  everything  that  a  city  does  should  be  done  finally  by 
that  city.  The  practical  working  out  of  that  problem  is  altogether  too  complex 
for  discussion  at  this  time;  and  the  question  as  to  whether  there  should  be  statu- 
tory limitations,  or  whether  those  limitations  should  be  imposed  by  the  city  council, 
or  by  the  board  of  education  itself,  depends  very  largely  upon  those  local  condi- 
tions. In  speaking  generally,  though,  I  will  repeat  what  I  said  in  the  first  part  of 
this  talk,  that  there  is  great  need  for  a  very  definite  limitation  of  the  powers  of 
both  the  superintendent  and  the  board  of  education;  and  if,  in  the  working  out  of 
those  definite  statements,  it  would  seem  well  to  incorporate  this  particular  one,  it 
should  be  there.  But  I  cannot  speak  with  any  great  authority,  because  we  are 
now  dealing  with  a  condition  which  obtains  in  very  few  places  in  the  United 
States.  The  city  superintendent  in  most  cases  is  merely  working  along,  without 
any  legal  authority  for  anything,  or  by  mere  sufferance  of  the  board  of  education, 
and  possibly  in  some  cases  by  rules  passed  by  the  board  of  education;  but  they 
could  be  suspended  or  repealed  at  any  meeting  of  the  board  of  education. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Mr.  Chadsey,  speaking  in  regard  to  this  and  other  mat- 
ters, where  the  powers  of  a  board  of  education  would  be  exercised,  depending 
somewhat  on  what  sort  of  a  board  of  education  we  are  going  to  get,  do  you  think 
the  system  which  is  proposed  for  Detroit,  where  they  are  to  elect  seven  at  largb, 
providing  the  elections  were  conducted  in  a  non-partisan  way,  would  be  a  very 
satisfactory  system  for  a  city  the  size  of  Detroit? 

ENDORSES  ELECTED  SCHOOL  BOARD. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  think  that  at  the  present  time  it  is  the  safest  plan  that  can 
be  suggested.  I  think  that,  given  certain  officials,  a  far  better  board  of  education 
may  be  secured  when  appointed  than  when  elected;  but  experience  teaches  us  that 


33 


in  manv,  many  cases  the  appointments  of  mayors,  if  the  mayor  is  t 
power,  are  not  as  desirable  as  the  individuals  who  may  be  elec tod« 
more/that  these  appointed  members,  being  further  removed  ^ 
IPSS  likelv  to  be  influenced  by  the  genuine  convictions  of  the  people  than  a ,  boarc 
elected  by  th people.     And7!  confe  back  every  time  to  the  propositior L  thai ;  we 
have  got  to  have  an  intelligent  electorate,  and  that  the  only  way  to  f£^M^- 
gent  electorate  is  to  have  that  electorate  have  its  responsibilities,  and  be  educate 
up  to  seeing  and  appreciating  those  responsibilities. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     In  practice,  have  elective  boards  worked 

POintMre  Sey:  I  think  they  have  worked  exactly  as  well  I  have  in  mind 
several  appointive  boards,  and  several  elective  boards,  ^_"£»**J"J  ^£ 
very  good  boards  in  mind,  and  very  poor  bo,ards  in  mind  Where  we have small 
board!  elected  at  large,  we  generally  have  very  «^*  *J^**2  of  People 
as  the  interest  of  the  people  diminishes,  and  somewhat  differ ent  classes  of  pe iple 
get  in  who  do  not  always  do  apparently  as  good  work  as  they  should,  a  different 
situation  arises.  But  even  then,  I  insist  that  the  people  are  getting  as  goo 
school  board  as  the  people  are  entitled  to,  if  they  did  the  electing 

Mr  Max  Loeb:  On  the  question  of  efficiency  of  teachers,  in  Detroit  have  you 
a  system  of  promotion  by  seniority— a  teacher  going  up  as  her  years 

m°UMrUIChadsey:    We  have  in  Detroit-ana  I  realize  the  significance  of  that  ques- 
tion—a mechanical  system  of  promotion.    I  am  not  prepared  to  defend  it  as 
absolutely  correct  system.    In  fact,  I  doubt  whether  it  is  theoretically  the  i 
correct  system;  but  at  the  present  time  I  do  feel  strongly  that  if  a  teacher  is  worth 
keeping  in  the  schools  at  all,  she  is  worthy  of  the  maximum  salary  that  is  paid  to  a 
teacher  of  her  class.    If  the  maximum  salaries  were  very  much  higher    1 tn: 
could  theoretically  wish  for  some  place  where  I  might  step  in  and  say 
not  go  on  unless  you  have  proven  that  you  have  secured  a  higher  emciency  t 
most  of  the  other  teachers";   but  we  only  pay  $1,000  there  to  our  elem 
teachers,  and  if  a  teacher  is  worth   anything   at   all,   she   is   certainly  wortl 
thousand  dollars  a  year.    So  I  would  not  in  Chicago— with  the  maximum  salaries 
as  I  understand  it,  no  higher  than  they  are  in  the  elementary  schools  here— 
that  the  maximum  salary  was  too  high  for  a  teacher  who  was  worth  retaining. 

I  would  add  to  that,  that  there  should  be  some  definite  effective  way  of  re- 
moving a  teacher  who  is  not  worth  retaining;  and  there,  of  course,  you  touch 
upon  the  difficult  problem  in  connection  with  the  public  schools.  Most  of  the 
large  cities  are  in  the  same  situation.  The  hardest  thing  on  earth  for  a  superin- 
tendent to  accomplish  is  the  removal  of  the  inefficient  teacher.  I  was  saying  to 
Mr.  Buck  this  morning  that  it  always  seems  to  me  that  the  more  inefficient  a 
teacher  is,  the  more  friends  that  teacher  possesses;  probably  because  the  inefficient 
teacher  needs  the  friends.  Certainly  it  is  true  in  all  cities  that  it  is  very  difficult 
indeed  to  remove  the  inefficient  teacher.  That  is  due,  as  I  see  it,  to  the  as  yet 
unsettled  way  of  determining  effectively  inefficiency;  and  I  am  frank  to  say  that  I 
do  not  come  before  you  this  morning  with  a  solution  that  satisfies  me,  save  this, 
that  so  long  as  we  believe  in  the  office  of  school  superintendent  and  of  supervisory 
officials,  so  long  as  we  believe  that  it  is  possible  to  secure  officials  whose  judgment 
concerning  teachers  is  better  than  that  of  the  average  individual,  so  long  it  be- 
comes necessary  to  accept  the  judgment  of  these,  providing  there  is  some  satisfac- 
tory check  against  prejudiced  reports.  __^. 

RECORDING  EFFICIENCY  OF  TEACHERS. 

In  my  own  system  we  are  approaching  something  which  I  think  is  reasonably 
satisfactory.  We  have  what  is  known  as  a  teacher's  efficiency  card — which  I 
understand  is  more  or  less  debatable,  at  least  by  some  individuals.  But  in  my 
judgment,  where  there  exists  a  large  number  of  teachers,  so  large  that  it  is  abso- 
lutely impossible  for  the  responsible  head  of  the  schools  to  have  intelligent  indi- 
vidual judgment,  it  becomes  necessary,  as  a  matter  of  course,  that  there  be  on 
record  somewhere  some  estimates  as  to  the  worth  of  the  teacher.  So  we  have  a 
card,  which  is  rather  carefully  worked  out.  I  am  sorry  that  I  did  not  bring  a 


34 

sample  card.  There  is  nothing  original  at  all  in  the  card.  It  is  simply  an  imitation 
of  other  cards,  modified  to  suit  our  own  conditions.  On  that  card  we  have  a  large 
number  of  characteristics  of  a  teacher,  and  it  is  so  arranged  that  it  is  possible  for 
the  reporting  official  to  mark  as  to  each  characteristic. 

Alderman  Buck:     Will  you  name  some  of  the  characteristics? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  know  that  I  can  remember  the  exact  words,  but  almost 
every  conceivable  characteristic  is  included.  Personal  appearance  is  one;  there  is 
a  report  as  to  whether  the  personal  appearance  of  a  teacher  is  poor,  medium,  good 
or  excellent,  with  possible  subdivisions  there.  Then  there  is  the  ability  of  the 
teacher  in  the  art  of  questioning;  the  ability  of  the  teacher  in  the  securing  of 
the  interest  of  the  pupils;  the  apparent  power  of  the  teacher  in  securing  efficiency 
of  results;  the  power  of  the  teacher  to  maintain  that  which  is  ordinarily  consid- 
ered as  discipline,  etc.,  with  some  twenty-five  different  characteristics;  including 
the  health  of  the  person,  the  temperament,  the  optimism  of  the  teacher,  etc.  As  I 
say,  I  cannot  remember  all  the  different  characteristics,  but  there  is  an  effort  made 
to  have  there  a  picture  of  the  various  things  which,  combined,  or  individually, 
even,  are  of  value  to  a  teacher. 

Alderman  Buck:  Would  this  be  a  fair  statement,  that  it  is  approximately  a 
sort  of  bill  of  particulars  of  the  general  efficiency  mark? 

Mr.  Chadsey:     I  think  so,  yes,  sir. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     This,  of  course,  is  made  by  the  constituted  school  authorities? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  This  report,  in  the  case  of  new  teachers  or  substitutes,  is  made 
by  the  supervisor — or,  with  new  teachers  or  substitutes,  is  made  by  the  prin- 
cipal of  the  building,  or  is  made  by  the  assistant  superintendent  of  schools  who 
happens  to  be  inspecting  that  particular  school  or  group  of  schools;  and  it  is 
made  as  often  as  they  are  called  for  by  the  superintendent.  In  cases  of  doubt,  or 
where  there  is  any  reason  for  more  information,  other  supervisors  or  assistants 
may  be  sent  for  supplementary  reports.  These  reports  are  made  for  all  teachers 
every  year;  and,  in  the  case  of  substitutes  an  appointment  is»never  made  until 
there  are  favorable  reports  from  all  parties  concerned;  the  feeling  there  being  that 
it  is  very  much  easier  to  get  a  teacher  into  the  system  than  to  get  a  teacher  out, 
and  therefore  we  should  be  very  slow  to  appoint,  if  there  is  doubt  on  the  part  of 
any  efficient  official. 

HELP  " INEFFICIENT"  TEACHERS  IMPROVE. 

If  the  superintendent  were  to  become  convinced  in  any  case  that  any  official 
concerned  with  those  reports  was  prejudiced,  he  would  take  that  into  account.  If 
the  principal  fails  to  make  a  satisfactory  report,  where  there  is  a  belief  on  the  part 
of  the  supervisor  or  the  assistant  superintendent  that  the  person  is  reasonably 
efficient,  the  teacher  is  transferred  to  another  principal,  and  given  another  chance. 
The  same  thing  is  true  in  the  case  of  an  appointed  teacher  who  is  not  doing  satis- 
factory work.  If  we  have  any  reason  to  believe  that  a  teacher  is  doing  inefficient 
work  because  she  is  not  working  under  proper  surroundings,  or  that  the  principal 
is  not  capable  of  bringing  out  the  best  in  her,  she  is  sent  to  another  section  of 
the  community,  with  a  different  type  of  children,  where  she  may  succeed,  while 
she  cannot  succeed  where  she  is.  Or  if  she  might  be  placed  in  another  grade,  and 
it  is  impracticable  to  place  her  in  tiiat  grade  in  that  building,  we  wish  to  make 
that  transfer,  so  that  every  opportunity  may  be  given  to  the  teacher  to  show  that 
she  really  is  worthy  of  retention. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  Considering  the  fact  that  such  a  report  is  liable,  or  at  least 
likely,  to  be  more  or  less  mechanical,  do  you  believe  in  the  efficacy  of  outside 
surveys,  occasional  efficiency  surveys,  either  by  committees  of  the  board,  or  out- 
side committees,  of  organizations' especially  for  that  purpose? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Of  course,  it  is  a  rather  difficult  thing  to  know  what  you  imply 
by  " survey. "  The  word  "survey"  ordinarily  has  to  do  with  a  more  or  less 
extended  study  of  a  school  system,  or  certain  portions  of  a  school  system.  Do 
you  mean  merely  a  survey  as  to  whether  certain  teachers  are  doing  efficient  work, 
or  not? 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  My  idea  was  more  comprehensive  than  that.  My  idea  was  to 
have  an  occasional  survey  or  examination  into  the  efficiency  conditions  of  each 
school. 


35 

Mr.  Chadsey:  By  some  one  who  was  not  an  employe  of  the  public  school  sys- 
tem at 'all,  but  an  outsider?  I  see  no  objection  to  that.  I  think  in  almost  every 
case  a  committee  of  experts  can  do  a  school  system  much  good,  and  I  think  in 
most  cases  get  good  results.  I  do  not  believe,  under  ordinary  conditions,  in  having 
those  surveys  put  in  as  frankly  hostile  efforts.  Sometimes  that  has  been  the  case. 
No,  I  do  not  object  to  outside  surveys.  We  are  going  through  one  now  in  Detroit, 
and  we  asked  for  it.  We  asked  this  outside  organization  to  come  in  and  show  us 
where  we  were  weak;  because  we  know  that  they  can  find  many  places  where  they 
can  show  the  public  much  more  effectively  than  we  can  the  weakness  of  present 
conditions. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  There  seem  to  be  two  dangers.  If  you  have  a  purely  mechani- 
cal system,  with  promotion  on  the  ground  of  seniority  alone,  you  practically  rob 
the  teacher  of  a  good  deal  of  ambition.  On  the  other  hand,  if  you  allow  the  super- 
intendent sole  power  of  promotion  and  demotion,  elements  other  than  actual 
efficiency  are  going  to  come  in.  In  your  judgment,  which  is  worse  of  the  two? 
Which  is  most  to  be  avoided? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  We  have  not  been  discussing  promotion  at  all,  as  I  have  under- 
stood it.  We  were  discussing  the  question  of  the  increase  of  the  teacher  from  a 
low  salary  to  a  maximum  salary.  But  I  do  not  think  of  a  teacher  drawing  $1,000  a 
year  as  a  teacher  holding  a  higher  position  than  one  drawing  $700  a  year.  That  is 
merely  due  to  the  length  of  service,  the  assumption  that  a  teacher  does  become 
somewhat  more  effective  as  she  becomes  more  familiar  with  her  work — an  assump- 
tion that  is  not  always,  of  course,  in  accord  with  the  facts  in  the  case,  but  in 
general  it  is.  In  general  a  teacher  of  six  or  eight  or  ten  years'  experience  is  really 
a  more  effective  teacher,  and  is  theoretically  earning  a  somewhat  larger  amount, 
than  a  younger,  newer  teacher.  But  that  is  not  the  reason  for  the  increase. 

PROMOTION  OF  SCHOOL  TEACHERS. 

When  you  are  speaking  of  promotion,  I  feel  very  decidedly  that  that  should 
not  be  a  mechanical  act  at  all.  I  think  that  the  teacher,  to  be  promoted,  should 
in  every  case  be  promoted  as  the  result  of  a  deliberate  act  of  judgment  on  the 
part  of  the  best  authorities  we  can  get,  that  she  is  the  one  who  deserves  promotion 
out  of  all  of  those  who  are  eligible.  The  question  as  to  how  you  are  going  to  get 
that  list,  and  what  mechanical  limitations  there  might  be,  is  a  detail  which  would 
require  a  great  deal  of  discussion,  because  there  would  be  a  great  many  differ- 
ences of  opinion.  Again,  in  an  efficient  system,  the  superintendent  should  have 
the  nominating  power.  In  a  large  system  of  schools  it  may  be  advisable,  in  order 
to  protect  the  superintendent  against  charges  of  favoritism,  he  should  be  required 
to  in  some  way  have  created  an  eligible  list,  and  submit  a  certain  number,  from 
which  possibly  the  board  of  education,  or  a  committee,  might  select  certain  ones; 
so  that  it  could  not  be  said  that  the  superintendent  was  simply  promoting  those 
that  were  personally  agreeable  to  him,  or  was  in  some  way  trying  to  create  a 
hierarchy  of  some  sort. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  Would  you  think  that  the  teachers  should  have  any  voice  in 
the  election  of  the  principals  in  their  own  schools? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Why,  personally,  I  do  not  go  that  far.  I  think  your  question, 
however,  involves  a  very  broad  question  which  might  be  put  in  this  way:  to  what 
extent  should  the  regularly  appointed  teachers  have  a  voice  in  determining  the 
policies  of  the  schools?  There  I  think  that  we  have  not  as  yet  come  to  a  satis- 
factory agreement  as  to  what  should  be  done;  but  personally,  I  am  very  strongly 
of  the  opinion  that  the  teaching  body,  those  who  are  actually  doing  the  work, 
should  have  far  more  to  do  with  the  creation  and  determination  of  educational 
policies  than  they  have  at  the  present  time  in  most  cities.  Just  how  that  can  be 
worked  out  most  efficiently  depends  again  very  decidedly  upon  local  conditions. 

CONSULT  TEACHERS  ON  SCHOOL  POLICY. 

Take  the  question  of  the  course  of  study,  for  instance,  which  is  a  fairly  good 
illustration,  I  think,  because  a  course  of  study  is  a  very  vital  matter  to  the 
schools.  It  is,  from  my  point  of  view,  ridiculous  to  assume  that  a  superintendent, 


36 

or  a  group  of  superintendents,  are  in  any  position  whatever  to  prepare  a  course  of 
study  for  the  teachers  to  work  out.  Certainly  the  teachers  are  in  a  position  to 
contribute  very  much  more  to  this  course  of  study  than  any  supervisory  officer,  no 
matter  how  much  of  an  expert  he  may  be  in  theory,  because  they  are  every  day 
working  with  the  course  of  study,  and  working  with,  the  pupils,  and  can  see  the 
limitations  in  a  way  that  the  officer  cannot. 

On  the  other  hand,  it  is,  I  think,  equally  true  that  your  expert  official  has  a 
certain  breadth  of  view  with  reference  to  the  course  of  study,  and  certain  con- 
ceptions concerning  the  fundamental  ideas  and  ideals  of  the  course  of  study,  and 
the  final  effect,  of  certain  lines  of  work  upon  the  individual,  which  the  grade 
teacher,  the  individual  teacher,  may  not  have;  and  there  should  be  a  recognition  of 
that  in  the  formation  of  the  course.  But  there  certainly  should  be  a  free  oppor- 
tunity for  the  whole  experience  of  the  teacher  to  come  into  it. 

I  purposely  do  not  say  how,  in  my  judgment,  these  individual  teachers  should 
be  selected.  That  question,  I  think,  is  a  local  matter.  I  can  conceive  of  organi- 
zations so  effective  that  the  officials,  or  the  public  generally,  which  is  the  last 
and  only  element  to  be  considered,  could  have  perfect  confidence  in  the  wisdom  and 
ability  of  the  work.  I  can  conceive  of  other  conditions  where  there  might  be  very 
ineffective  appointments,  and  where  a  personal  selection  might  be  very  much 
better. 

I  feel — more  specifically  answering  the  exact  question — that,  after  all,  we 
cannot  make  a  genuine  democracy  in  theory  out  of  a  school  system.  We  have  got 
to  have  a  very  definite  power  located  somewhere,  and  if  we  had  ideal  teachers  in 
every  single  case,  I  could  conceive  of  appointments  being  very  effective  along  that 
line.  But  there  is  no  hope  for  that  kind  of  a  condition,  and  I  feel  strongly  that  we 
can  secure  better  appointments  through  the  nomination  of  the  superintendent,  and 
his  corp  of  assistants,  than  we  could  get  if  we  trusted  to  the  judgment  of  the 
individual  teacher.  That  does  not,  however,  take  away  the  fact  that  the  teacher 
is  a  very  important  factor  in  this  matter,  and  there  should  be  some  way  through 
which  the  superintendent,  the  board  of  education,  and  the  officials  in  charge  of 
teachers  and  principals,  should  have  just  as  good  an  opportunity  to  judge  of  the 
efficiency  of  the  principal,  say,  from  the  standpoint  of  the  teacher,  as  he  thinks 
he  can  get  of  the  efficiency  of  a  teacher,  judged  from  the  standpoint  of  the  prin- 
cipal. 

Miss  Haley:     Mr.  Chairman,  may  I  ask  a  question? 

The  Chairman:     Certainly. 

Miss  Haley:  Do  you  think,  Mr.  Chadsey,  that  the  admitted  failure  of  our 
systems  provide  any  means  by  which  teachers  might  bring  their  experience  to 
bear  on  school  policies — do  you  think  that  that  has  anything  to  do  with  the  ques- 
tion of  the  cause  of  inefficiency  in  teachers? 

CONSULTATION  BUILDS  TEACHING  EFFICIENCY. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  It  might  in  individual  cases,  because  one  of  the  great  causes 
of  inefficiency,  Miss  Haley,  to  put  it  bluntly,  I  think,  is  laziness.  Perhaps  laziness 
is  too  harsh  a  word;  but,  say  a  willingness  not  to  give  the  best  of  one's  effort  to 
the  work.  In  cases  of  experienced  teachers,  it  is  very  apt  to  be  that;  and  the 
proof  of  that  is  that  where  there  does  exist  some  method  of  forcing  a  teacher  to 
realize  that  unless  she  does  better  work  she  is  sure  to  lose  her  position,  in  the 
great  majority  of  cases  it  results  on  the  part  of  your  experienced  teacher,  in  very 
much  better  work.  That  is,  she  has  not,  for  some  reason  or  other,  given  her  best 
effort. 

I  can  conceive  that  if  there  was  a  feeling  on  the  part  of  all  teachers — which  I 
suppose  does  not  exist  always — that  their  point  of  view,  their  beliefs,  can  reach 
those  who  are  actively  concerned  in  the  formation  of  a  policy,  there  might  result 
on  the  part  of  teachers  who  sometimes  do  not  give  their  best,  a  tendency  to  do 
better.  They  would  be  more  encouraged,  and  work  harder.  So  I  can  conceive, 
really,  of  efficiency  being  increased,  and  I  think  it  would  be  increased.  I  do  not 
personally  see  any  reason  whatever  for  any  superintendent  in  any  way  feeling 
that  groups  of  teachers  should  not  actively  consider  all  problems,  and  should  not 
formulate  some  way  for  having  their  ideas  reach  in  a  definite  way  those  in 
authority.  I  think  also  that  they  have  a  right,  under  such  conditions,  to  be  con- 


37 

vinced  that  their  recommendations  do  receive  the  most  careful  and  judicious  con- 
sideration. If  they  are  simply  tabled  and  ignored,  they  have  a  right  to  feel  that 
conditions  are  not  as  they  should  be,  and  a  right,  perhaps,  as  individuals  some- 
times, to  feel  discouraged  as  to  the  necessity  of  giving  the  best^  that  is  in  them. 
Does  that  answer  your  question,  or  did  you  have  something  else  in  mind? 

Miss  Haley:  It  answers  it  in  part.  I  would  like  to  ask  you  which  you  think 
leads  most  to  inefficiency:  a  condition  where  teachers  know  and  feel  that  ^they 
have  something  to  give  to  the  system,  and  the  system  does  not  either  demand  it,  or 
give  them  an  opportunity  to  give  of  their  knowledge  and  experience;  or  a  con- 
dition where  there  is  a  system  that  has  not  got  enough  life  in  the  teachers,  even, 
to  know  that  they  have  something  to  give,  and  does  not  make  any  demand  for  it? 
Which  is  the  worst,  and  in  which  is  the  most  danger  of  inefficiency? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  know  how  I  could  answer  that  question,  I  am  sure.^  It 
would  depend  entirely  upon  the  individual  system,  and  the  degree  of  disappoint- 
ment or  the  degree  of  lethargy  that  might  exist.  I  cannot  answer  it  either  way. 

Miss  Haley:  I  speak  of  that,  Mr.  Chairman,  because  I  have  not  heard  Mr. 
Chadsey  say  anything  about  defining  the  responsibilities  and  opportunities  of 
teachers.  He  spoke  about  defining  the  powers  of  the  board  of  education,  and  the 
power  of  the  superintendent,  and  it  is  only  occasionally  we  hear  anybody  who 
says  that  there  ought  to  be  a  definition  of  the  rights,  responsibilities  and  duties  of 
teachers.  It  seems  to  me  they  are  in  a  group  by  themselves,  just  as  the  superin- 
tendents are  in  a  group  by  themselves,  and  just  as  boards  of  education  are  in  a 
group  by  themselves;  and  there  are  three  groups,  and  not  two.  The  superintendent 
is  not  the  spokesman  of  the  teachers  because  he  is  not  elected  by  the  teachers.  If 
he  were  elected  by  the  teachers,  he  would  be  their  spokesman.  He  is  elected  by  the 
board  and  is  the  board's  spokesman.  Now,  if  you  are  not  going  to  give  the  teach- 
ers any  voice  at  all  through  somebody  whom  they  elect,  then  you  must  have  some 
other  provision  for  giving  them  a  voice;  and  if  you  do  not  give  them  a  voice,  then 
you  have  not  any  reason  to  complain  of  their  being  inefficient — if  you  do  not  give 
them  an  opportunity  to  express  themselves. 

VOICE  OF  TEACHERS  SHOULD  BE  HEARD. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  take  exception  at  all  to  the  way  Miss  Haley  has  put 
that.  I  think  it  should  be  perfectly  obvious,  in  the  first  place,  that  the  efficiency 
of  a  school  system,  in  the  last  analysis,  ought  to  depend  upon  the  efficiency  of  the 
teachers.  They  constitute "  the  largest  group.  Certainly,  the  amount  of  money 
spent  for  teachers  tremendously  outweighs  that  spent  for  any  other  group;  and 
certainly  they  are  the  individuals  that  come  in  direct  contact  with  the  pupils.  I 
feel  perfectly  convinced  that  the  time  must  come  when  in  some  way  there  will  be 
this  definite  opportunity  for  the  teachers  to  have  a  genuine  way  of  determining 
their  beliefs,  or  seeing  that  their  beliefs  secure  proper  consideration.  I  do  not 
think  that  that  implies  that  the  superintendent  should  be  elected  by  the  teachers. 
I  do  not  think  that  a  good  superintendent  ought  to  hesitate,  as  far  as  his  own 
personal  future  is  concerned.  I  think  he  ought  to  be  in  such  a  tremendously  advan- 
tageous place,  from  his  prominence  in  the  group,  that  it  would  be  hard  for  me  to 
conceive  of  any  good  superintendent  being  ousted  by  the  teaching  force,  the  teach- 
ing body,  under  such  conditions.  I  do  not  mean  that  at  all.  And  yet,  I  come  back 
to  my  fundamental  proposition,  that  the  board  of  education  should  be  elected  by 
the  people,  and  represent  the  people,  and  the  people  have  all  control  of  the 
schools;  and  that  therefore  the  board  of  education  should  elect  the  superintendent, 
and  the  superintendent,  so  far  as  the  fiscal  conditions  of  the  schools,  and  so  far 
as  the  general  conduct  of  the  schools  is  concerned,  must  of  necessity  be  responsible 
to  the  people  rather  than  to  the  teachers.  I  do  not  see  any  real  inconsistency  in 
those  two  statements.  I  think,  though,  that  the  teachers  where  they  are  orginazed 
in  such  a  way  that  the  real  feeling  of  the  teachers  can  be  secured,  can  furnish  the 
most  valuable  piece  of  information  that  can  be  gotten,  and  certainly  their  opinions 
should  be  considered  with  all  of  the  respect  that  such  information  deserves. 

M^iss  Haley:  I  would  like  to  ask  you  another  question,  with  the  Chairman's 
permission.  May  I,  Mr.  Chairman? 

The  Chairman:     Certainly.    What  is  your  question? 


38 

Miss  Haley:  Mr.  Chadsey,  do  you  think  that  the  provision,  whatever  it  may 
be,  for  giving  an  expression  to  the  views  of  teachers,  should  be  dependent  upon 
any  individual  in  the  system,  to  withhold  or  grant  it  to  the  teachers? 

Mr.  Chadsey:     I  do  not  believe  I  get  what  you  mean  by  that. 

Miss  Haley:  Well,  I  will  make  it  concrete.  We  have  in  Chicago  today  a  pro- 
vision for  the  meeting  of  what  we  call  educational  councils.  The  teachers  are 
assembled  once  or  twice  a  year  to  express  themselves.  They  are  assembled  by 
groups.  There  is  no  voice  of  authority  or  position,  as  has  been  stated,  in  any  of 
those  groups.  They  are  all  on  a  par.  Classroom  teachers  meet  with  classroom 
teachers,  supervisors  meet  with  supervisors,  and  principals  meet  with  principals. 

Mr.  Chadsey:    Are  they  organized,  or  are  they  called  by  the  school  authorities? 

Miss  Haley:  The  board  of  education  by  their  action  provided  that  the  teach- 
ers should  meet  in  this  way,  and  then  that  they  should  express  their  views  to  the 
superintendent,  through  elected  delegates  for  that  purpose.  Each  group  is  free  to 
select  as  many  delegates  as  is  necessary  to  convey  the  varying  opinions.  Now,  the 
superintendent  is  left  with  the  responsibility  of  calling  those  meetings,  and  the 
teachers  never  know  whether  they  are  going  to  have  them  or  not.  The  time  has 
passed,  for  instance,  now,  in  this  month — the  time  provided  by  the  board  of  edu- 
cation; and  the  meetings  have  not  yet  been  called.  The  teachers  do  not  know  why, 
and  they  do  not  know  whether  they  are  going  to  be  called  or  not. 

Mr.  Chadsey:     Now,  your  question  was — 

Miss  Haley:  My  question  is:  do  you  think,  on  whatever  authority  the  duties 
and  responsibilities  of  the  board  of  education  are  fixed,  with  the  same  responsi- 
bility, or  the  same  power,  whatever  it  may  be,  whether  it  is  statutory,  or  by  the 
rules  of  the  board,  that  fixes  the  power  of  the  superintendent — should  that  also 
define  the  responsibilities  of  the  teachers? 

DEFINITION  OF  TEACHERS'   RESPONSIBILITIES. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  am  inclined  to  think  so,  yes.  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  the 
situation  has  reached  a  stage  where  it  is  a  perfectly  legitimate  request  or  demand 
on  the  part  of  the  teachers  that  there  be  some  way  in  which  their  feelings  shall 
have  an  absolute  certainty  of  consideration,  and  that  that  should  be  just  as  public 
as  the  actions  of  the  board  of  education.  I  think  it  should  be  absolutely  public.  I 
do  not  think  anything  should  be  secret  about  school  affairs,  save  those  discussions 
which  have  to  do  with  the  individual  merit  of  the  teachers.  I  think  those  should 
be  secret,  and  should  be  made  public  only  when  the  teacher  herself  wishes  to  have 
them  made  public. 

Alderman  Buck:  Summing  up  somewhat  your  remarks  concerning  the  efficiency 
markings  of  teachers,  Mr.  Chadsey,  should  you  say  that  you  would  consider  that  a 
principal  who  has  marked  a  teacher,  or  any  other  official  who  has  marked  a 
teacher,  should  be  ready  to  discuss  in  detail  the  manner  in  which  he  arrived  at 
his  conclusions  as  to  her  efficiency,  with  the  teacher  herself  and  with  the  superin- 
tendent, or  the  board  of  education? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Oh,  yes,  either  one.  I  do  not  think  that  the  ratings  of  a 
teacher  should  be  made  public.  I  think,  though,  that  she  should  have  absolute 
access  to  those  marks,  and  that  she  should  have  an  absolute  right  of  discussion  with 
whoever  gave  her  those  marks,  as  to  the  reasons  for  reaching  those  conclusions.  It 
seems  to  me  that  is  fundamental.  Otherwise  you  have  a  hidden  hierarchy  which 
can  make  or  unmake  a  teacher,  without  any  chance  for  the  teacher  to  protect  her- 
self. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  Coming  back  to  the  need  of  teachers  for  expression  of  their 
views,  referring  to  them  as  the  silent  voice  in  the  educational  system,  have  you  any 
practical  plan  in  mind,  any  definite  suggestion  as  to  how  a  voice  can  be  given  to 
the  teachers?  The  councils  that  Miss  Haley  speaks  of  seem  rather  inadequate, 
for  the  reason  that — 

Alderman  Buck:     They  are  not  held. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:  Well,  even  if  they  are  held,  there  is  no  necessity  for  acting 
upon  any  opinion  which  is  given  by  the  teachers,  either  pro  or  con.  And  it  is  very 
likely  to  be  kept  in  obscurity. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  It  is  very  easy  to  control  that.  If  you  were  to  organize  a 
definite  system,  through  which'  the  individual  teacher,  either  as  a  teacher  of  an 


39 

individual  grade,  or  an  individual  speaking,  or  both,  had  representation  in  the 
group  which  discussed  any  problems  which  were  of  value,  either  educationally  or 
otherwise,  to  the  teacher,  and  through  which  those  conclusions  and  findings  and 
recommendations  should  be  submitted  to  the  other  authorities,  and  should  be  dis- 
cussed and  acted  upon  in  a  public  manner,  you  would  have  the  whole  thing! taken 
care  of  then. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     Have  you  councils  of  that  sort  in  Detroit? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  have  not,  no,  sir.  I  would  not  at  all  object  to  it,  if  they  wish 
it,  or  anything  of  that  sort.  But  I  have  never  had  any  request  for  anything  of  the 
sort.  I  would  welcome  it  personally,  because  I  feel  that  I  would  doubtless  get 
certain  inside  information  that  I  have  no  way  of  getting  at  the  present  time.  To 
me,  the  opinion  of  teachers  is  just  as  valuable,  and  more  valuable,  than  that  of 
any  individual;  and  is  bound  to  be. 

TEACHERS'  ACTIVITY  FOR  SALARIES  PROPER. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  think,  Mr.  Chadsey,  that  the  teachers  in  any 
way  should  be  able  to  express  their  opinion  as  to  what  would  be  a  reasonable 
salary  for  the  service  they  render? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Why,  certainly.  They  are  the  most  interested  of  all,  and  they 
should  certainly  have  some  opportunity  to  express  their  opinion  concerning  what 
they  thought  was  adequate.  In  fact,  I  have  asked  our  Detroit  Teachers'  Club, 
which  is  the  only  organization  that  includes  all  of  the  teachers,  definitely  to  make 
a  study  of  the  salary  situation  in  the  elementary  schools  in  the  United  States,  and 
particularly  of  all  systems  that  paid  a  better  salary  than  Detroit,  and  to  get  that 
in  such  shape  that  they  can  present  their  information  both  to  the  board  of  edu- 
cation and  the  city  council,  with  reference  to  a  more  adequate  compensation. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  You  did  not  resent  the  efforts  of  the  teachers  to  get 
better  compensation? 

Mr.  Chadsey:     I  asked  them  to  do  that.     The  suggestion  came  from  me. 

Alderman  Buck:     Do  you  believe  that  teachers  should  be  elected  each  year? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not,  Mr.  Buck.  I  think  that  is  a  totally  unnecessary  for- 
mality, although  we  are  doing  it;  and  I  have  never  worked  anywhere,  where  it  was 
not  done.  But  I  know  that  there  always  are  a  great  many  teachers  who,  without 
the  slightest  reason,  feel  worried  until  the  actual  formal  action  of  the  board  is 
taken;  and  where  we  are  dealing  with  thousands  of  teachers,  the  thing  is  so 
absurd  that  I  think  we  should  have  some  other  way.  On  the  other  hand,  I  do  not 
think  that  a  tenure  of  office  should  be  so  iron-clad  that  it  becomes  a  practical  im- 
possibility for  the  incompetent  teachers  to  be  dropped;  and  I  think  that  the  better 
teachers  are  just  exactly  as  anxious  to  have  the  standards  maintained  as  we  are. 

In  cases  where  I  have  recommended  the  dropping  of  teachers,  I  have  unfor- 
tunately, in  one  or  two  cases,  not  had  my  action  confirmed  by  the  board;  and  1 
know  that  the  teachers  almost  unanimously  felt  that  my  recommendations  should 
have  been  followed  in  the  matter.  That  is,  they  do  not  want  the  incompetents  to 
remain;  they  have  their  own  pride,  their  own  desire  to  have  a  high  standard  of 
efficiency;  and  the  number  of  inefficient  teachers  is  very  small.  But  just  so  soon  as 
you  make  them  feel  that  they  are  not  getting  justice,  and  that  there  is  a  possibility 
that  prejudice  on  the  part  of  either  the  superintendent,  or  his  assistants,  or  the 
principals,  or  anyone  else  is  causing  the  discharge  of  teachers,  then  you  have  a 
very  different  attitude  on  the  part  of  the  teaching  force.  Certainly  a  teacher  has 
a  right  to  permanent  employment  just  so  long  as  she  is  efficient. 

ANNUAL  ELECTION  OF  TEACHERS  UNSOUND. 

Alderman  Buck:  Should  you  suggest  that  she  should  have  a  stated  term  at  all, 
or  that  she  be — • 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Xo,  I  think  that  a  teacher  should  have  permanent  tenure  after 
a  certain  preliminary  term.  I  think  that  there  should  be  a  certain  time;  and  I 
am -rather  inclined  to  approve  of  the  New  York  system,  where  for  three  years  the 
tenure  of  office  is  absolutely  determinable  by  the  superintendent.  I  think  that  i:? 
a  pretty  good  arrangement,  because  it  gives  ample  opportunity  for  the  officials  to 


40 

determine  whether  a  teacher  is  competent,  or  not.  After  that  period,  whatever  it 
may  be,  when  the  teacher  is  regularly  appointed,  I  think  that  there  should  be  no 
more  re-elections,  but  tnat  the  teacher's  name  should  appear  before  the  board  of 
education  only  for  two  causes:  when  for  some  reason  she  is  to  be  promoted,  and 
therefore  there  has  to  be  some  formal  action;  or  when  for  some  reason  she  is  in- 
efficient, and  should  be  dropped. 

Alderman  Buck:  Should  an  inefficient  teacher  be  dropped  without  a  chance 
to  improve  her  work? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  think  so.  I  think  an  inefficient  teacher  should  be  noti- 
fied a  sufficiently  long  period  in  advance  to  give  her  an  opportunity  to  show  that 
she  can  do  better  work.  I  wish  to  add  to  that,  however,  that  after  20  years 
experience  I  have  almost  never  known  of  a  teacher  to  admit  that  she  was  so  noti- 
fied, who  was  dropped  for  inefficiency.  They  do  not  seem  to  realize  their  situation, 
or  our  officials  are  desperately  delicate  in  telling  them  of  their  danger,  because 
there  seems  to  be  an  almost  unanimous  feeling  that  the  final  decision  was  a 
thunderbolt  out  of  a  clear  sky. 

Mr.  Max  Loeb:     Have  you  people  any  age  limit  for  teachers? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  We  have  one.  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  if  your  age  limit  is 
sufficiently  high,  it  is  a  pretty  good  thing  to  have;  and  yet  I  can  conceive  of  no 
satisfactory  age  limit  for  we  know  that  there  are  immensely  effective  teachers 
who  are  past  that  age  limit.  Nor  can  I  think  of  an  age  limit  so  low  that  there  are 
not  some  teachers  who  have  outlived  their  usefulness,  and  ought  to  be  dropped. 
But  I  do  think  this,  that  if  you  are  going  to  have  anything  of  that  sort,  you  must 
have  adequate  salaries,  and  an  adequate  retirement  fund,  so  that  there  is  no  injus- 
tice done  to  the  teacher  who  has  given  her  service  to  the  community,  and  who 
through  failing  powers  is  not  able  to  maintain  the  standard  of  efficiency  that  we 
think  is  desirable. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  believe  in  the  dismissal  of  teachers,  or  the  failure  to 
elect  teachers — the  interruption  of  their  tenure — without  specific  charges  being 
stated  in  each  case? 

Mr.  Chadsey:     Would  you  say  that  the  charge  of  inefficiency  was  specific? 

Alderman  Buck:     Yes.    By  "charges"  I  include  inefficiency. 

DROPPING  TEACHERS  WITHOUT  CHARGES  UNJUST. 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  think  that  it  is  only  just  that  there  be  made  reasonably 
definite  charges.  But  I  want  to  add  to  that  the  statement  that  inefficiency  on  the 
part  of  an  experienced  teacher  is  practically  impossible  to  prove  legally.  That  is, 
I  cannot  conceive  of  a  teacher  who  is  efficient  enough  to  have  taught  a  few  years, 
not  being  efficient  enough  to  bring  a  host  of  witnesses  who  would  testify  as  to 
her  wonderful  efficiency  as  a  teacher.  Therefore  I  think  that  it  is  necessary  for 
the  reviewing  authority — in  this  case,  of  course,  the  board  of  education — to  ac- 
cept the  testimony  of  a  group,  at  any  rate,  of  officials  as  practically  final  in  such 
cases. 

Alderman  Buck:  After,  however,  the  teacher  has  had  an  opportunity  to  im- 
prove her  work? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  Well,  I  think  the  teacher,  in  addition,  should  have  an  oppor- 
tunity to  appear  before  the  board  of  education  and  plead  her  case.  It  is  a  very 
serious  thing,  it  is  a  terrible  thing,  for  a  teacher  to  be  dismissed  for  inefficiency.  It 
should  not  be  resorted  to  by  the  superintendent  unless  he  is  absolutely  convinced 
that  the  welfare  of  the  system  does  demand  it;  and  then  she  ought  to  have  every 
opportunity  to  prove  that  there  has  been  in  some  way  an  error  of  judgment.  But 
if  that  means  that  the  board  of  education  is  going  always  to  be  influenced  by 
sentiment,  and  restore  the  teacher  because  her  discharge  is  such  a  terrible  thing, 
the  condition  becomes  laughable;  and  that  is  the  case  in  many  a  school  system 
today.  So  true  is  that,  that  in  some  systems  there  is  no  effort  made  whatever  to 
drop  a  teacher  for  inefficiency. 

The  Chairman:  Do  you  consider  it  the  function  of  the  board  of  education  to 
take  the  initiative  for  the  removal  of  any  teacher,  Mr.  Chadsey? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  think  the  board  of  education  should  not  do  that,  no.  I  tninK, 
if  the  superintendent  cannot  take  the  initiative,  you  had  better  get  a  new  super- 
intendent. 


41 

Miss  Haley:    Mr.  Chairman,  may  I  ask  Mr.  Chadsey  another  question? 

The  Chairman:     Certainly. 

Miss  Haley:  Mr.  Chadsey  said  that  in  the  case  where  the  board  did  not  sus- 
tain him  in  dropping  inefficient  teachers  when  he  recommended  it — he  spoke  of  the 
sentiment  of  the  teachers.  Has  it  ever  occurred  to  you  that  it  is  a  mistake  not  to 
utilize  that  sentiment  of  the  teaching  body,  when  it  comes  to  that  question  of  re- 
moving those  who  have  been  declared  to  be  inefficient? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  It  has  certainly  occurred  to  me  a  great  many  times,  and  I 
think,  when  I  opened  this  part  of  the  discussion,  I  said  that  I  did  not  as  yet  feel 
that  I  had  worked  out  any  plan  that  I  commend  as  final,  but  that  I  am  in  the 
heartiest  sympathy  with  the  idea  that  there  must  be  some  plan  through  which 
the  knowledge  and  the  experience  of  teachers  should  reach  the  superintendent  in 
an  effective  way;  and,  of  course,  if  that  were  true  he  would  assume  that  it 
was  reciprocal,  and  that  in  a  similar  way  he  could  rely  upon  the  teachers  to 
assist  him  in  working  out  the  policies  which  were  beneficial  to  the  schools.  And  I 
am  perfectly  convinced  of  the  natural  loyalty  of  the  very  great  majority  of  all 
teachers  toward  their  official  superiors.  I  think  it  is  the  natural  condition  of  mind; 
and  that  where  that  loyalty  does  not  exist,  there  must  be  some  abnormal  condition 
which  has  produced  that  situation.  I  think  that  is  true,  in  a  large  majority  of 
cases.  I  know  there  are  individual  teachers,  individuals  who  would  be  disloyal, 
whether  they  are  teachers,  or  not;  and  there  are  individuals  who  are  trouble- 
makers, etc.;  but  that  is  not  true  of  the  very  great  majority  of  teachers.  The 
superintendent  can  rest  assured  that  in  any  general  policy  he  can  count  on  the 
support  of  the  great  majority  of  his  teachers. 

BOARD  NOT  TO  DICTATE  TEACHERS'  AFFILIATIONS. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  consider  it  a  proper  function  of  the  board  of  edu- 
cation to  restrict  the  activities  of  teachers  in  matters  outside  of  the  school? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  think  that  the  board  of  education  has  just  two  things  to  de- 
termine, through  the  superintendent  and  his  officials.  First,  is  the  teacher  all  that 
she  ought  to  be  as  to  character?  And  second,  is  she  efficient? 

Alderman  Buck:  You  would  consider  it  a  proper  function  of  the  board  of 
education  to  require  that  she  should  or  should  not  belong  to  certain  organizations, 
would  you? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  I  do  not  see  how  it  is  any  of  our  business  as  to  what  she  belongs 
to,  as  long  as  she  is  a  good  teacher,  and  is  doing  efficient  work,  and  is  a  good  man 
or  woman.  I  can  see  how  an  individual  might  easly  belong  to  organizations,  and 
devote  so  much  of  her  time,  energy  and  thought  to  them  that  she  reduced  her 
efficiency  as  a  teacher;  and  then,  in  that  way,  have  to  be  dropped  as  inefficient. 
But  I  feel  on  that  subject  just  as  I  feel  personally  on  the  question  of  the  married 
woman  teacher.  In  Detroit  marriage  constitutes  a  resignation,  but  I  have  never 
seen  any  reason  why  we  should  assume  that  there  was  something  wrong  about  get- 
ting married.  If  a  married  woman  teacher  is  a  good  teacher,  and  a  moral  woman, 
why  should  I  care  whether  she  is  married  or  single?  And  so  with  any  other  out- 
side activity,  why  should  I  care  whether  she  belongs  to  half  a  dozen  different 
societies,  or  not,  so  long  as  she  is  able  to  do  good  work,  and  is  a  good  woman  her- 
self, or  a  good  man. 

Miss  Haley:  I  would  like  to  ask  one  more  question,  about  the  board  of  edu- 
cation, if  I  may. 

The  Chairman:    Very  well. 

Miss  Haley:  It  is  going  back  a  little,  about  the  Detroit  plan.  When  we  go  to 
get  a  bill  through  the  legislature,  we  have  got  to  show  the  members  that  other 
people  have  something  like  that  some  place  else.  They  will  not  strike  out  for 
themselves  to  do  anything.  Suppose  the  board  of  education  should  adopt  a  policy, 
or  some  of  those  members,  rather,  who  are  just  elected — a  policy  that  the  people 
disapproved  of.  The  people  then  have  no  way  at  all  of  expressing  that  disapproval 
until  the  next  four  years,  have  they? 

Mr.  Chadsey:  No  way  at  all,  except  in  the  matter  of  re-election.  Of  course, 
I  cannot  speak  from  experience  in  Detroit  as  to  that.  I  know  there  would  be  no 
danger  with  the  present  board  of  anything  of  that  sort  happening,  because,  as  I 
said  earlier  in  the  day,  if  there  is  a  very  emphatic  evidence  that  the  voting  public 


42 

believes  in  a  certain  policy,  those  things  are  secured.  I  have  seen  that  tried  time 
and  time  again  with  our  board  of  education,  and  with  our  city  council,  and  with 
our  board  of  estimates  and  I  have  had  personally,  time  and  time  again,  on  account 
of  the  very  bunglesome  system  that  we  have  of  securing  our  funds,  practically  to 
appeal  to  the  public  through  the  papers  to  get  a  certain  appropriation;  but  wo 
have  always  gotten  it  within  twenty-four  or  forty-eight  hours,  because  the  council, 
or  the  board  of  estimates  cannot  stand  against  the  hundreds  and  thousands  of  re- 
quests from  the  people,  people  of  influence;  and  a  change  of  front  very  soon  taken 
place.  And  it  is  right  that  it  should.  I  do  not  criticise  a  city  council  for  feeling 
that  way.  Why  shouldn't  they?  If  they  are  there  for  the  purpose  of  carrying 
out  the  best  thought  of  the  community,  and  they  become  convinced  that  they  have 
not  interpreted  the  thought  of  the  community  correctly,  why  shouldn  't  they  change 
their  minds?  My  experience  is  that  they  always  do,  if  they  become  convinced  that 
the  people  want  a  certain  thing.  I  think  to  a  less  extent  that  would  be  true  of  a 
small  board.  I  do  not  think  that  it  would  be  as  true.  The  larger  the  community, 
the  more  independent  the  individual  becomes;  and  an  appointed  board  is  lean 
responsive  to  public  demand  than  an  elected  board,  for  the  same  reason,  because 
the  appointed  board  member  ordinarily  owes  his  appointment  to  one  individual, 
and  so  long  as  that  one  individual  believes  in  him,  he  has  no  other  one  to  con- 
sider; but  your  elected  board  member  is  always  feeling  anxious  to  be  re-elected.  In 
nine  cases  out  of  ten  a  board  member,  for  some  reason  or  other,  enjoys  his  work 
so  much  that  he  wants  to  be  re-elected,  and  so  he  is  thinking  all  the  time  about 
fulfilling  the  real  desires  of  the  people. 


MR.  FRANK  E.  SPAULDING, 

Superintendent  of  Schools,  Minneapolis,   Minn. 

Mr.  Spaulding  appeared  Oct.  28,  1916. 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Chairman,  the  sub-committee  has  secured  the  attendanco 
today  of  Mr.  Frank  E.  Spaulding,  superintendent  of  public  schools  at  Minneapolis 
and  formerly  superintendent  of  the  public  schools  at  Newton,  Massachusetts.  Mr, 
Spaulding  comes  with  singular  appropriateness  before  the  committee  at  thin 
time  when  we  have  won  our  appeal  before  the  Supreme  Court  in  the  matter  of  the 
investigation  of  the  finances  of  the  board  of  education,  for  Mr.  Spaulding  han 
specialized  somewhat  in  his  experience  as  school  superintendent  on  the  adminis- 
tration of  school  finances.  He  also  has  specialized  on  industrial  training  and  han 
had  experience  in  both  of  those  lines. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Mr.  Chairman,  and  members  of  the  committee,  the  subject 
of  school  finances  is  so  very  large  that  it  would  be  entirely  out  of  place,  I  think, 
for  me  to  attempt  to  give  any  comprehensive  discussion  of  the  matter  at  thin 
time.  I  will  make  a  few  statements  that  occur  to  me  as  being  most  important  and 
then  I  will  be  very  glad  to  have  you,  as  your  interest  dictates,  ask  any  question  or, 
the  subject. 

I  think  the  finances  of  school  administration  should  be  handled  according  to 
principles  that  would  be  considered  sound  in  any  productive  business.  I  use  tho 
word  ll  productive "  advisedly  because  I  consider  education  a  productive  enter- 
prise. To  illustrate  what  I  mean  by  handling  the  finances  in  a  sound  business 
way,  I  should  say  that  with  a  given  revenue  possible  and  available  for  the  con- 
duct of  a  school  system  a  very  careful  budget  should  be  prepared  of  the  pro- 
posed plans  for  a  certain  period,  at  least  a  period  of  a  year  ahead — a  budget  going 
into  sufficient  detail  to  indicate  pretty  clearly  what  the  cost  will  be  of  carrying  ou->; 
proposed  plans,  for  instance  of  employing  the  necessary  number  of  teachers  in 
various  departments,  the  overhead  expense  of  buildings,  of  their  operation,  oi 
school  supplies  and  so  on.  Then  I  think  that  if  that  budget  is  sound,  and  it  meet? 
wfth  the  approval  of  the  board  of  education,  that  the  tax  levy  should  be  adjusted 
to  raise  the  necessary  funds.  If  it  should  be  found  that  the  necessary  funds  can- 
not be  secured  within  some  limit  of  tax  rates,  statutory  or  otherwise,  why  then 
the  budget  ought  to  be  adjusted  to  the  funds  that  will  be  available. 


43 

ACCOUNTING  SYSTEM  TO  YIELD  UNIT  COSTS. 

Then,  of  course,  a  careful  record  should  be.  kept  of  all  expenditures,  classified 
and  published  from  time  to  time,  in  fact  open  at  any  time  to  the  public,  so  that 
the  public  may  know  exactly  how  their  money  is  being  expended  and  for  what  it 
is  being  expended.  Every  year  at  least  a  complete  report  of  expenditures  should 
be  made. 

Almost  every  phase  of  education  has  its  financial  side.  I  think  it  is  highly 
desirable  to  have  some  system  of  cost  accounting  by  which  it  is  possible  to  tell  in 
a  good  deal  of  detail  just  what  a  given  unit  of  effort  costs — what  a  given  unit 
connected  with  the  school  buildings  or  operation  of  schools  costs;  how  much  it 
costs  to  provide  school  room  facilities  per  pupil,  in  the  kindergarten,  in  the  ele- 
mentary school  and  the  high  school;  how  much  buildings  cost  per  square  foot  of 
floor  area,  per  cubic  foot  of  contents;  how  much  it  costs  to  give  a  definite  unit  of 
instruction  in  any  subject  that  you  please;  how  much  it  costs,  for  example,  to 
provide  a  recitation  in  Latin  or  history. 

Such  unit  costs  not  only  give  information  that  is  pertinent,  but  they  may 
be  often  the  basis  of  great  economies,  financial  and  educational.  Suppose,  for 
instance,  that  a  certain  unit  cost  in  one  school  is  three  times  that  in  another;  such 
a  marked  discrepancy  suggests  an  investigation  to  determine  why  the  same  unit 
costs  so  much  more  in  one  school  than  in  the  others.  I  do  not  mean  to  say  that  the 
lowest  cost  necessarily  indicates  the  most  efficient  administration.  It  may  be 
that  the  highest  cost  represents  the  most  efficient  administration;  to  determine 
this,  we  should  have  the  pertinent  facts  before  us.  Then  by  comparisons  we  may 
determine  whether  it  is  wise  so  to  organize  our  schools  and  classes  that  we  shall 
produce  given  results  at  a  high  cost,  at  a  low  cost,  or  at  a  medium  cost.  I  think  I 
need  not  illustrate  further  to  show  that  it  is  just  as  important  for  the  school 
administration  to  know  definitely  at  all  times  the  unit  cost  of  any  kind  of  edu- 
cational product,  as  it  is  for  the  manager  of  any  well  conducted  business  to  know 
the  unit  costs  of  production  in  that  business. 

Alderman  Buck:  Should  that  budget  be  made  before  or  after  the  amount  of 
the  tax  levy  is  fixed? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Before,  of  course,  the  budget  is  the  only  basis  on  which  to 
fix  your  tax  levy. 

Alderman  Buck:  It  should  be  made  on  the  basis  of  as  complete,  as  possible, 
a  program  of  work  for  the  year  for  which  it  applies. 

Mr.  Spaulding:     Certainly. 

METHOD  OF  BUDGETARY  CONTROL. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Will  you  explain  how  the  budget  is  prepared  at  present 
in  Minneapolis,  who  has  the  control? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     It  is  prepared  in  the  spring,  early  in  the  spring. 

Alderman  Buck:  Let  me  interrupt  just  a  moment,  Mr.  Spaulding;  is  your 
fiscal  year  the -same  as  the  calendar  year? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Our  city  fiscal  year  does  not  correspond  with  the  school 
year;  this  is  an  unfortunate  condition  in  Minneapolis,  and  generally  throughout 
the  country.  As  you  probably  know,  the  city  fiscal  year  in  this  country  corre- 
sponds generally  with  the  calendar  year,  while  just  as  generally  the  school  year 
ends  June  30th.  This  lack  of  correspondence  of  the  fiscal  and  school  years  is 
especially  unfortunate  where  the  board  of  education  does  not  control  the  amount 
of  the  levy  under  the  statute.  The  board  of  education  has  to  make  its  plans  in  the 
spring,  including  the  making  of  contracts  with  teachers,  for  the  school  year  ending 
June  30  of  the  following  calendar  year;  these  plans  and  contracts  go  into  effect 
the  first  of  September.  The  annual  school  budget  should  be  made  at  the  time  plans 
and  contracts  are  made;  this  budget  should  include  the  expenditures  necessary  to 
carry  out  the  plans  and  contracts.  If  the  board  of  education  has  power  to  levy  a 
tax  up  to  a  certain  maximum  rate,  it  can  estimate  approximately  the  maximum 
revenue  available,  and  fixes  its  budget  to  this  estimate,  making  the  levy  necessary 
at  the  proper  time.  But  if  some  other  board,  like  the  city  council,  or  a  board  of 
tax  levy,  such  as  we  have  in  Minneapolis,  fixes  the  rate,  and  fixes  it  about  the 
first  of  October,  as  in  Minneapolis,  we  have  this  unfortunate  situation,  Plans  and 


44 

contracts  of  the  board  of  education  depending  upon  a  budget  made  months  before 
are  actually  in  operation;  this  condition  virtually  compels  the  tax  levy  board 
either  to  rubber  stamp  the  board  of  education's  budget  or  to  refuse  a  levy  suffi- 
cient to  meet  the  obligations  to  which  the  city  has  already  been  committed.  If  the 
board  of  tax  levy  decides  upon  the  latter  course,  then  the  board  of  education  is 
compelled  either  to  run  a  deficit  in  carrying  out  its  plans  and  contracts  or  to  dis- 
organize and  seriously  hamper  the  work  of  the  schools  by  revising  plans  so  as  to 
bring  the  budget  within  the  revenues  available. 

A  board  of  education  should  have  financial  power  corresponding  to  its  edu- 
cational responsibility.  Only  with  such  power  is  it  possible  to  plan  with  confidence 
and  to  carry  on  an  educational  system  efficiently  and  with  true  economy.  It  ifl 
probably  wise  to  put  a  maximum  limit,  by  statute  or  otherwise,  to  the  rate  that 
a  board  of  education  may  levy  for  educational  purposes;  otherwise  the  board 
might  get  so  enthusiastic  about  education  that  it  would  tax  the  city  into  bank- 
ruptcy. But  whatever  financial  checks  are  placed  upon  the  board  of  educa- 
tion, this  is  perfectly  clear:  the  board  should  know,  at  the  time  that  it  makes 
its  plans  and  contracts  for  a  year,  the  amount  of  money  that  will  be  available  for 
carrying  out  these  plans  and  contracts.  Unfortunately  this  is  not  the  condition 
under  which  the  Minneapolis  board  is  now  working. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  May  I  ask  what  supervision  the  board  of  education  has, 
or  what  power,  to  raise  a  certain  amountf 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  state  legislature  authorizes  a  maximum  rate  for  school 
purposes^  the  local  tax  levy  board  determines  the  rate  that  may  actually  be  levied 
within  the  maximum  authorized  by  the  legislature;  the  school  board  may  not  ex- 
ceed the  rate  fixed  by  the  tax  levy  board. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  So  you  are  not  sure  until  after  your  budget  is  adopted, 
how  much  money  you  will  have? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  not  until  the  plans  and  contracts,  on  which  the  budget  is 
based,  are  actually  in  operation.  The  school  year  has  begun  the  first  of  Septem- 
ber; we  have  been  running  a  month  before  we  know  how  much  money  we  shall 
have.  I  think  the  board  of  education  will  go  to  the  legislature  next  winter  for 
an  amendment  making  the  board  independent  of  the  tax  levy  board. 

Alderman  Buck:     How  are  the  members  of  the  tax  levy  board  chosen f 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  tax  levy  board  is  composed  entirely  of  ex-officio  mem- 
bers; they  are  the  president  of  the  board  of  education,  the  mayor,  the  comptroller, 
the  chairman  of  the  ways  and  means  committee  of  the  city  council,  the  president 
of  the  board  of  park  commissioners,  the  auditor  and  the  chairman  of  the  board  of 
county  commissioners. 

SMALL  BOARD  ELECTED  AT  LARGE. 

The  board  of  education  consists  of  seven  members,  elected  at  large,  for  six 
year  terms.  Two  or  three  are  elected  at  general  biennial  elections. 

On  account  of  the  fact  that  the  tax  levy  board  has  to  determine  the  rate  that 
may  be  actually  levied  the  board  of  education  makes  in  the  spring  what  is  known 
as  a  "tentative"  budget;  then  in  the  fall,  immediately  after  the  tax  levy  board 
has  determined  the  tax  rate,  the  board  of  education  estimates  the  revenues  from 
that  rate  and  makes  its  "final"  budget.  It  may  be  found  necessary  at  this  time 
to  cut  down  the  "tentative"  budget. 

Alderman  Gnadt:     Do  the  school  board  get  any  salary? 

Mr.  Spaulding:    No,  no  salary. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  What  part  does  the  school  superintendent  play  in  the 
preparation  of  this  budget?  Do  you  have  a  sort  of  dual  system  of  a  superintendent 
and  business  manager,  one  looking  after  the  matters  of  the  school  -and  the  other 
after  business  matters? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  We  have  a  business  manager,  who  has  the  title  of  "assist- 
ant superintendent  in  charge  of  business  affairs."  The  superintendent  has  the 
same  general  control  over  the  business  manager  that  he  has  over  other  assistant 
superintendents.  He  is  the  executive  head  of  the  whole  system.  The  rules  of  the 
board  provide  for  the  preparation  of  the  budget  by  the  superintendent  with  the 
assistance  of  his  associates,  especially  the  business  manager  and  the  auditor.  The 


45 

superintendent  is  responsible  for  laying  the  budget  before  the  board  of  education. 
We  have  no  standing  committees;  there  is  no  committee  on  finance. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     How  often  do  the  members  of  the  board  meet? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  They  have  two  regular  meetings  each  month.  There  are 
some  special  meetings;  they  probably  average  at  least  three  meetings  a  month. 

MINNEAPOLIS  HAS  NO  STANDING  COMMITTEES. 

Alderman  Buck:     How  many  committees  have  they? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No  standing  committees  at  all.  The  board  acts  as  a  whole  on 
matters  of  policy.  Quite  frequently  special  committees  are  appointed  to  investi- 
gate certain  things  for  the  information  of  the  board,  things  that  they  can  investi- 
gate perhaps  better  than  the  executive  officers  of  the  board. 

Alderman  Buck:  After  the  budget  is  passed  does  the  board  then  pass 
specifically  on  expenditures? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  board  does  not  pass  specifically  on  expenditures, 
especially  the  expenditures  for  the  maintenance  of  schools,  that  is,  the  educational 
expenditures.  The  budget  is  made  up  by  departments;  it  provides  certain  amounts 
for  different  types  of  expenditures.  In  accordance  with  the  rules  of  the  board 
the  superintendent  is  authorized  to  direct  expenditures  within  the  budget  ap- 
proved by  the  board,  and  for  the  purposes  approved  by  the  board,  making  a  report 
to  the  board  every  month  of  the  expenditures  for  the  preceding  month,  and  such 
further  reports  on  expenditures  as  the  board  may  at  any  time  call  for.  This  is 
the  procedure  respecting  educational  expenditures;  the  same  general  rules  apply 
to  expenditures  on  the  school  plant,  carried  out  under  the  immediate  direction  of 
the  business  manager.  In  these  expenditures,  however,  the  board  has  found  it 
advisable,  on  account  of  shortage  of  funds,  and  for  other  reasons,  to  make  appro- 
priations from  month  to  month  rather  than  for  a  full  year. 

Alderman  Buck:  You  spoke  of  the  relations  between  your  board  of  education 
and  the  board  of  tax  levy  in  Minneapolis;  what  would  you  say  in  general  as  to  the 
policy  of  divided  financial  control,  or  concentrated  financial  control;  that  is,  should 
the  finances  of  the  schools  be  entirely  in  the  hands  of  the  board  of  education  or 
should  there  be  some  other  reviewing  body? 

PUBLICITY  FOR  FINANCIAL  FACTS. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think  there  should  be  no  objection  to  having  expenditures 
reviewed  by  any  competent  body,  an  official  body,  or  a  committee  of  citizens, 
even  by  individual  citizens.  Expenditures  should  be  entirely  public,  the  raising 
of  revenues,  however,  within  legal  limits,  should  be  entirely  within  the  control  of 
the  board  of  education.  In  raising  legally  authorized  revenues,  there  should  most 
emphatically  be  no  control  of  the  board  of  education  after  the  time  that  the  board 
must  make  its  budget  and  enter  upon  its  plans  under  the  budget.  It  is  really  an 
intolerable  situation  where  the  board  of  education  is  required  to  enter  upon  a 
policy  of  expenditures  before  knowing  what  funds  are  to  be  available.  It  would 
be  a  considerable  relief,  for  instance,  in  Minneapolis,  if  our  tax  levy  board  could 
tell  us  in  the  spring,  when  we  have  to  make  our  plans,  how  much  of  the  maximum 
rate  this  board  will  authorize.  But  this  cannot  be  done,  for  the  tax  levy  board 
is  legally  in  existence  only  for  a  couple  of  weeks  in  the  fall.  In  the  interest  of 
efficient  management  of  the  schools,  the  board  of  education  should  be  independent 
in  the  making  of  budgets  and  tax  levies  within  the  limits  set  by  law  or  charter 
and  in  expenditures;  but  any  competent  review  or  examination  of  budgets  and 
expenditures  that  will  show  what  the  plans  of  the  board  are,  and  what  expen- 
ditures have  been  made  in  carrying  out  those  plans,  should  be  welcomed  by 
the  board  of  education  itself,  for  this  attitude  on  the  part  of  the  board  of  edu- 
cation will  help  to  command  the  confidence  of  the  people  and  so  gain  support 
for  a  sound  educational  policy. 

Alderman  Miller:  I  was  going  to  ask,  do  you  have  the  concurrence  of  the 
city  council  there  upon  the  expenditures  by  the  board? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  city  council  has  nothing  to  do  with  the  expenditures 
of  the  board.  When  the  tax  levy  board  determines  what  rate  may  be  levied, 


46 

within  the  limits  set  by  the  legislature,  the  board  of  education  then  makes  the 
levy  and  has  full  control  of  the  funds  arising  from  that  levy.  The  board  of 
education  always  levies  all  that  the  board  of  tax  levy  permits,  though  it  might 
levy  less. 

Alderman  Miller:  Does  the  same  rule  apply  in  regard  to  supplies;  that 
the  council  has  nothing  to  do  with  the  expenditures? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  council  has  no  direct  control  over  any  expenditures 
of  the  board  of  education.  The  council  does  control  the  issue  of  bonds  and 
may  seek  to  control  the  uses  of  the  proceeds  of  bond  sales  as  a  condition  of 
issuing  the  bonds;  legally,  however,  the  board  of  education  has  full  power  to 
spend  bond  money  as  it  sees  fit  so  long  as  it  confines  such  expenditures  to  the 
purposes,  usually  more  or  less  general,  for  which  the  legislature  authorized  the 
bond  issue. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  You  have  issued  bonds  for  the  purpose  of  erecting 
buildings? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     Yes. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Do  you  issue  bonds  for  all  the  buildings  you  are  in? 

SEEKS    "PAY  AS   YOU   GO"    BUILDING   POLICY. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  For  many  years  we  have  had  to  depend  entirely  upon  bond 
issues  for  the  building  of  new  buildings;  and  I  am  sorry  to  say  that  in  the  last 
few  years  a  good  deal  of  money,  the  proceeds  of  bond  sales,  has  been  ex- 
pended for  ordinary  repairs.  In  carrying  out  a  recently  formulated  building 
program  covering  the  next  five  years,  we  are  recommending  that  we  make  a 
beginning  toward  getting  on  to  a  basis  of  "pay  as  you  go.M  The  issuance  of 
bonds  is  deceptive;  it  appears  to  keep  the  tax  rate  down,  while  in  the  long  run 
it  really  raises  it.  For  instance,  with  us  the  usual  terms  of  bonds  is  30  years 
at  4  per  cent;  upon  that  basis  we  have  to  pay  in  taxes  $2,200  before  a  bond  of 
$1,000  is  retired,  or  we  should  have  to  pay  that  much  did  not  the  interest  on  a 
gradually  accumulating  sinking  fund  reduce  this  amount  somewhat.  Hence,  it 
seems  to  me  unwise  and  uneconomical  to  depend  exclusively  or  largely  upon 
bond  issues  for  the  building  of  buildings,  and  there  is  no  question  about  the  in- 
advisability  of  borrowing  money  to  set  a  pane  of  glass  or  to  mend  locks  on  doors. 
The  Minneapolis  board  of  education  has  never  approved  the  policy  of  resorting 
to  bond  issues  to  pay  for  repairs;  it  has  been  forced  to  this  policy;  or  rather 
chosen  it  in  preference  to  curtailing  necessary  expenditures  for  school  mainte- 
nance. The  funds  arising  from  tax  levies  have  been  insufficient  both  for  main- 
tenance and  repairs. 

In  the  building  program  of  which  I  speak,  the  board  is  proposing  an  annual 
tax  levy  that  will  provide  about  40  per  cent  of  the  total  amount  to  be  expended; 
the  rest  is  to  come  from  bond  issues.  It  is  hoped  that  eventually,  perhaps  in 
twenty  years,  when  most  of  our  present  outstanding  bonds  are  retired  and  interest 
charges  cease,  we  may  get  on  a  permanent  basis  of  paying  for  buildings  as 
erected.  In  growing  cities,  as  some  studies  that  have  recently  been  made  show, 
the  cost  of  new  buildings  and  other  permanent  improvements  constitutes  a  charge, 
almost  as  constant  as  that  for  school  maintenance.  While  this  charge  varies 
somewhat  from  year  to  year,  the  average  of  a  five  year  period  shows  hardly 
more  variation  than  the  annual  expenditures  for  maintenance.  Of  course  if  the 
erection  of  buildings  were  a  rare  event,  occurring,  say,  only  at  intervals  of  ten 
or  fifteen  years,  then  it  might  be  sound  policy  to  spread  the  cost  of  each  building 
over  a  period  of  ten  or  fifteen  years;  but  when  the  annual  expenditures  for  new 
buildings  are  approximately  constant,  then  it  will  tend  to  a  lower  tax  levy  to  pay 
as  you  go. 

Alderman  Buck:  You  said  you  favor  the  board  of  education  having  control 
and  not  dividing  the  control  of  finances  with  any  other  organization;  would  your 
opinion  be  the  same  whether  the  board  was  elected  or  appointed  in  respect  to  that  ? 

FINANCIAL   INDEPENDENCE    DESIRABLE. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  do  not  see  that  the  method  of  securing  the  board  should 
affect  this  matter,  I  advocate  undivided  financial  control  for  the  board  of  educa- 


47 

tion  to  enable  that  board  to  make  and  to  put  into  operation  comprehensive  and 
far-reaching  plans  with  confidence  that  the  funds  necessary  to  secure  the  unin- 
terrupted execution  of  those  plans  will  be  available  as  needed.  There  seems  to 
be  a  conflict  between  the  function  of  a  tax  levy  board, — or  any  board  of  financial 
control,  whatever  its  name,  and  the  function  of  a  board  of  education.  The  func- 
tion of  the  board  of  financial  control  is  that  of  keeping  the  tax  levy  as~low  as 
possible,  while  the  function  of  the  board  of  education  is  that  of  developing  a 
system  of  education  adequate  to  the  needs  of  the  community.  Now  these  two  func- 
tions, keeping  the  tax  levy  as  low  as  possible,  and  developing  an  adequate  system 
of  schools,  are  very  likely  to  be  in  conflict  at  times. 

Of  course  the  more  money  there  is  available,  assuming  that  it  is  expended 
wisely,  the  better  the  school  system  that  can  be  developed;  but  whether  the  money 
available  be  much  or  little,  sufficient  or  insufficient,  in  the  interest  of  simple 
business  efficiency,  the  board  of  education  must  know  how  much  it  can  count  on 
and  must  know  this  in  advance  of  planning  expenditures. 

Also  from  the  educational  standpoint,  it  is  important  that  financial  control 
commensurate  with  educational  responsibility  be  centralized  in  the  board  of  edu- 
cation. The  public,  without  thinking  much  about  the  connection  between  finances 
and  education,  looks  to  the  board  of  education  to  make  adequate  provision  for  the 
educational  needs  of  the  community.  This  is  right;  no  other  board  is  charged 
with  this  responsibility.  But  this  responsibility  cannot  be  fully  assumed  and 
discharged  without  the  exercise  of  corresponding  financial  power.  School  boards 
are  certainly  not  more  likely  to  abuse  this  power  than  are  other  boards,  nor, 
with  fixed  limits  to  the  tax  that  they  may  levy,  can  they  greatly  abuse  such  power. 
If  the  people  are  not  satisfied  with  the  board's  expenditures  and  their  exercise 
of  financial  power,  they  have  redress. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  think  it  is  desirable  to  have  the  election  directly 
by  the  people? 

BOAED  ELECTED   AT  LARGE   IS   BEST. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think,  on  the  whole,  election  at  large  is  the  best  means 
of  securing  a  board  of  education.  I  have  worked  under  boards  elected  by  wards, 
boards  elected  at  large,  and  boards  whose  members  represented  wards  but  were 
elected  by  the  whole  city  electorate;  I  have  never  worked  under  an  appointive 
board.  I  think  a  study  of  the  history  of  boards  of  education  indicates  that 
election  at  large,  on  the  whole,  secures  boards  likely  to  render  the  best  service. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  think  that  the  financial  and  business  management  of 
the  school  affairs  should  be  independent  of  the  superintendent  of  schools? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  decidedly  not.  It  is  just  as  illogical  and  inefficient  to 
separate  the  financial  and  the  educational  affairs  of  school  administration,  as  it 
would  be  to  separate  finances  from  the  productive  activities  of  any  enterprise. 
For  instance,  a  shoe  factory  would  scarcely  be  entrusted  to  two  independent  man- 
agers, one  of  whom  was  expert  in  the  production  of  shoes  but  had  no  respon- 
sibility for  costs,  while  the  other  knew  nothing  about  shoe  production  but  was 
an  expert  in  finances,  which  he  controlled.  The  superintendent  of  schools  need 
not  necessarily  be  an  expert  on.  business  details,  but  he  ought  to  be  able,  by  con- 
ference with  the  business  expert,  to  determine  sound  business  policies  in  connec- 
tion with  his  educational  policies,  thus  conducting  the  system  efficiently  both 
from  an  educational  and  a  financial  standpoint. 

Alderman  Buck:  You  would  have  all  the  heads  of  departments  under  the 
superintendent  of  schools. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think  that  is  the  efficient  way.  I  do  not  know  of  an 
efficiently  managed  business  where  there  is  divided  control  respecting  fundamental 
matters  that  are  really  inseparable. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  do  you  think  of  the  wisdom  of  having  two  separate 
funds,  one  for  maintenance  of  the  schools,  an  educational  fund,  to  carry  on 
the  education  in  the  schools,  and  one  for  building? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Two  funds  are  quite  common.  The  important  thing  is  to 
have  adequate  funds;  if  they  are  adequate,  and  well  handled,  it  makes  little  differ- 
ence whether  they  are  in  one  or  two  funds. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  would  you  say  as  to  the  wisdom  of  having  a  separate 
tax  levy  for  each  purpose? 


48 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  cannot  see  that  it  would  necessarily  make  any  difference 
whether  a  single  levy  is  made  to  cover  both  educational  and  building  needs,  or 
whether  there  is  a  separate  levy  for  each.  Local  conditions,  however,  might 
make  either  plan  preferable  to  the  other.  For  instance,  in  case  of  a  single  fund 
there  might  be  a  tendency  to  develop  an  educational  program  at  the  expense 
of  proper  extension  and  maintenance  of  the  plant,  or  perhaps  more  likely,  espe- 
cially if  laymen  controlled  the  fund,  a  tendency  to  invest  in  new  buildings  out  of 
proportion  to  the  investment  in  educational  service.  New  buildings,  architectural 
monuments,  are  evidences  of  progress  that  every  one  can  see,  while  few  appre- 
ciate higher  types  of  service  with  the  school.  I  realize  that  I  have  answered 
your  question  rather  indefinitely. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  Illinois  we  have  two  levies.  Our  tax  rate  for  the  edu- 
cational fund  is  lower  than  our  tax  rate  for  the  building  fund;  what  would  you 
think  of  that  proportion? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think  it  is  all  out  of  proportion.  I  should  say  that,  on 
the  average,  the  building  fund  need  not  be  more  than  one-half,  or  at  most  two- 
thirds,  as  large  as  the  educational  fund. 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Chairman,  if  there  is  nothing  further  on  the  question 
of  finances,  I  would  like,  in  view  of  the  fact  that  we  have  had  nothing  on  the 
matter  of  vocational  education,  to  defer  questions  on  general  school  policy  until 
Mr.  Spaulding  has  told  us  something  of  what  he  has  accomplished  in  Minneapolis 
in  the  matter  of  industrial  education. 

INDUSTRIAL  EDUCATION  IN  MINNEAPOLIS. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Two  years  ago  last  fall,  when  I  went  to  Minneapolis  as 
superintendent,  there  was  no  real  industrial  education  in  the  city.  There  was 
manual  training  in  the  higher  grades  and  in  the  high  schools;  also  cooking  and 
sewing.  Comparatively  little  time  was  devoted  to  these  studies  in  the  grade 
schools,  two  or  three  hours  a  week.  A  little  more  than  two  years  ago,  Mr.  William 
H.  Dunwoody,  a  citizen  of  Minneapolis,  died,  leaving  a  fund  for  industrial  educa- 
tion. This  fund,  increased  at  the  death  of  Mrs.  Dunwoody  a  year  ago,  now 
amounts  to  somewhat  more  than  $5,000,000. 

The  board  of  education  and  the  trustees  of  the  Dunwoody  fund  cooperated 
a  year  and  a  half  ago  in  securing  a  careful  and  comprehensive  survey  of  the 
city  to  determine  the  opportunities  and  needs  for  industrial  education,  also  to 
determine  a  policy  by  which  the  board  of  education  and  the  Dunwoody  trustees 
might  work  out  the  industrial  education  problem  harmoniously.  This  survey  was 
made  under  the  direction  of  Dr.  C.  A.  Prosser,  who  was  then  secretary  of  the 
National  Society  for  the  Promotion  of  Industrial  Education.  Before  the  survey 
was  completed,  Dr.  Prosser  was  engaged,  as  director  of  the  industrial  education 
to  be  carried  on  through  the  income  of  the  Dunwoody  fund.  The  result  of  the 
survey  was  to  show  the  needs  for  industrial  and  prevocational  education  both  from 
the  standpoint  of  the  children  and  youth  of  the  city,  and  from  the  standpoint 
of  the  industries  and  the  commerce  of  the  city,  for  the  survey  was  commercial 
as  well  as  industrial. 

As  a  further  result  of  the  survey,  the  board  of  education  and  the  trustees 
of  the  Dunwoody  Institute  adopted  certain  general  plans  of  procedure  which 
leave  each  body  free  to  furnish  and  responsible  for  furnishing  education  of  an 
industrial  or  commercial  type  within  certain  fields  and  limits.  For  the  present 
the  Dunwoody  Institute  is  providing  all  of  the  strictly  trade  training  for  boys 
and  trade  extension  work  for  youth  and  men  in  day  and  evening  schools.  Ac- 
cording to  the  terms  of  the  bequest,  the  income  of  the  Dunwoody  fund  may  be 
used  to  provide  industrial  education  for  girls  and  women  as  well  as  men,  but 
as  the  income  will  not  be  sufficient  to  provide  such  education  adequately  for  both 
sexes,  the  Dunwoody  trustees  are  confining  their  efforts  to  boys  and  men,  leaving 
to  the  board  of  education  the  provision  of  all  prevocational  education  for  both 
sexes,  and  all  industrial  education  for  girls  and  women.  About  two  years  ago 
the  Dunwoody  trustees  established  a  day  trade  school  for  boys.  At  the  same 
time  the  board  of  education  established  a  day  trade  school  for  girls.  The 
board  of  education  is  also  beginning  to  organize  junior  high  schools  in  which  the 
opportunity  is  offered  both  to  boys  and  girls  to  take  up  so-called  prevocational 


49 

studies.  These  prevocational  studies  occupy  twenty-five  to  thirty  per  cent  of  the 
time  of  those  who  elect  them,  the  remainder  of  their  time  being  devoted  to  the 
usual  academic  studies.  The  prevocational  subjects  offered  are  wood  work,  sheet 
metal  work,  elementary  electrical  work,  elementary  commercial  work,  elementary 
agricultural  work,  printing,  cooking,  sewing  and  household  management. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  This  Dun  woody  Institute  is  something  similar  tern  Jiigh 
school,  that  is,  do  the  students  there  first  complete  a  grammar  school  course? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Some  boys  over  fourteen  years  old  who  have  not  completed 
the  grammar  school  course  have  been  admitted  to  the  Dunwoody  day  school,  but 
most  of  them  have  completed  the  eighth  grade. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Does  the  board  of  education  have  any  jurisdiction  over 
these  schools? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  not  over  the  Dunwoody  Institute;  through  co-operation 
of  the  board  of  education  and  the  Dunwoody  trustees,  however,  the  Dunwoody 
Institute  fits  in  with  the  plans  of  the  board  just  as  completely  as  if  it  were 
under  the  board's  jurisdiction. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     What  are  some  of  the  trades  that  are  taught  there? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Electrical  work,  automobile  repairing,  printing,  machine  shop 
and  cabinet  work,  carpentry  and  sheet  metal  work. 

Alderman  Miller:     Painting  too? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Not  in  the  day  school.  I  think  they  give  instruction  in 
painting  in  the  evening  school.  Their  evening  school  work  is  more  extensive 
than  the  day  school  work.  Instruction  in  each  trade  in  the  evening  school  is 
limited  to  those  who  are  engaged  in  that  trade  in  some  capacity. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Have  they  gotten  into  touch  with  labor  organizations 
in  those  industries? 

ADVISORY    COMMITTEES    ESTABLISHED. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes,  they  have  a  series  of  advisory  committees,  I  think  one 
for  each  trade  in  which  instruction  is  given.  Each  advisory  committee  is  made 
up  of  employers  and  employes  among  the  latter  are  representatives  of  labor 
unions.  This  plan  is  working  out  very  satisfactorily.  We  have  similar  advisory 
committees  in  connection  with  the  trade  courses  for  girls  in  the  girls'  vocational 
school. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  what  proportion  have  you  members  of  the  advisory  com- 
mittees from  employers  and  from  unions? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Employers  and  employes  are  represented  in  equal  propor- 
tion, but  only  a  portion  of  the  employes  represent  labor  unions.  There  is  no 
further  issue  there  over  the  matter  of  representation. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Both  sides  are  satisfied. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  All  work  together  harmoniously  when  they  can  sit  around  a 
table  and  talk  matters  over. 

Alderman  Buck:  There  have  been  no  important  controversies  in  connection 
with  that. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No.  There  were  one  or  two  trades  in  which  the  employers, 
I  believe,  at  first  objected  to  entering  into  any  arrangement  for  advisory  com- 
mittees composed  of  employers  and  employes.  These  trades  were  left  without 
advisory  committees,  while  the  committees  for  the  other  trades  were  organized. 
Soon  the  employers  who  at  first  objected  were  ready  to  form  committees.*  I 
think  these  are  completed  now;  there  is  a  committee  on  every  trade  taught,  in  the 
day  school. 

The  advisory  committees  have  no  definite  control.  They  understand  that 
the  board  of  trustees  and  the  executive  officers  of  the  school  are  the  official  authori- 
ties on  all  subjects;  but  I  think  the  general  policy  of  the  school  is  unanimously 
approved  by  all  these  advisory  committees.  They  have  been  asked  to  make 
suggestions  and  to  pass  in  a  general  way  upon  the  proposals  of  the  school  man- 
agement respecting  courses  of  study,  the  length  of  time  that  pupils  shall  serve  in 

*In  revising  the"report  of  these  proceedings  I  find  that  one  trade  is  still  without  its  advisory 
committee — Mr.  Spaulding. 


50 

the  school,  the  opportunities  for  employment  and  the  initial  wage  of  graduates 
of  the  school.  Through  these  committees,  conditions  of  employment  have  been 
formulated  for  those  who  have  completed  courses  in  the  school;  conditions  em- 
bodying the  initial  wage  and  the  credit  on  the  usual  term  of  apprenticeship  on 
account  of  the  school  course.  These  conditions  have  received  the  approval  of 
labor  unions  and  have  been  formally  accepted  and  signed  by  large  numbers  of 
the  leading  employes  of  the  city.  In  short,  most  of  those  things,  which  are  fre- 
quently issues,  have  been  settled  harmoniously  through  these  committees. 

TIME  IN  SCHOOL  APPLIES  ON  APPRENTICESHIP. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  While  the  students  are  in  those  schools,  are  any  of  them 
working  in  the  various  industries  at  the  same  time? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Comparatively  few  of  those  in  the  day  school;  but  prac- 
tically all  of  those  who  are  in  the  night  school.  There  are  also  day  classes  of  adult 
workmen  who  are  engaged  in  the  trade.  These  are  working  in  8-hour  shifts  and 
have  time  available  during  the  day  in  which  they  get  instruction  at  the  school. 

Alderman  Miller:  How  long  does  it  require  they  should  take  that  training 
in  any  one  particular  trade? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  They  have  what  they  call  "unit  courses;"  a  pupil  must 
complete  a  certain  number  of  units  before  he  is  considered  fit  to  go  out.  On 
the  average,  a  pupil  will  spend  about  two  years  in  the  day  school. 

Alderman  Miller:  Is  there  any  understanding  then  between  the  pupil  that 
may  take  that  course  and  the  labor  unions  as  to  what  his  standing  will  be,  or 
would  he  still  have  to  be  an  apprentice  and  go  through  the  years  that  the 
unions  may  require  before  he  is  employed  as  a  mechanic? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  course  in  the  school  is  credited  for  so  much  time  towards 
the  time  of  his  apprenticeship  in  the  trade.  I  cannot  tell  positively  what  the 
ratio  of  credit  is.  I  am  inclined  to  think  it  is  year  for  year.  This  credit  is 
definitely  agreed  upon,  and  is  universally  accepted,  I  believe,  by  the  unions  and 
the  employers.  Of  course  not  many  have  yet  gone  into  the  trade,  with  the  full 
approval  of  the  school,  because  the  school  is  not  yet  two  years  old.  This  year  a 
considerable  number  will  complete  their  courses. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     This  is  strictly  a  vocational  school? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  think  it  is  desirable  to  develop  a  system  of  voca- 
tional schools  independent  of  the  rest  of  the  public  school  system  and  under  a 
different  jurisdiction,  so  that  they  would  practically  have  one  set  of  schools  under 
one  superintendent  and  another  set  under  another? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Not  at  all  desirable.  All  local  schools  maintained  at  public 
expense  should  be  under  one  jurisdiction. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     You  believe  in  a  united  system? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes;  because  I  believed  in  it  so  strongly,  I  took  steps 
early  to  get  the  board  of  education  and  the  Dunwoody  trustees  to  formulate  plans 
of  harmonious  action  and  co-operation.  By  the  terms  of  the  Dunwoody  bequest, 
there  can  be  no  actual  single  control  of  this  fund  and  the  public  funds. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  It  is  sometimes  said  that  an  industrial  vocation  cannot 
be  developed  in  a  real  scientific  way  under  the  jurisdiction  of  the  regular  public 
school,  what  has  been  your  experience  up  there?  Do  you  think  that  is  borne 
out  in  Minneapolis? 

DUAL  SYSTEM  OF  SCHOOLS  UNDESIRABLE. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  I  do  not  think  it  is  true  at  all.  I  think  there  may  be 
conditions — I  think  there  were  conditions — in  some  places  and  some  years  ago 
when  the  surest  and  quickest  way  to  make  a  beginning  of  industrial  education 
was  to  begin  on  an  independent  basis,  but  I  do  not  believe  that  is  a  good  way, 
an  efficient  way,  in  the  long  run.  For  instance,  I  was  in  Massachusetts  when  a 
state  system  of  industrial  education  was  established.  A  separate  board  in  charge 
of  industrial  education  was  appointed  by  the  governor,  while  there  was  already 
a  board  of  education.  Well,  this  Industrial  Education  Board  did  succeed  in 


51 

arousing  a  good  deal  of  interest  in  industrial  education;  also  a  good  deal  of 
controversy  and  much  antagonism  sprang  up  throughout  the  state,  after  two  or 
three  years  of  this,  until  both  boards  were  abolished,  and  a  single  board  was 
created  to  have  oversight  over  both  industrial  and  general  education  in  the  state. 
Great  improvement  has  resulted  from  unified  control. 

Alderman  Miller:  Is  this  course  theoretical  or  practical  that  they  take  in 
industrial  training? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Absolutely  practical..  Their  instructors  are  all  expert  work- 
men in  their  respective  trades;  most  of  them  were  taken  directly  from  the  trades. 

Alderman  Miller:  Is  it  a  co-operative  plan?  Do  the  members  of  the  union, 
the  Federation  of  Labor,  take  those  pupils  in  as  apprentices  in  their  respective 
trades? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Oh,  yes,  that  is  part  of  the  agreement  entered  into  through 
the  mediation  of  the  advisory  committees.  If  you  want  detailed  information  on 
the  subject,  write  to  C.  A.  Prosser,  director  of  the  Dunwoody  Institute.  I  know 
only  the  general  policy. 

The  Chairman:     Is  there  anything  further  under  that  head? 

Miss  Haley:  Do  I  understand  that  the  educational  work  of  the  board  is 
done  in  connection  with  the  Dunwoody  Institute? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  girls'  vocational  school  maintained  by  this  board  of 
education  occupies  the  same  building  with  the  Dunwoody  Institute. 

Miss  Haley:     Is  it  co-educational  work? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No.  The  work  of  the  Dunwoody  Institute  was  organized 
and  started  before  they  had  any  building.  At  that  time,  two  years  ago,  a  large 
high  school  building  had  just  been  vacated;  a  part  of  it  was  rented  by  the  board 
of  education  to  the  Dunwoody  Institute  at  a  nominal  rental;  and  they  con- 
ducted their  school  in  this  old  high  school  building.  The  girls'  vocational  school 
is  also  carried  on  in  the  same  building,  but  there  is  no  connection  between  the 
two  schools  in  their  organization.  The  Dunwoody  people  are  building  a  new 
building  and  they  will  occupy  it  within  a  year. 

CO-EDUCATION  IN  VOCATIONAL  TRAINING. 

Miss  Haley:  If  the  girls  want  to  learn  trades,  would  you  have  different  classes 
of  work  for  the  girls? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  question  has  never  arisen.  No  girls  have  signified  any 
desire  to  do  any  work  that  the  boys  are  offered. 

Miss  Haley:     You  have  it  entirely  separate? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  organizations  are  separate;  they  simply  happen  to  occupy 
the  same  building.  At  the  end  of  the  year  they  will  be  in  separate  buildings. 

Miss  Haley:     You  approve  of  separate  educational  work? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  believe  in  co-education  in  general,  but  in  a  trade  school 
the  work  that  appeals  to  boys  and  girls  is  so  different  that  the  sexes  naturally 
separate  themselves.  A  girl  might  want  to  take  printing,  for  instance;  but  in  the 
pre-vocational  work  of  our  junior  high  schools  where  printing  is  offered,  not  a  girl 
has  yet  chosen  it,  though  free  to  do  so. 

Miss  Haley:  Nearly  all  of  the  binding  in  Chicago  is  done  by  girls.  Is  there 
no  training  for  girls  in  that  trade? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  We  give  no  training  in  binding  at  present.  Ordinary  book 
binding  is  not  very  remunerative,  and  does  not  require  very  much  education  that 
a  trade  school  could  give.  I  doubt  that  it  is  wise  to  put  this  in  the  school  cur- 
riculum; the  little  technique  connected  with  machine  bookbinding  can  be  better 
and  more  quickly  learned  in  the  trade  itself. 

Miss  Haley:  I  understand  last  week  one  of  the  members  of  the  board  served 
notice  on  the  committee  of  which  he  is  a  member  that  he  would  recommend  the 
separation  of  the  boys  and  girls  in  the  educational  work  in  Chicago.  It  would 
practically  put  it  on  the  same  basis  as  in  Minneapolis.  He  said  his  committee 
would  shortly  make  that  recommendation  to  the  survey  committee.  It  is  a  very 
practical  question  with  us  now. 

Alderman  Buck:  On  what  basis  do  you  determine  the  studies  you  shall  include 
in  the  vocational  courses? 


52 

Mr.  Spaulding:  In  the  strictly  trade  courses  offered  by  the  Dunwoody  In- 
stitute, the  studies  or  trades  to  be  taught  were  determined  largely  as  a  result  of 
the  survey  of  which  I  spoke.  That  survey  showed  the  conditions  of  various  indus- 
tries, and  trades, — the  number  of  employes,  the  number  needed  each  year,  the  con- 
ditions of  work,  the  remuneration,  the  demand,  and  so  on.  On  the  basis  of  this 
data  seven  or  eight  different  trades  were  established,  among  which  pupils  have  free 
choice.  The  trades  offering  the  best  opportunities  and  requiring  the  largest  number 
of  employes  have  been  established  first.  When  the  school  gets  into  their  own 
larger  quarters,  probably  present  courses  will  be  extended  and  others  added. 

I  will  say  that  for  some  reason  the  printing  course  is  not  sought  by  many 
pupils,  although  the  survey  showed  a  quite  large  demand  and  good  pay  for  printers. 
But  the  boys  are  attracted  by  something  more  spectacular,  such  as  automobile 
work,  or  electrical  work.  In  the  pre-vocational  work  of  the  junior  high  schools, 
however,  good  numbers  are  taking  printing. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Are  the  jurisdiction  of  the  board  and  the  superintendent 
and  the  teachers,  their  powers  and  responsibilities  and  duties  set  forth  specifically 
in  the  statute  of  Minnesota? 

BOAED  REGULATES  STATUS  OF  SUPERINTENDENT. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  they  are  not.  The  statutes  are  very  general.  The  board 
of  education  has  authority  to  lay  down  its  own  policies;  it  makes  such  rules  as  it 
sees  fit.  It  determines,  for  instance,  the  relation  of  a  principal  to  the  executive 
employes  of  the  board,  to  the  teachers,  and  so  on.  The  board  rules  are  subject 
to  change  at  any  time  that  the  board  sees  fit  to  make  a  change. 

Alderman  Buck:  Will  you  outline  for  us,  Mr.  Spaulding,  the  nature  of  the 
relations  between  the  superintendent  and  the  board  and  the  teachers  and  superin- 
tendent in  Minneapolis? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  board  of  education  acts  as  a  whole.  It  has  no  standing 
committees.  It  appoints  from  time  to  time  special  committees  on  definite  matters 
on  which  the  board  may  wish  information  or  investigation  that  can  be  better  se- 
cured by  small  numbers  than  by  the  board  as  a  whole.  The  board  acts  in  a  legis- 
lative capacity,  passing  upon  policies  that  are  recommended  by  the  superintendent, 
or  determining  policies  of  its  own  initiative,  which  are  to  be  followed  in  the  con- 
duct of  the  schools.  The  superintendent  is  the  executive  officer  of  the  board;  to 
assist  him  there  are  six  assistant  superintendents,  one  of  whom  is  in  charge  of  busi- 
ness affairs.  Each  assistant  superintendent  in  charge  of  general  educational  work 
is  assigned  to  a  district  over  which  he  has  supervision.  There  is  also  a  considerable 
corps  of  special  supervisors. 

The  superintendent,  as  the  executive  officer  of  the  board,  carries  out  the 
board's  policies,  or  directs  the  carrying  out  of  those  policies,  including  the  expen- 
diture of  funds,  as  I  think  I  have  already  indicated.  The  assistant  superintendents 
give  a  large  part  of  their  time,  that  is  the  educational  assistant  superintendents, 
give  a  large  part  of  their  time  to  the  supervision  of  the  schools,  but  confer,  consult 
and  co-operate  with  the  superintendent  at  all  times  in  the  development  of  plans 
to  carry  out  the  policies  laid  down  by  the  board  of  education. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     How  many  schools  have  you  there? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     There  are  about  eighty  different  schools. 

Alderman  Kennedy:    And  what  is  the  average  attendance  of  those  schools? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  About  50,000;  there  are  over  1,700  teachers.  According  to  the 
rules  of  the  board  there  is  an  annual  election  of  teachers;  but  after  a  two  years' 
probationary  period,  in  accordance  with  the  rules,  a  teacher  may  expect  annual 
re-election  except  for  cause.  The  superintendent  is  charged  with  the  recommenda- 
tion of  new  teachers  and  of  old  teachers  for  re-election. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Does  the  board  of  education  ever  take  matters  into 
their  own  hands,  the  appointment  or  rejection  of  teachers? 

TEACHERS  RECOMMENDED  BY  SUPERINTENDENT. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  board  has  appointed  every  one  that  has  been  recom- 
mended and  has  appointed  no  one  that  has  not  been  recommended  by  the  super- 


53 

intendent.  The  rules  provide  that  the  superintendent  shall  recommend  teachers 
for  appointment  and  courses  of  study  and  text  books  for  adoption.  Of  course  the 
superintendent  does  not  do  all  of  these  things  alone;  he  has  to  assume  the  respon- 
sibility, but  he  has  the  assistance,  as  he  should,  of  his  associates,  the  assistant 
superintendents,  supervisors,  and  others  throughout  the  school  system. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  You  said  after  two  years  none  of  the  teachers  are 
dropped  except  for  cause?  In  case  the  teacher  is  dropped,  is  there  any  warning 
given  beforehand,  or  consultation  with  her? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes,  abundant  warning  is  given.  This  is  the  plan  that  we 
have  been  following  for  the  last  two  years,  that  is,  since  I  have  been  in  Minneap- 
olis. According  to  the  rules  of  the  board,  teachers  are  recommended  for  reappoint- 
ment  in  April.  It  is  the  function  of  assistant  superintendents  in  their  respective 
districts  and  the  principals  in  their  schools  to  assist  teachers  all  they  can  to  make 
their  work  as  successful  as  possible.  It  is  also  the  duty  of  assistant  superintend- 
ents and  principals  to  inform  teachers  early  in  the  year  if  they  cannot  recommend 
the  teachers'  reappointment.  About  the  first  of  March  certain  blanks  are  sent  out 
on  which  the  principal  must  make  his  recommendation  concerning  each  teacher 
under  his  direction.  If  that  recommendation  is  in  any  way  adverse,  for  example, 
if  it  means  termination  of  service,  or  no  salary  increase  when  one  might  be  ex- 
pected, then  this  written  recommendation  is  placed  before  the  teacher  and  ex- 
plained by  the  principal.  Below,  on  the  same  sheet,  the  teacher  writes  any 
objection  or  comment  on  the  recommendation  that  she  pleases.  The  principal's 
recommendation  with  the  teacher 's  objection  or  comment  then  goes  to  the  assistant 
superintendent  in  charge  of  that  district.  The  assistant  superintendent  looks  into 
the  matter,  usually  conferring  with  both  teacher  and  principal,  and  then  writes 
his  recommendation,  which  may  be  in  agreement  or  in  disagreement  with  that  of 
the  principal.  Again  the  teacher,  having  read  the  assistant  superintendent 's  recom- 
mendation, writes  anything  that  she  pleases  in  reply;  and  she  is  particularly  asked 
to  say  whether  she  wants  an  interview  with  the  superintendent  before  he  makes 
a  final  recommendation  to  the  board  based  on  the  recommendations  of  principal 
and  assistant  superintendent.  The  teacher  is  always  given  this  interview  if  she 
wishes  it. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Is  that  a  rule  of  the  board? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  a  matter  of  policy  that  the  superintendent  has  adopted 
in  carrying  out  the  board  rules. 

Alderman  Buck:  It  is  a  rule,  however,  that  the  teachers  shall  be  re-elected 
only  except  for  cause. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Except  for  cause;  but  I  think  the  rule  goes  on  to  say  that 
the  board  is  the  judge  of  its  own  causes  for  failure  to  re-elect. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Is  it  one  of  the  rules  that  recommendations  for  appoint- 
ment must  come  from  the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     It  is. 

Alderman  Kennedy:    Does  that  apply  to  text  books  and  courses  of  study  also? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     It  applies  to  everything. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Under  its  own  rules  the  board  cannot  initiate  those  mat- 
ters. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Why,  of  course,  the  board  is  more  powerful  than  any  rules 
it  makes;  but  it  would  not  be  consistent  with  the  spirit  or  the  letter  of  the  rules 
if  the  board  did  attempt  to  take  the  initiative  in  these  matters. 

Alderman  Miller:  Kef  erring  back  to  the  teachers,  don't  you  think  it  would  be 
a  better  proposition  for  the  teachers  to  have  a  hearing  when  they  are  charged  with 
anything  before  the  board  and  have  a  right  to  bring  in  their  witnesses  and  every- 
thing? 

Mr.  Spaulding:    They  have  that  right. 

Alderman  Miller:  And  not  be  under  duress  to  sign  anything  they  do  not  want 
to  sign? 

OPPORTUNITY  FOR  TEACHERS'  DEFENSE. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  fear  you  do  not  fully  understand  the  plan.  The  teacher 
is  not  required  to  sign  anything  at  all.  For  the  teacher 's  protection  and  informa- 
tion every  adverse  recommendation  concerning  her  is  made  in  writing;  she  is  given 


54 

the  opportunity  of  reading  each  one  as  made,  and  making  her  written  comment 
on  it.  The  principal,  for  example,  may  recommend  that  a  teacher  be  not  reap- 
pointed  because  of  weakness  in  teaching,  lack  of  ability  to  control,  or  incapacity 
through  any  cause.  The  teacher  may  write  underneath  this  recommendation  that 
the  statements  are  not  true,  that  she  would  like  further  trial,  would  like  a  transfer 
to  another  building,  would  like  leave  of  absence  to  study  or  to  recover  her  health; 
or,  she  may  say  that  under  the  circumstances  she  does  not  wish  reappointment; 
indeed,  she  may  write  anything  that  she  chooses  or  simply  sign  her  name  to  the 
printed  statement  on  the  blank — "I  have  read  the  above  recommendation "- 
to  show  to  assistant  superintendent  and  superintendent  that  she  has  seen  the 
recommendation  and  has  had  opportunity  to  reply  to  it.  This  recommendation 
with  the  teacher's  reply,  if  any,  then  goes  to  the  assistant  superintendent  con- 
cerned, who  makes  his  recommendation  in  writing,  still  on  the  same  sheet.  Again 
the  teacher  has  opportunity  to  make  her  reply  to  this  recommendation.  The 
directions  over  the  blank  in  which  she  is  to  make  reply  especially  request  her  to 
say  whether  or  not  she  wishes  an  interview  with  the  superintendent  before  he  puts 
his  recommendation  before  the  board.  If  she  does  desire  such  an  interview,  she 
always  gets  it.  Thus  far,  in  every  case  where  the  teacher  has  requested  it,  it  has 
been  possible  for  the  superintendent  to  make  a  personal  investigation;  he  always 
tries  to  do  anything  within  reason  that  the  teacher  may  request  to  get  a  judg- 
ment on  her  work  and  ability  that  she  will  consider  fair.  Finally,  the  teacher, 
if  she  wants  to  appeal  to  the  board,  can  do  so.  There  has  been  but  one  such 
appeal  to  the  board  since  I  have  been  in  Minneapolis. 

Alderman  Miller:  I  will  tell  you  what  I  had  in  mind.  I  had  in  mind  this, 
that  any  time  thac  a  teacher  was  not  to  be  recommended  that  the  best  judge 
would  be  another  teacher  sent  there  by  the  board  of  education,  putting  those 
children  under  a  test  and  seeing  if  they  were  efficient  and  if  they  were  being 
taught  as  they  should  be  and  had  progressed  properly.  I  do  not  want  to  conflict 
with  your  suggestions,  but  I  believe  there  should  be  a  "show  down." 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Last  spring  one  of  the  teachers'  organizations,  the  Grade 
Teachers'  Association,  appointed  a  committee  that  offered  to  hear  complaints 
of  any  teacher  who  thought  she  had  not  been  fairly  dealt  with  in  the  recom- 
mendations concerning  reappointment.  I  said  to  this  committee  that  I  was  very 
glad  that  it  had  been  appointed,  because  the  administration  certainly  wanted  to 
do  the  right  thing;  that  if  there  was  anything  in  the  adverse  recommendations 
that  was  not  right,  that  was  not  based  on  facts,  I  wanted  to  know  it.  There 
were  just  two  teachers  who  applied  to  this  committee  of  teachers,  the  so-called 
"complaint  committee,"  that  had  been  initiated  entirely  by  teachers  themselves. 
This  committee  made  its  own  investigation  of  these  two  cases,  but  found  no 
ground  on  which  to  support  these  teachers'  claims  of  unfairness.  Subsequently 
one  of  these  teachers  appealed  to  the  board  of  education.  At  her  request,  she 
was  given  a  public  hearing.  She  was  represented  by  an  attorney.  She  brought 
more  than  a  score  of  witnesses  before  the  board,  all  of  whom  were  heard  at  length. 
The  board  voted  to  sustain  the  superintendent  in  his  refusal  to  recommend  the 
teacher 's  reappointment. 

Alderman  Buck:  Have  you  any  definite  plan  of  recording  efficiency  of 
teachers? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Not  by  special  marks.  That  plan  used  to  be  in  operation, 
but  we  have  abandoned  it.  The  marking  seemed  to  be  quite  perfunctory. 

Alderman  Buck:     Have  you  any  record  of  teachers? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  We  have  a  record  of  recommendations  which  are  in  writing, 
but  these  are  not  according  to  any  specific  form;  they  make  use  of  no  system 
of  marks.  Marks  mean  very  little;  without  some  specific  statement  it  is  impos- 
sible to  know  what  value  to  attach  to  them. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  consider  it  the  proper  function  of  a  board  of  edu- 
cation to  dictate  by  its  rules  whether  or  not  teachers  shall  belong  to  certain 
organizations  or  which  organizations  they  may  or  may  not  belong  to? 

ORGANIZATION  OF  TEACHERS'  COUNCILS. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  have  never  had  experience  with  the  board  of  education 
attempting  to  determine  at  all  the  organization  to  which  teachers  should  or  should 


55 

not  belong.  Assuming  that  such  organizations  are  professional  in  their  purpose 
and  spirit,  I  think  the  board  of  education  ought  to  encourage  them.  We  have 
several  teachers'  organizations  in  Minneapolis,  all  of  which  are  being  encouraged. 
We  have  also  a  teachers'  educational  council,  which  is  a  very  definite  help  to  the 
administration.  This  council  consists  of  twenty-six  members,  representing  all 
parts  of  the  city  and  all  grades  of  work.  According  to  its  own  rules,  this  council 
meets  with  the  superintedent;  by  invitation  the  assistant  superintendents  also 
are  usually  present.  At  my  suggestion,  one  meeting  was  held  at  which  only  the 
members  of  the  council  were  present.  According  to  the  constitution,  the  council 
holds  two  regular  meetings  each  year.  In  addition  to  these  two  meetings,  several 
special  meetings  have  been  held  each  year.  Through  the  council  we  get  the  ideas 
of  the  teachers.  The  council  considers  courses  of  study  or  anything  that  is 
pertinent  to  the  administration  of  schools.  According  to  the  council's  rules  the 
superintendent  may  request  the  president  of  the  council  at  any  time  to  call  a 
meeting  for  the  consideration  of  any  subject  that  he  wishes  to  bring  before  it; 
also,  on  request  of  any  three  members  of  the  council,  a  meeting  will  be  called 
to  consider  any  matter  that  these  members  wish  to  introduce. 

But  interchange  of  views  between  teachers  and  the  administration  is  by  no 
means  limited  to  the  teachers'  council.  Any  teacher  in  the  city,  any  one  connected 
with  the  schools,  is  invited  to  ask  any  pertinent  question  of  the  administration 
over  signature,  or  anonymously;  any  question  that  seems  to  be  of  sufficient  gen- 
eral interest  will  be  discussed  publicly  by  the  superintendent  or  his  associates. 
Anyone  may  attend  such  discussion. 

Alderman    Pegram:      What    officers    has    that    body? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  council  has  a  president  and  a  secretary.  The  council 
elects  its  own  officers. 

Alderman  Pegram:  Is  there  any  reference  to  the  duties  of  the  president 
and  secretary? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  president  presides  over  the  meetings  of  the  council, 
and  the  secretary  keeps  the  minutes. 

Alderman  Pegram:  Does  that  person  have  to  be  a  superintendent  or  assistant 
superintendent,  or  somebody  connected  with  the  board  of  education? 

COUNCILS  ARE  SELF  GOVERNING. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  no  one  connected  with  the  board  of  education  is  even  a 
member  of  the  council.  The  members  of  this  council  are  elected  by  the  teachers, 
and  in  this  way:  the  city  is  divided  into  five  districts  corresponding  to  the  five 
high  school  districts;  the  grade  teacher  of  each  one  of  those  districts  elects  three 
representatives,  one  to  represent  the  kindergarten,  and  first  two  grades,  one  to  rep- 
resent the  third,  fourth  and  fifth  grades,  and  one  the  sixth,  seventh  and  eighth 
grades.  That  makes  15  grade  teachers. 

Alderman  Gnadt:     Are  they  all  teachers? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     They  must  be  teachers,   elected  by  the  teachers. 

Alderman  Buck:  I  think,  Mr.  Chairman,  the  members  of  the  committee  are 
laboring  under  a  misapprehension.  This  teachers'  council,  as  I  understand,  is  an 
official  body  for  the  purpose  of  obtaining  the  advice  and  opinions  of  the  teachers 
on  educational  subjects,  similar  to  the  teachers'  council  that  is  provided  for  in 
the  rules  of  the  board  of  education  here,  is  it  not?  It  is  not  an  outside  organization 
of  teachers? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  It  is  an  advisory  body.  I  will  say  that  the  teachers  them- 
selves originated  the  idea  and  had  tried  to  get  the  recognition  and  approval  of 
the  board  of  education  for  the  organization  of  such  a  body  some  years  previous 
to  my  going  to  Minneapolis  two  years  ago.  In  this  they  had  not  been  successful. 
Two  years  ago,  before  I  knew  of  the  teachers'  efforts,  I  was  trying  to  devise  some 
plan  by  which  the  administration  could  get  into  closer  communication  with  the 
teachers.  When  I  heard  of  the  teachers'  desires,  I  called  together  some  of  their 
representatives  and  said,  "That  is  what  we  want;  we  want  an  educational  council 
as  an  advisory  body."  This  council  which  I  have  described  was  the  result.  It 
has  been  in  existence  two  years.  There  are  fifteen  grade  teachers  in  the  council, 
elected  as  I  have  already  indicated;  each  of  the  six  high  schools  elects  one  teacher 
as  a  representative;  there  is  one  high  school  principal  representing  the  high 


56 

school  principals;  two  grade  principals  representing  the  grade  principals;  and 
two  representatives  of  teachers  of  special  subjects,  cooking,  manual  training,  and 
so  on,  making  twenty-six  altogether. 

COUNCIL  MAY  RECOMMEND  POLICIES. 

The  council  has  no  power;  it  is  simply  acting  in  an  advisory  capacity.  The 
rules  of  the  council  provide  for  the  presentation  to  the  board  of  education  of  any 
recommendation  that  the  council  may  wish  to  make.  If  the  council  can  not  de- 
pend upon  the  superintendent  to  make  the  recommendations  that  they  wish,  they 
may  make  their  own  recommendations  directly  to  the  board  at  any  time;  and 
they  may  be  represented  by  three  members  at  any  time  before  the  board.  The 
council  never  has  made  a  recommendation  independently  of  the  board,  nor  has 
it  been  represented  by  its  members  before  the  board,  because  the  council  and 
the  superintendent  have  always  agreed  upon  policies. 

Alderman  Pegram:  Is  there  any  other  organization  outside  of  the  one  you 
speak  of  that  acts  in  an  advisory  capacity? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  That  is  the  only  organization  of  teachers  that  acts  in  this 
capacity.  There  are  teachers'  clubs,  half  a  dozen  organizations,  but  their  func- 
tions are  not  advisory.  In  fact,  this  educational  council  was  planned  by  a  com- 
mittee consisting  of  three  representatives  of  each  teachers'  organization.  This 
committee,  in  conference  with  the  superintendent,  formulated  the  plan  and  drew 
up  the  constitution  for  the  council.  A  copy  of  this  was  .sent  to  every  teacher. 
After  the  teachers  had  had  time  to  consider  the  matter  they  were  all  called 
together.  After  discussion  and  some  changes  in  the  original  plan,  the  teachers 
voted  unanimously  to  institute  the  council. 

Alderman   Pegram:      You   have    about    1,700    teachers    in   Minneapolis'? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Pegram:    What  proportion  are  members  of  the  advisory  council? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  There  are  twenty-six  in  the  advisory  council,  elected  by  the 
whole  1,700. 

Alderman  Buck:  This  council  is  somewhat  similar  to  the  teachers'  council 
we  have  here  under  the  rules  of  the  board.  Its  operation  for  the  present  has 
been  suspended,  but  it  was  organized  under  Mrs.  Young,  I  understand,  and  is  an 
organization  for  the  purpose  of  obtaining  the  views  and  opinions  of  the  teachers 
in  advising  with  the  members  of  the  board  on  school  questions.  It  is  not  an 
organization  of  teachers  independent  of  the  school  system  at  all.  It  is  a  part  of 
the  school  system. 

The  Chairman:     How  many  teachers'  organizations  have  they  in  your  city? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     Six. 

The  Chairman:     What  are  they  called? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  Teachers'  Club,  the  Grade  Teachers'  Association,  the 
Schoolmasters '  Club,  the  Grade  Principals '  Forum,  the  Manual  Art  Club,  the  High 
School  Teachers'  Association.  These  are  the  principal  organizations.  There  are 
several  other  small  groups,  like  the  chemistry  teachers,  and  the  modern  language 
teachers,  that  meet  together. 

The  Chairman:     What  are  the  functions  of  the  grade  teachers'  association? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Its  functions  are  professional;  it  holds  regular  meetings 
at  which  matters  of  professional  interest  are  discussed;  it  provides  professional 
lectures  for  its  members.  It  also  furnished  hospital  aid  and  home  benefits  for  the 
sick.  The  membership  is  limited  to  grade  teachers. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  your  opinion,  should  there  be  a  clear  and  definite  un- 
derstanding concerning  the  status  and  the  functions  of  the  superintendent  of 
schools  and  his  relation  to  the  board? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     Most  decidedly  there  should  be. 

Alderman  Buck:    Should  that  be  by  statute? 

VOLUNTARY  DEFINITION  OF  FUNCTION  BEST. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think  that  would  depend  very  much  upon  local  conditions. 
If  such  understanding  can  be  secured  only  in  that  way,  it  would  be  wise  to 


57 

have  it  determined  by  statute;  but  I  am  inclined  to  think  that  the  more  satis- 
factory way  in  the  long  run  would  be  the  voluntary  definition  of  function  by  the 
board  of  education  that  represents  the  people. 

Alderman  Buck:     In   the  case   of  an   elected  board? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes,  in  the  case  of  an  elected  board.  But  in  whatever  way 
the  board  is  secured,  there  should  be  a  definite  determination  of  the  functions 
and  relations  of  the  board  and  the  superintendent. 

Alderman  Buck:  You  think  there  should  be  a  definite  determination  of  the 
relation  of  the  teachers  to  the  board  and  superintendent? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes,  I  think  relationships,  fundamental  relationships,  should 
be  determined  all  the  way  through.  I  think  teachers  should  feel  ffee  to  go  to 
the  board  at  any  time  that  they  see  fit.  Teachers,  however,  ought  not  to  go  to 
the  board  ignoring  the  established  relationships  between  teachers,  principals, 
assistant  superintendents  and  superintendent. 

Alderman  Buck:  But  in  the  case  of  an  appeal  from  a  decision  of  a  super- 
intendent, what  then? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Then  they  ought  to  go  to  the  board  if  they  are  not  satisfied; 
the  superintendent  ought  to  encourage  them  to  go  to  the  board  under  these 
circumstances. 

Alderman  Miller:  I  was  going  to  ask  then,  the  first  necessary  step  would  be 
if  a  teacher  wants  an  interview  they  would  have  to  bring  it  to  the  attention  of 
the  superintendent  and  they  in  turn  would  have  to  call  a  meeting  and  go  over  it. 

FREE  DISCUSSION  WITH  TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  A  teacher  desiring  an  interview  with  the  board  of  education 
could  ask  it  through  the  superintendent,  through  the  president  or  secretary  of  the 
board,  or  through  formal  communication  addressed  to  the  board  itself.  Of  course, 
a  board  of  education  that  determines  its  own  policy  would  have  power  to  refuse 
a  hearing;  that,  however,  would  be  very  poor  policy.  A  board  of  education  should 
hear  any  teacher  or  body  of  teachers,  or  any  employe  who  wishes  to  be  heard, 
especially  if  an  appeal  is  to  be  made  from  any  ruling  of  the  board's  executive 
officers  or  of  the  board  itself.  In  over  twenty  years'  experience  as  superintendent, 
I  have  never  known  a  board  that  I  served  to  refuse  a  hearing  to  anyone,  teacher 
or  citizen,  who  wished  to  be  heard  on  any  pertinent  matter. 

Efficiency  in  organization  requires  that  all  employes  of  the  board  of  educa- 
tion, from  the  teachers  to  the  superintendent,  be  open-minded  enough  to  discuss 
with  each  other  anything  that  affects  the  interests  of  the  schools.  If  there  is 
a  matter  of  policy  for  which  the  superintendent  is  responsible,  that  the  teachers 
think  unwise,  the  superintendent  ought  to  discuss  that  matter  with  the  teachers. 
He  ought  to  be  willing  to  do  that;  he  ought  to  invite  such  discussion.  He  may 
find  that  he  can  modify  his  policy  advantageously.  After  full  discussion,  how- 
ever, should  there  still  be  radical  difference  of  opinion,  then  the  matter  may  well 
be  referred  to  the  board,  should  be  so  referred  if  the  teachers  wish  it. 

Alderman  Miller:  I  will  tell  you  what  I  had  in  mind:  in  the  position  that 
you  are  now  in,  as  we  have  had  it  explained  to  us,  you  would  act  as  the  buffer 
between  the  teachers'  organization  and  the  board  of  education,  and  they  could 
keep  that  thing  up  indefinitely,  whereas  on  the  other  hand  if  they  had  an  open 
hearing  you  would  get  to  some  definite  conclusion. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think  the  best  way  to  get  along  is  for  those  immediately 
concerned  in  any  matter,  or  their  representatives,  simply  to  get  together  in  a 
friendly  spirit,  sit  down,  and  talk  things  over.  It  is  a  great  deal  easier  to  come 
to  mutual  understanding  an  agreement  in  that  way  than  it  is  through  a  large 
public  hearing  on  matters  at  issue.  It  is  hard  for  anyone,  after  he  has  expressed 
himself  in  public,  to  change  his  attitude  even  though  matters  may  be  presented 
that  he  had  not  before  considered.  It  is  easier,  sitting  together  in  a  small  com- 
pany, to  talk  things  over,  look  at  them  on  all  sides,  and  reach  a  fair  conclusion. 
E  think  that  when  all  parties  are  sincere  and  have  primarily  the  interest  of 
the  schools  at  heart,  they  will  usually  be  able  to  get  along  harmoniously  and 
without  threshing  issues  out  spectacularly  before  the  public. 


58 

SALARY  SCHEDULES  IN  MINNEAPOLIS. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     What  is  the  arrangement  for  salaries  in  Minneapolis? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  salary  schedule  for  grade  teachers  provides  a  regular 
maximum  of  $1,200.  Teachers  must  serve  a  probationary  period  of  two  years, 
during  which  period  their  salaries  are  fixed  on  recommendation  of  principals  and 
superintendents.  Having  passed  the  probationary  period  successfully,  the  teacher's 
salary  is  advanced  at  least  $75.00  per  year  at  each  annual  re-election  until  the 
regular  maximum  of  $1,200  is  reached.  The  schedule  makes  provision  for  a  pos- 
sible salary  of  $1,500  for  individual  merit  or  special  service. 

Aldermaa  Kennedy:     What  do  they  start  out  with? 

Mr.   Spaulding:      The  minimum   salary   is   $700.00. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     At  the  end  of  two  years? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  There  is  no  fixed  rule  regarding  the  initial  salary,  excepting 
that  it  cannot  be  less  than  $700.00.  As  a  rule  it  is  more  than  that.  Teachers 
may  be  appointed  at  any  salary  not  excluding  the  maximum.  There  is  nothing 
in  the  rules  to  prevent  the  paying  of  an  initial  salary  of  $1,200. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  After  the  first  year  there  is  an  increase  of  $75.00  until 
the  maximum  is  reached.  Do  you  think  that  compares  favorably  with  other 
cities  ? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     It  compares  favorably  with  other  cities. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  How  does  it  compare  with  other  or  similar  occupations 
in  Minneapolis,  between  $700  and  $1,200?  Is  the  arrangement  about  the  same? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  I  think  almost  universally,  in  Minneapolis  and  elsewhere, 
teachers'  salaries  do  not  compare  favorably  with  wages  paid  in  other  occupations 
demanding  equal  ability,  skill  and  personal  qualifications.  We  are  continually 
demanding  high  standards  of  service.  I  think  the  large  majority  of  teachers 
are  worth  more  than  they  are  getting.  I  think  it  would  be  good  business 
policy  to  pay  more  than  we  are  paying.  Teachers'  salaries  do  not  begin  to  keep 
pace  with  the  increasing  cost  of  living.  According  to  Bradstreet's  there  has  been 
an  increase  of  over  thirty-five  per  cent  in  the  average  price  of  standard  commodi- 
ties in  the  last  five  years. 

Alderman  Buck:  Is  it  your  opinion  that  the  general  efficiency  of  teachers 
is  high? 

SALARIES   AND    TEACHING   ABILITY. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  That  is  a  broad  question.  A  teacher  that  would  be  counted 
inefficient  in  one  place  might  be  counted  fairly  efficient  in  another.  The  practical 
rating  of  a  teacher's  efficiency  should  have  some  reference  to  her  salary.  Other 
things  being  equal,  a  city  that  does  not  pay  a  maximum  salary  of  over  $800 
should  not  expect  to  get  the  same  degree  of  teaching  efficiency  that  a  city  paying 
$1,200  ought  to  expect.  Of  course  there  is  a  vast  difference  in  the  services  rendered 
by  different  teachers  for  the  salary  received.  Many  teachers  working  for  $700 
are  more  efficient  than  some  who  are  getting  $1,200. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  think  if  the  salaries  were  raised  somewhat 
that  the  communities  would  be  compensated  for  it  in  better  service  and  higher 
standard  of  education? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  In  general  I  think  so.  Yet,  I  think  that  some  more  efficient 
means  than  is  usually  employed  should  be  used  to  bring  about  either  an  improve- 
ment in  the  service  or  elimination  of  the  inefficient.  This  is  a  very  difficult 
matter.  While  the  teachers'  body  itself  ought  not  to  be  the  final  judge  of  the 
efficiency  of  teachers,  I  think  the  teaching  body  should  co-operate  with  those 
charged  with  this  responsibility,  to  see  that  their  body  is  purged  of  those  who  are 
no  credit  to  the  profession.  Just  the  best  way  to  accomplish  this  has  probably 
not  yet  been  worked  out  in  a  satisfactory  manner.  In  Minneapolis  the  whole 
policy  concerning  the  recommending  of  teachers  has  been  passed  upon  by  the 
educational  council.  Following  this  policy  which  has  already  been  outlined,  a 
considerable  number  of  teachers  in  the  last  two  years  have  left  Minneapolis  for  the 
good  of  the  service.  In  only  one  case,  as  I  have  mentioned,  was  appeal  made 
to  the  board.  On  the  whole,  I  think  the  policy  there  has  worked  out  very  sat- 
isfactorily. By  this  I  do  not  mean  that  the  teachers  eliminated  have  always 
been  satisfied;  but  rather  that  the  grounds  for  elimination  have  been  sufficient 
and  the  action  taken  just. 


59 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Have  you  any  pensions  for  teachers? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes,  sir.  All  teachers  are  required  to  belong  to  the  Teachers' 
Ketiremeiit  Fund  Association.  Teachers  must  pay  into  the  funds  of  this  asso- 
ciation $10  a  year  for  the  first  five  years  of  service,  $20  per  year  for  the_second 
five  years,  and  $25  per  year  thereafter  as  long  as  in  service,  but  not  exceeding 
thirty  years  in  all.  These  payments  are  deducted  from  the  teachers'  salaries.  At 
the  end  of  twenty  years'  service  a  teacher  may  retire  on  a  pension  of  $333.33 
per  year  for  life;  after  thirty  years'  service  a  teacher  may  retire  on  the  maxi- 
mum pension  of  $500  per  year  for  life. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  do  you  think  of  the  tenure  of  the  superintendent, 
should  he  be  elected  annually1? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  I  should  say  not  annually.  I  think  the  superintendent 
should  have  a  reasonable  tenure.  He  should  not  be  protected  in  his  position 
more  than  teachers  should  be.  Protection,  however,  should  not  be  the  dominant 
motive  in  fixing  tenure  or  a  definite  term  of  service,  either  for  teachers  or  for 
superintendents.  The  dominant  purpose  should  be  to  secure  the  best  service  pos- 
sible for  the  schools.  Such  service  cannot  be  secured  for  the  schools  if  there 
is  continual  changing  of  teachers  or  superintendents.  Neither  superintendents 
nor  teachers  should  be  changed  except  for  good  and  adequate  reasons.  The 
probationary  period  of  a  superintendent,  at  least  in  a  large  city,  should  be  longer 
than  that  of  a  teacher  for  this  reason.  The  superintendent's  plans  and  influence 
are  far  reaching,  considerable  time  is  required  to  produce  results  that  can  be 
observed  and  judged;  while  the  teacher's  work  is  mainly  within  the  walls  of  a 
single  class  room,  where  her  influence  is  felt,  where  the  results  of  her  work 
can  be  seen  and  judged  almost  immediately. 

For  the  superintendent  a  probationary  period  of  three  years  is  as  necessary 
as  one  year  for  the  teacher.  Three  years  ought  usually  to  be  sufficient.  After 
three  years,  the  school  board  and  the  public  ought  to  be  able  to  judge  wisely  for  the 
school  system  whether  the  superintendent  is  competent  to  render  the  service  that 
the  city  needs.  If  within  that  time  he  has  not  demonstrated  his  competency,  I 
think  he  should  be  dropped,  even  if  he  has  been  elected  for  an  indefinite  tenure. 
No  superintendent  should  desire  to  continue  in  a  position  if  he  fails  to  win, 
or  after  he  has  lost  the  confidence  of  his  board  of  education. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  What  should  be  the  tenure  of  teachers,  would  you  say 
one  year? 

INDEFINITE  TENURE  FOR  TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  At  least  one  year;  often  longer  for  it  is  not  always  possible 
to  decide  in  one  year  with  justice  either  to  the  school  or  to  the  teacher;  whether 
it  is  wise  for  the  teacher  to  continue.  After  the  probationary  period  has  passed 
successfully,  I  think  that  teachers  should  be  elected  on  some  form  of  permanent 
tenure;  but  this  tenure  should  not  be  so  permanent  that  only  proofs  of  gravest 
immorality  are  sufficient  to  separate  the  teacher  from  the  position.  Permanency 
of  tenure  should  depend  upon  permanently  good  service. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  your  opinion  is  it  sound  policy  to  dismiss  teachers  with- 
out notice  as  to  the  charges? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  should  say  not.  No  one  teacher  or  other  employe  should 
be  dismissed  without  being  told  why  he  is  dismissed.  Also,  reasons  should  always 
be  given  for  a  failure  to  reappoint  a  teacher  or  other  employes. 

Alderman  Buck:     And  without  a  hearing. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  believe  in  giving  every  one  a  hearing.  If  they  want  to 
express  themselves  on  any  action  taken  they  should  have  full  opportunity  to 
say  what  they  have  to  say. 

Miss  Haley:  Do  I  understand  you  to  say  that  they  should  have  a  hearing 
before  dismissal? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  I  think  they  should  have  a  hearing  before  they  are  dismissed; 
because  if  any  mistake  is  being  made,  it  can  best  be  corrected  before  they  are  dis- 
missed. If  no  hearing  has  been  given  before  dismissal  they  should  have  a  hearing 
after  dismissal,  if  they  desire  it.  But  it  is  far  better  to  have  a  hearing  before 
final  action  is  taken.  Our  procedure  in  Minneapolis  provides  for  a  hearing  at 
each  step,  first  with  the  principal,  next  with  the  assistant  superintendent,  then 


60 

with  the  superintendent,  and  finally,  if  the  teacher  wishes  it,  with  the  board  of 
education. 

Miss  Haley:  Is  it  in  the  power  of  the  superintendent  to  suspend  the  opera- 
tion of  the  regulation  in  regard  to  teachers'  hearings? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  rules  of  the  board  make  no  specific  provision  for  hear- 
ings. They  simply  require  the  superintendent  to  make  recommendations  of 
teachers.  The  procedure  that  T  have  described  has  been  instituted  by  the  superin- 
tendent with  the  approval  of  the  educational  council. 

Miss  Haley:  Then  if  another  superintendent  came  along  he  could  suspend 
that  plan? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  He  could;  he  could  fail  to  carry  out  that  particular  plan, 
unless  the  board  ordered  otherwise. 

Miss  Haley:  You  say  those  twenty-six  teachers  composing  the  educational 
council  are  elected? 

Mr.    Spaulding:      Yes. 

Miss  Haley:  Do  the  grade  teachers  vote  for  the  representation  of  the  high 
school  teachers? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     No,  they  vote  for  their  own  representatives. 

Miss  Haley:     They  have  an  annual  election? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes.  The  superintendent  calls  a  general  meeting  of  all 
teachers  in  September  of  each  year.  All  teachers  attend  this  meeting.  After 
an  address  by  the  superintendent,  they  retire  in  groups  to  designated  rooms,  where 
each  group  elects  its  representative  or  representatives  to  the  educational  council. 

Miss  Haley:  .  Then  these  twenty-six  people  call  a  meeting  of  their  own,  or  are 
they  only  subject  to  call  by  the  superintendent? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  constitution  of  the  council  provides  for  the  calling  of 
two  meetings  in  the  year;  the  dates  of  these  meetings  are  fixed  by  the  constitu- 
tion. The  superintendent  may  ask  the  president  to  call  a  council  meeting  at  any 
time  and  the  president  is  required  to  call  a  meeting  on  request  of  any  three 
members. 

Miss  Haley:    Is  this  a  rule  of  the  board? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  The  board  has  nothing  to  do  with  that  educational  council. 
It  is  carried  on  entirely  by  the  teachers  and  the  superintendent. 

Miss  Haley:    Suppose  the  superintendent  should  refuse  to  call  a  meeting? 

Mr.  Spaulding:     He  might  be  unwise  enough  to  do  that. 

Miss  Haley:  Now  I  want  to  ask  another  question  about  this  council;  does 
this  council  when  they  make  recommendations  have  their  recommendations  printed 
in  any  official  document? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  A  mimeograph  copy  of  the  proceedings  of  every  meeting  is 
sent  to  every  school  in  the  city. 

Miss  Haley:  They  are  not  made  a  matter  of  record  in  any  official  copy 
of  the  records  of  the  board. 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Not  of  the  board.  The  board  members,  however,  receive 
copies  of  the  proceedings  of  every  council  meeting. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  favor  an  age  limit  for  teachers,  I  mean  a  fixed 
limit? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Yes  and  no.  Individuals  differ  so  much,  one  being  in  her 
prime  at  sixty  while  another  is  incapacitated  by  old  age  at  fifty,  that  any  fixed 
age  limit  is  an  extremely  unsatisfactory  method  of  determining  when  services 
should  terminate.  On  the  other  hand,  it  is  so  difficult  to  remove  teachers  who 
have  been  long  in  the  service,  who  often  feel  that  they  are  growing  stronger 
as  they  grow  weaker,  perhaps  this  impersonal,  though  unsatisfactory  age-measure 
of  limiting  service  may  have  sufficient  merit  to  justify  it. 

Miss  Haley:  Do  you  hold  those  meetings  where  the  superintendent  addresses 
the  teachers  during  school  time? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  Partially;  they  are  called  at  3  o'clock  in  the  afternoon.  The 
schools  are  allowed  to  close  in  time  for  teachers  to  get  to  the  meeting  place  at  3. 

Miss  Haley:  How  about  the  twenty-six  teachers  when  they  meet,  do  they 
meet  in  school  time? 

Mr.  Spaulding:  No,  they  meet  in  the  evening.  They  have  a  simple  supper  at  6 
o'clock  and  take  up  their  business  after  that.  Their  meetings  usually  last  until 
9,  sometimes  until  10. 


61 

PROFESSOR  CHARLES  H.  JTJDD, 

School  of  Education,  University  of  Chicago. 

Mr.  Judd  appeared  October  30,  1916. 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Chairman,  Professor  Charles  H.  Judd  of  the  University 
of  Chicago  is  one  of  the  leading  educators  of  the  country  and  has  done  a  great 
deal  of  work  in  various  cities  in  connection  with  the  survey  of  school  systems, 
and  has  made  a  study  of  the  question  of  larger  educational  efficiency. 

Mr.  Judd:  Mr.  Chairman,  I  will  briefly  give  you  the  results  of  one  or  two 
of  these  investigations.  I  have  not  had  an  opportunity  since  the  committee  met  on 
Saturday  to  make  up  enlarged  diagrams.  I  have  some  small  ones  which  I  hope 
will  be  visible  to  the  members  of  the  committee  at  the  other  end  of  the  room. 
I  call  your  attention  first  to  material  collected  in  the  course  of  a  school  survey 
conducted  in  the  city  of  Cleveland.  The  results  secured  in  Cleveland  show  how 
far  that  school  system  is  doing  its  work  successfully.  The  methods  employed  in 
that  city  can  be  used  in  Chicago.  There  is  no  reason  why  this  committee  should 
not  find  out  with  perfect  clearness  by  the  use  of  similar  methods  whether  Chicago 
is  getting  good  work  in  the  schools  or  whether  the  work  is  deficient. 

I  should  like  to  give  you  two  or  three  illustrations  of  how  the  success  of  a 
school  system  can  be  determined.  In  the  first  place,  when  a  child  does  not 
complete  the  work  of  a  given  division  of  a  school,  let  us  say,  a  grade,  at  the 
time  when  it  is  expected  in  the  normal  course  of  events  that  a  child  should  be 
promoted, — I  say  whenever  a  child  cannot  be  promoted,  something  has  gone  wrong. 
Now  "the  something  that  has  gone  wrong"  is  in  different  cases  very  different. 
Sometimes  the  child  is  mentally  deficient.  If  so,  since  the  child  must  be  taken 
care  of,  it  is  the  business  of  the  teacher  to  provide  something  other  than  the  usual 
course  of  study  for  that  child.  To  make  that  child  go  through  the  same  thing 
again  and  again  where  it  has  failed  is  often  a  waste  of  public  money.  If  the 
child  is  only  slightly  deficient  it  should  be  given  another  opportunity.  If  the 
child  is  not  deficient  at  all  the  trouble  may  be  in  the  school.  The  course  of  study 
may  be  poorly  organized  or  the  teaching  may  be  defective.  If  the  trouble  is  in 
the  school  that  should  be  found  out. 

MEASURING  WORK  OF  CLEVELAND  SCHOOLS. 

My  point  is  this,  the  school  system  needs  to  study  itself  as  well  as  the  pupils. 
This  means  a  more  elaborate  treatment  of  the  school's  own  records.  Thus  if  one 
takes  the  record  of  non-promotions  in  the  schools  of  Cleveland  it  is  found  that 
about  seventeen  per  cent  of  the  children  in  the  first  grade  do  not  get  promoted. 
That  means  that  some  children  enter  school  when  they  are  too  young;  they  are 
not  mature  enough  for  the  work,  and  they  fail  in  promotion.  The  first  grade  is  a 
period  of  uncertain  health,  it  is  the  period  when  defectives  are  detected  and  so  on. 
These  reasons  explain  the  seventeen  per  cent  of  non-promotions.  The  number  is 
much  less  in  the  second  grade,  that  is,  it  is  between  twelve  and  thirteen  per  cent. 

(Diagrams  were  exhibited  showing  the  facts  for  the  grades  mentioned  and  for 
subsequent  grades. 

The  striking  fact  in  regard  to  Cleveland  is  that  the  number  of  non-promo- 
tions in  the  third,  fourth  and  fifth  grades  steadily  increases.  That  means  that 
under  the  hands  of  the  teachers  children  who  have  gone  through  the  third  grade 
are  more  likely  to  fail  in  the  fourth  grade,  that  failure  in  the  fifth  grade  is  more 
common  than  failure  in  the  fourth. 

In  the  city  of  St.  Louis  you  have  a  high  grade  of  failure  in  the  first  grade  but 
a  distinct  reduction  in  the  second  grade,  and  in  subsequent  grades.  You  have 
seven  to  eight  per  cent  in  the  middle  grades  in  St.  Louis,  whereas  in  the  middle 
grades  in  the  city  of  Cleveland  you  have  a  maximum  failure  of  more  than  eighteen 
per  cent.  You  see  accordingly  two  school  systems  where  the  failure  varies  from 
over  eighteen  per  cent  to  seven  per  cent.  The  school  records  themselves  thus  show 
you  what  is  going  on  in  those  schools. 

Now  let  us  find  out  what  is  the  reason  for  excessive  failures  in  the  city  of 


62 

Cleveland.  The  course  of  study  is  one  of  the  most  important  matters  for  our  con- 
sideration. The  course  of  study  consists  of  reading,  geography,  spelling,  and  so 
on.  We  can  examine  one  subject  after  another.  The  diagram  showing  failures  in 
reading  exhibits 'a  steady  falling  off  in  the  number  of  failures  in  this  subject. 
This  proves  that  reading  is  not  the  cause  of  non-promotion  in  the  middle  grades. 
The  failures  in  reading  continually  decrease  and  the  non-promotions  increase  as 
you  saw  a  moment  ago. 

COMPARATIVE  STUDY  OF  NON-PROMOTIONS. 

The  failures  in  arithmetic  in  the  middle  grades  of  the  city  of  Cleveland  parallel 
exactly  the  non-promotions  in  those  grades.  Failures  in  arithmetic  are  very  heavy, 
indeed  increasingly  heavy  in  the  intermediate  grades.  The  non-promotion  of  chil- 
dren in  the  schools  of  the  city  of  Cleveland  can  be  traced  to  the  fact  that  arith- 
metic is  not  properly  cared  for  in  the  city.  Exactly  the  same  sort  of  record  in 
reading  and  arithmetic  can  be  shown  for  the  city  of  Grand  Rapids,  but  the  non- 
promotion  curve  is  better  for  the  reason  that  in  that  city  they  have  a  system  of 
trial  promotions,  which  counteracts  the  bad  effects  of  their  arithmetic  record.  A 
diagram  can  be  shown  which  records  a  falling  off  in  failures  in  reading,  beginning 
at  twelve  per  cent  in  the  first  grade  and  dropping  off  rapidly  to  six.  On  the 
other  hand,  in  the  city  of  Grand  Kapids  the  arithmetic  failures  begin  down  at  a 
low  point  in  the  early  grades  but  run  up  to  twelve,  eighteen  and  twenty  per  cent. 
Arithmetic  and  reading  are  taught  in  entirely  different  ways  in  that  city,  and  the 
consequences  of  the  heavy  demand  in  arithmetic  would  be  disastrous  if  it  were 
not  for  the  system  of  trial  promotions. 

In  St.  Louis  they  have  mastered  the  problem  of  non-promotions  much  better 
by  a  more  workable"  subdivision  of  their  course  of  study.  These  records  show 
that  one  can  find  out  how  a  school  system  is  doing  its  work.  We  ought  to  have 
similar  studies  of  Chicago  records.  Such  a  study  would  clear  up  many  issues 
in  our  school  system;  instead  of  talking  about  efficiency  in  a  vague  way  we  should 
be  speaking  in  a  definite  way  and  in  terms  of  the  record  made  by  the  schools 
themselves. 

Turning  from  the  system  as  a  whole  to  the  records  of  particular  buildings 
we  find  equally  clear  indications  in  the  records  themselves  of  the  kind  of  organiza- 
tion that  exists  in  the  building.  Thus  in  one  school  a  fifth  grade  shows  in  one 
year  a  non-promotion  record  of  forty  per  cent.  The  next  year  the  corresponding 
grade  has  only  eight  per  cent  non-promotions.  We  all  know  that  human  nature 
does  not  work  that  way.  There  is  no  indication  that  these  fluctuations  are 
justifiable.  Something  has  gone  wrong  in  the  school  where  such  violent  fluctua- 
tions appear.  This  becomes  the  more  evident  when  you  examine  the  record 
of  other  schools  which  proceed  with  perfect  regularity.  The  difficulty  with 
fluctuating  schools  is  most  commonly  that  they  are  not  properly  managed. 
There  are,  to  be  sure,  schools  where  the  population  fluctuates,  but  not  back  and 
forth  as  shown  in  the  particular  record  here  submitted  for  your  observation. 

COMPARISON  OF  PROGRESS  IN  SINGLE  STUDIES. 

I  should  like  to  show  some  diagrams  regarding  particular  studies.  Let  us 
take  the  case  of  handwriting.  For  this  study  it  is  not  necessary  to  go  outside 
of  a  single  building.  The  pupils  are  expected  to  progress  from  grade  to  grade  in 
both  the  speed  and  quality  of  their  work. 

Suppose,  for  example,  we  have  a  fifth  grade  and  we  are  teaching  them  pen- 
manship; when  the  pupils  of  this  grade  go  into  the  sixth  grade  they  should  show 
some  kind  of  improvement  and  in  the  seventh  grade  they  should  show  further 
improvement.'  All  you  Jiave  to  do  is  to  take  specimens  of  the  handwriting  from 
each  grade  and  determine  how  each  set  of  specimens  compares  with  those  from  the 
grade  below.  Various  schools  show  different  records  in  this  matter.  Here  is  one 
that  shows  steady  progress  in  both  speed  and  quality.  Here  is  one  which  shows 
progress  in  speed  but  very  little  in  quality.  Here  is  one  that  gives  attention 
almost  exclusively  to  quality.  Here  are  several  that  do  not  show  any  consecutive 
improvement.  Like  comparisons  can  be  made  in  other  subjects.  In  short,  you 


63 

can  go  into  schools  and  find  out  what  they  are  doing.     You  have  in  the  work 
of  the  pupils  a  perfectly  clear  indication  of  what  the  school  is  doing. 

Now,  Mr.  Chairman,  I  brought  a  lot  of  material  of  this  type  but  I  shall  not 
try  to  show  it  further.  What  I  have  given  you  will  serve  to  let  you  know  the 
grounds  of  my  statement  that  it  is  possible  to  find  out  exactly  how  schools  are 
doing  their  work. 

I  should  like  to  add  another  type  of  comment.  Our  school  organizations  in 
all  great  cities  in  the  United  States  have  grown  very  rapidly.  Our  compulsory  edu- 
cation laws  are  fully  in  force  in  most  of  the  states.  The  first  compulsory  education 
law  in  the  United  States  was  passed  in  1852.  These  laws  did  not  begin  to  be 
enforced  until  1880,  but  with  their  effective  enforcement  we  have  sent  all  of  the 
children  into  schools,  and  the  school  population  has  grown  with  enormous  rapidity^ 
So  far  as  high  schools  are  concerned,  there  has  been  a  like  enormous  growth.  There 
were  300,000  high  school  students  in  1890.  There  are  today  1,300,000.  Since  1890- 
the  high  school  enrollment  has  doubled  twice  and  heavy  burdens  have  been 
thrown  on  our  school  boards,  by  virtue  of  the  increase  in  the  amount  of  schooling 
the  public  demands.  Furthermore,  we  are  demanding  better  school  buildings;  we 
demand  more  and  better  training  for  the  teachers.  Because  of  the  increase  in 
our  school  population  and  the  wider  demand  for  variety  of  instruction  the  course 
of  study  has  been  growing  more  complex. 

All  these  expansions  have  absolutely  swamped  the  administration  machinery 
of  our  schools.  We  have  not  developed  any  adequate  administration  machinery 
for  our  schools  to  cope  with  this  new  situation.  The  school  administration  has 
always  been  a  matter  apart  from  our  other  public  functions.  After  the  City  of 
Chicago  was  incorporated,  and  after  all  of  its  other  functions  of  city  government 
had  been  centralized,  the  schools  were  taken  care  of  by  districts.  The  people  were 
organized,  so  far  as  school  functions  are  concerned,  as  small  communities.  They 
voted  directly  on  every  issue  regarding  schools.  They  even  voted  the  salaries  of 
teachers.  It  was  not  until  after  this  city  began  to  realize  the  fact  that  it  could 
not  properly  transfer  pupils  from  one  district  to  another  because  the  various 
districts  were  so  different,  that  a  board  of  education  was  provided. 

OFFICERS'  STATUS  TOO  INDEFINITE. 

Even  then  the  board  was  given  very  large  and  very  loosely  defined  powers. 
The  board  in  turn  appointed  its  executive  officers  in  the  same  general,  loose, 
indefinite  way,  with  the  result  that  today  you  have  not  only  in  Chicago,  but  you 
have  in  most  of  the  great  cities  of  the  country,  a  situation  of  this  sort:  a  board 
of  education  with  relatively  unlimited  functions,  without  any  definition  of  it» 
relation  to  its  own  officers;  especially  without  any  definition  of  its  relation  to  its 
own  teachers,  and  to  the  superintendent.  We  all  recognize  that  we  have  arrived 
at  the  point  where  it  is  necessary  to  define  rights  and  obligations. 

No  one  can  work  to  advantage  while  he  is  in  the  dark  about  his  rights;, 
he  wants  clearness  of  obligation.  For  example,  whose  business  is  it  to  find  out 
whether  teachers  are  efficient  in  the  school  system  in  Chicago?  This  question  ia 
not  answered  in  any  statutes  which  we  have.  The  school  officers  have  gone  on 
trying  to  cope  with  their  problems  as  best  they  can  while  all  the  time  the  problems- 
are  rapidly  increasing  in  complexity.  We  have  no  adequate  plan  of  administration 
or  support  clearly  worked  out.  I  think  the  educational  world  would  be  enorm- 
ously benefited  if  this  city  can  unite  in  organizing  a  new  and  adequate  scheme  of 
school  administration. 

The  control  of  schools  ought  to  be  put  on  a  basis  of  clearness  regarding  results; 
clearness  of  definition  of  the  functions  of  the  various  officers.  As  long  as  there 
is  no  record  of  what  is  being  accomplished  and  as  long  as  there  is  no  clearness 
regarding  duties  and  responsibilities  of  the  officers  you  are  going  to  have  all 
sorts  of  trouble  and  confusion.  If  you  can  start  the  organization  in  the  direction 
of  clearness  and  definition  of  functions  and  responsibilities  you  can  at  the  same 
time  secure  adequate  evidence  whether  your  schools  are  working  efficiently  or 
not. 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Judd,  this  method  that  you  have  outlined  of  measuring 
the  work  of  schools  can  be  checked,  can  it,  and  be  recorded  from  year  to  year, 


64 

without  any  special  outside  investigations,  I  mean  that  might  disrupt  the  system? 
It  can  be  done  in  the  regular  course  of  school  administration? 

Mr.  Judd:  The  facts  are  that  a  number  of  our  leading  school  systems  have 
employed  outside  expert  agencies  for  doing  this  work.  A  survey  can  almost  be 
defined  as  an  inquiry  made  by  a  group  of  people  outside  of  the  system. 

CHICAGO  SURVEY  UNWISE  NOW. 

My  belief  is  it  is  possible  to  make  adequate  studies  of  school  work  from 
inside  the  school  system.  I  think  it  requires  an  addition  to  the  administrative 
machinery  now  in  existence  in  most  cities  to  do  this.  I  think  it  requires  people 
especially  trained.  -There  are  advantages  in  an  inside  study  as  contrasted  with 
a  survey.  The  disastrous  consequences  which  flow  from  a  general  survey  very  fre- 
quently interfere  with  the  object  of  the  survey;  that  is,  if  you  throw  at  the 
school  system  a  mass  of  recommendations  for  improvement,  and  all  the  criticisms 
that  attach  to  the  recommendations,  it  very  frequently  disrupts  the  organization 
of  the  school  system.  My  belief  is  that  the  school  system  could  take  up  its 
problems  better  one  by  one  through  its  own  internal  machinery.  I  do  not  believe, 
therefore,  that  a  survey  conducted  by  outside  parties  would  serve  Chicago  best 
at  the  present  time.  However,  surveys  usually  are  made  by  outsiders.- 

Alderman  Buck:  You  have  told  us  that  the  work  of  the  school  and  the 
work  of  the  organization  can  be  checked  upon  and  its  efficiency  recorded  and 
compared;  would  you  say  it  is  possible  definitely  to  establish  this  system  of  re- 
cording the  efficiency  of  teachers,  individual  teachers? 

Mr.  Judd:  I  think  it  is  possible  to  show  with  definiteness  the  efficiency  of 
individual  teachers.  I  should  like  to  add  this  remark:  I  think  that  a  general 
survey  ordinarily  brings  out  first  the  efficiency  of  the  higher  officials.  I  think  the 
detail  of  what  the  individual  teachers  are  doing  is  a  matter  which  can  be  worked 
out  by  similar  methods.  The  responsibility  for  a  situation  such  as  I  have  given 
you,  for  example,  in  Cleveland,  the  responsibility  for  the  situation  shown  by  that 
survey  lies,  I  believe,  at  the  door  of  the  chief  executive  officer  of  the  system.  I  do 
not  think  you  can,  in.  a  general  situation,  begin  at  the  bottom  and  control  responsi- 
bility in  detail,  because  the  operation  of  individual  teachers  is  controlled  in 
great  measure  by  the  operations  of  the  general  system.  I  think  one  must  begin 
with  the  operation  of  the  system  as  a  whole  first,  but  the  methods  of  exact 
measurement  are  adequate  when  properly  employed  to  get  all  of  the  details. 

Alderman  Buck:  Should  there  be  recorded  in  the  system  the  efficiency  marks 
of  the  teachers? 

Mr.  Judd:  Yes,  sir.  I  think  such  a  rating  ought  to  be  backed  up  by 
impersonal  records  showing  the  character  of  the  work  of  a  teacher  and  also 
showing  the  situation  in  which  she  is  doing  her  work. 

Alderman  Buck:    The  teachers  should  have  access  to  them? 

Mr.  Judd:    Undoubtedly. 

Alderman  Buck:     And  opportunity  to  discuss  when  criticised? 

Mr.  Judd:    Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  would  you  say  should  be  the  tenure  in  office  of  the 
superintendent  of  schools? 

INDEFINITE  TENURE  FOR  TEACHERS. 

Mr.  Judd:  I  think  a  superintendent  has  to  have  a  longer  period  of  time 
than  does  the  individual  teacher  to  get  his  work  under  way.  My  own  belief  is 
that  a  superintendent  has  a  right  to  know  that  he  is  going  to  have  three  to  five 
years  for  his  initial  organization.  After  that  I  think  I  should  be  in  favor  of  an 
indefinite  term  of  appointment. 

Aledman  Buck:  What  would  you  say  as  to  the  tenure  of  teachers  and  edu- 
cators in  the  schools  other  than  superintendents? 

Mr.  Judd:  In  my  judgment  an  indefinite  term  is  the  best.  You  solve  the 
problem  of  terminating  such  a  term  if  you  have  a  constant  check  on  what  is  being 
done.  When  I  say  the  superintendent  should  have  an  indefinite  appointment  I 
mean  exactly  that.  I  do  not  think  he  should  have  a  strangle  hold  upon  his  office. 


65 

I  think  he  should  be  answerable  for  the  operations  of  the  system,  and  as  long  as 
it  can  be  definitely  shown  by  the  records  and  examinations  of  the  school  system 
that  the  work  is  going  on  well  I  think  his  tenure  should  be  continued.  In 
exactly  the  same  way  I  think  the  teacher  should  have  a  preliminary  period, 
a  preliminary  tenure,  and  after  a  teacher  has  made  good  her  appointment 
should  be  indefinite  in  the  same  manner  in  which  the  superintendent's  appoint- 
ment is  indefinite.  I  think  it  is  necessary  in  practical  operation  to  review 
periodically  these  matters  of  efficiency.  In  this  connection  it  should  be  made 
clear  that  unless  efficiency  is  made  the  center  of  the  system  almost  any  system  is 
bad.  It  has  become  increasingly  difficult  in  all  great  American  cities  to  remove 
teachers.  In  New  York  city  it  is  practically  impossible  at  the  present  time  as 
history  shows.  Until  very  recently  it  was  extraordinarily  difficult  in  this  city  to 
remove  anybody  who  had  been  charged  with  inefficiency.  It  grows  more  and 
more  difficult  in  our  municipalities  to  carry  out  any  scheme.  Therefore  my  argu- 
ment would  be  in  favor  of  an  indefinite  appointment  for  the  purpose  of  purging 
the  teaching  force  from  time  to  time  of  those  who  are  not  efficient  rather  than 
merely  for  the  purpose  of  retaining  in  their  positions  those  who  are  efficient. 
Exactly  the  same  formula  should  apply  to  all  officers. 

Alderman  Buck:  Is  it  likely,  in  your  judgment,  that  any  considerable  per- 
centage of  teachers  who 'slump  in  their  efficiency  might  improve  their  work  if 
given  an  opportunity? 

Mr.  Judd:  Yes,  I  think  it  is  one  of  the  chief  functions  of  the  supervising 
force  in  the  school  system  to  make  good  teachers  out  of  bad  ones.  That  is  a 
responsibility  that  belongs  at  headquarters  as  much  as  with  the  teachers  them- 
selves. There  is  some  material  in  the  teaching  staff  which  cannot  be  built  up  to 
a  high  degree  of  efficiency  under  any  circumstances.  I  think  the  energy  of  the 
supervising  staff  should  be  devoted  to  a  large  extent  to  the  training  of  teachers 
in  service.  Training  in  service  means  steady  improvement  of  these  officers. 

Alderman  Buck:  Do  you  think  that  teachers  should  feel  secure  in  their  posi- 
tions so  long  as  they  do  their  work  satisfactorily  and  are  of  good  moral  character? 

Mr.  Judd:     Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:  And  that  they  should  not  be  dismissed  without  notice  and 
opportunity  to  improve  and  to  have  a  hearing  and  all  that? 

Mr.  Judd:     I  do. 

Alderman  Buck:  From  your  study  of  schools  would  you  say  it  is  the  proper 
function  of  a  board  of  education  to  dictate  by  rule  of  ordinance  what  organization 
a  teacher  should  belong  to? 

Mr.  Judd:  I  do  n<jt  think  that  is  a  function  of  the  board.  I  think  the 
function  of  ^the  board  is  to  provide  a  high  grade  of  instruction.  It  should  base 
all  its  activities  on  the  fundamental  principle  that  a  teacher  must  be  efficient  in 
class  room  work.  If  membership  in  any  organization,  or  any  other  cause,  tends 
to  diminish  the  efficiency  of  the  teacher  in  my  judgment  it  is  fully  provided  in 
present  rules  of  the  board  that  the  teacher  may  be  removed.  If  inefficiency  does 
not  operate  to  remove  the  teacher  I  do  not  see  that  anything  else  should. 

ELECTED  BOARD  FOE  CHICAGO. 

The  Chairman:  Do  you  recommend  the  election  of  boards  of  education  or 
appointment? 

Mr.  Judd:  I  have  had  until  very  recently  no  very  definite  and  final  opinion 
in  the  matter.  The  experience  of  the  country  shows  that  either  method  does  in 
some  cases  produce  good  boards  and  in  other  cases  inefficient  boards.  My  own 
judgment  in  the  matter  is  that  there  ought  to  be  a  sufficient  public  interest  in 
either  the  appointment  or  the  election  of  the  board  to  insure  full  discussion  by 
the  community  at  large  of  educational  problems.  It  is  my  present  judgment  that 
we  are  more  likely  to  secure  full  public  discussion  of  school  matters  in  Chicago 
if  we  have  an  elective  board,  but  I  should  not  be  prepared  to  defend  on  theoretical 
ground  an  elective  board.  I  believe  that  our  local  situation  would  be  better 
served  by  an  elected  board. 

Alderman  Blaha:  Don't  you  think  if  there  was  an  elected  board  that  the 
matter  of  politics  would  enter  into  it  and  be  detrimental? 


66 

Mr.  Judd:  There  is  danger  in  that,  of  course,  if  you  do  not  get  back  to  the 
great  fundamental  requirments  that  I  suggested.  If  you  could  have  a  general 
campaign  that  would  have  for  its  main  item  of  discussion  the  efficiency  of  the 
school  work  and  the  methods  of  promoting  efficiency  in  schools,  then  I  think  we  can 
get  to  a  point  of  demonstrating  the  undesirability  of  politics  in  the  local  school 
situation,  and  I  think  politics  would  disappear.  I  think  we  should  have  a  special 
campaign  regarding  school  matters,  and  if  that  were  vigorously  carried  out  I 
suppose  the  dangers  to  which  you  refer  would  be  reduced.  I  do  not  suppose  they 
can  be  wholly  eliminated  as  long  as  human  nature  is  what  it  is. 

Alderman  Buck:  Does  the  general  history  as  you  have  studied  it  of  school 
systems  justify  the  statement  that  there  is  no  politics  in  school  systems  where 
the  boards  are  appointed? 

Mr.  Judd:  No,  as  I  say,  you  can  find  both  kinds  of  boards.  There  are  very 
strong  boards  that  are  appointed  boards  and  first  class  boards  that  are  elected 
boards.  If  members  of  the  board  could  be  brought  to  see  that  it  is  their  duty 
to  organize  the  schools  rather  than  try  to  conduct  them,  they  would  be  good 
members  wherever  they  came  from.  If  they  do  not  see  this  they  will  be  poor 
members.  I  think  the  fundamental  requirement  is  to  have  before  the  people  the 
problem  of  organizing  an  efficient  school,  whether  you  have  an  appointed  board 
or  an  elected  board.  I  think  a  well  appointed  board  very  frequently  has  its  ad- 
vantages over  an  elected  board.  Of  course  there  is  less  machinery  involved  in 
making  selections  in  that  case.  Frequently  we  have  very  good  illustrations  of 
strong  appointed  boards,  so  I  do  not  think  you  can  make  any  positive  statement 
for  or  against  the  appointive  board. 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Chairman,  I  desire  to  state  at  this  time  that  the  services 
of  Professor  Judd  do  not  end  with  this  meeting.  He  has  sat  in  with  the  sub- 
committee chairman  continuously  since  this  investigation  began.  He  has  given 
generously  of  his  time  and  wonderful  information,  and  this  investigation  could 
not  have  reached  the  success  it  has  if  it  was  not  for  the  work  of  Professor  Judd 
in  conjunction  with  the  sub-committee. 

PROFESSOR  F.  W.  ROMAN, 

Economics  and  History,  Syracuse  University. 

Mr.  Eoman  appeared  October  30,  1916. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Professor  Eoman  has  made  a  special  study  of  the  voca- 
tional educational  system  in  Germany  and  in  other  countries,  and  he  has  also, 
of  course,  kept  in  close  touch  with  the  development  of  that  sort  of  educational 
work  in  this  country,  and  just  at  this  time  we  are  trying  to  discover,  if  possible, 
in  what  ways  the  school  situation  here  can  be  improved  and,  recognizing  that  one 
of  the  big  problems  with  which  we  are  confronted  is  that  of  the  development  of 
vocational  education,  I  thought  it  would  be  a  good  time  to  have  a  word  and  as 
much  discussion  as  Professor  Eoman  sees  fit  to  give  us  on  vocational  education, 
and  especially  how  it  will  fit  in  with  a  democratic  school  system  for  all  people. 

Mr.  Eoman:  Mr.  Chairman,  and  gentlemen  of  the  committee,  my  study  of 
vocational  education  dates  specifically  from  the  time  I  commenced  to  study  the 
German  school  system.  Some  years  ago  I  was  a  teacher  in  the  state  normal  school 
at  Bowling  Green,  Kentucky,  and  while  in  that  position  the  governor  of  Kentucky 
appointed  me  as  a  member  of  a  commission  to  go  to  Germany  to  study  the  German 
school  system,  and  I  got  interested  in  the  work  and  have  continued  my  interest 
in  it  ever  since. 

Now  the  whole  history  of  education  has  shown  us  that  the  purpose  of  any 
school  system  is  to  enable  the  children  to  become  fitted  to  carry  on  the  struggle  for 
existence,  and  to  enable  them  to  make  their  livelihood  with  the  minimum  effort 
and  get  the  maximum  of  results.  Now  in  view  of  the  fact  that  we  are  able  to 
show  that  the  cost  of  taxes  in  this  country  is  increasing,  that  the  number  of 
people  that  we  have  in  our  jails,  penitentiaries  and  alms-houses  is  going  up  every 
year,  and  that  the  amount  of  money  which  society  is  called  upon  to  raise  to 
defray  the  expenses  of  the  defectives  and  delinquents  and  dependents  is  constantly 
going  up  in  proportion  to  the  number  of  people,  we  are  really  confronted  with  the 


67 

fact  that  our  school  system,  take  it  the  country  over,  is  not  quite  meeting  the 
needs  of  society.  That  is  the  proposition.  What  we  do  in  our  schools  does  not 
•seem  to  be  quite  enough  to  insure  the  stability  of  the  Eepublic.  In  brief,  that 
seems  to  be  the  situation  with  which  we  are  confronted.  We  constantly  hear  a 
battle  going  on  between  labor  and  capital,  between  various  organizations,  and 
•class  troubles  of  various  types.  Now  what  can  we  do?  Well,  I  have  been  im- 
pressed very  much  by  what  I  have  seen  done.  Now  I  shall  not  for  a  moment  at 
this  time  discuss  the  merits  of  the  European  war,  not  at  all. 

VOCATIONAL   SCHOOLS    IN    GERMANY. 

It  will,  perhaps,  not  be  out  of  place  for  me  to  cite  Germany  as  an  example 
of  efficiency.  I  am  not  going  to  discuss  anything  at  all  as  to  the  merits  of  the  war, 
but  I  do  feel  that  I  have  seen  what  a  school  system  can  do  for  a  state.  Germany 
does  seem  to  be  an  example  of  a  country  that  has  been  able  to  give  almost  a 
maximum  of  efficiency  for  a  minimum  of  cost,  and  that  is  what  I  understand 
boards  such  as  you  represent  are  interested  in.  How  can  you  get  the  maximum  of 
results  for  the  minimum  of  cost?  Well,  it  would  seem  that  the  way  that  that  has 
been  accomplished  in  Germany,  is  to  have  all  the  boys  and  girls  in  school  up  to 
the  age  of  seventeen  or  eighteen  and  have  no  way  of  getting  out  of  it.  I  should 
say  this,  then,  in  answer  to  Alderman. Kennedy's  proposition,  "What  place  has  a 
vocational  school  in  a  democracy?"  Have  all  the  boys  and  girls  in  school  until 
they  are  seventeen  or  eighteen  years  of  age;  have  it  understood  that  nobody  can 
get  out  of  this  thing,  everybody  has  got  to  go  to  school,  boys  and  girls,  until  the 
age  of  seventeen  or  eighteen. 

Now  there  are  certain  problems  that  would  have  to  be  handled  with  reference 
to  this  question.  It  is  simply  impossible  that  society  should  expect  parents  to  send 
their  children  to  school  until  they  are  seventeen  and  eighteen  years  of  age  and 
also  to  pay  their  entire  expenses.  It  would  seem  from  our  experience  in  education 
that  some  plan  must  be  worked  out  whereby  a  certain  percentage  of  the  boys 
and  girls  will  be  given  an  opportunity  in  this  school  system  to  earn  a  part  or  all 
•of  their  expense  after  they  are  fourteen  or  fifteen  years  old.  Throwing  that  burden 
wholly  upon  parents,  who  may  have  a  family  of  four  or  five  children  to  keep  them 
in  school,  might  be  debated  as  to  its  desirability.  It  must  be  true  in  theory  and 
work  out  in  fact,  so  that  it  will  function. 

Now  if  you  can  get  a  vocational  system  which  says  that  all  must  go  to 
school  until  they  are  seventeen  or  eighteen,  and  the  school  system  is  so  organized 
that  the  boys  and  girls — at  least  a  certain  percentage  according  to  the  needs  of 
society,  which  can  be  worked  out — will  be  given  an  opportunity  in  this  school 
system  to  earn  a  part  or,  if  need  be,  all  of  their  expenses  until  they  are  seventeen 
or  eighteen,  you  have  solved  the  question  of  expense,  and  also  have  seen  to  it 
that  the  children  grow  up  and  are  efficient  at  the  age  of  seventeen.  That  seems  to 
be  the  first  point  to  be  secured.  The  criticism  of  the  proposition  is  something  like 
this — the  labor  organizations  always  fear  a  proposition  like  this  because  they  say: 
"We  have  a  system  whereby  everybody  has  got  to  go  to  school  and  then  the 
school  will  simply  become  a  'scab'  factory,  and  every  time  there  is  a  strike  or 
things  to  be  done  the  schools  are  called  upon  and  they  will  turn  children  loose 
upon  the  factory.  Now  that  course  should  be  guarded  against,  and  we  must 
work  out  some  plan,  similar  to  what  I  found  in  Germany. 

SCHOOLS  TO   SUPPLY  TRADE   DEMAND. 

Under  the  department  of  labor  the  city  or  state  has  a  survey  made  of  the 
number  of  people  who  are  engaged  in  the  various  occupations.  The  state  says 
that  it  should  be  a  matter  of  record  as  to  how  many  people  are  engaged  in  the 
various  ocupations  in  the  state.  They  want  to  know  how  many  journeymen 
workers  are  engaged  in  the  state.  Now  then  it  should  be,  it  seems  to  me,  the 
duty  of  the  school  system  to  distribute  these  boys  and  girls  among  the  various 
occupations  according  to  the  number  of  journeymen  that  are  now  in  those  occupa- 
tions. That  is  the  way  Germany  works  that  out,  so  that  none  of  the  unions 
need  fear  the  school  because  it  is  a  matter  of  record  as  to  how  many  plumbers 


68 

there  are;  it  is  a  matter  of  record  as  to  how  many  carpenters  there  are  in  any 
particular  locality  in  the  city,  and  province.  Now  then  the  state  says,  the  law 
says,  that  for  every  so  many  journeymen  in  a  certain  particular  occupation  the 
man  who  is  running  that  establishment  may  have  so  many  apprentices.  Now 
these  apprentices  are  in  school  half  of  the  time,  and  they  are  working  for  half 
of  the  time.  The  employer  can  have  so  many,  and  no  more,  because  the  law  seek? 
to  distribute  all  the  children  among  all  the  occupations. 

Now  when  trade  unions  see  the  proposition  they  do  not  object,  because  no 
committee  would  say  that  they  are  going  to  keep  the  children  out  entirely.  The 
only  just  scheme  is  to  let  each  trade  take  its  share  of  the  children  and  in  that 
way  no  trade  will  be  overcrowded.  When  the  carpenters  know  they  are  going 
to  get  their  share  and  no  more,  they  are  satisfied.  The  proportion  will  have  to 
be  determined  by  survey,  and  either  that  would  have  to  be  done  by  a  state  board 
or  perhaps  in  larger  cites  by  a  subdivision  of  a  state  board  that  would  make 
a  careful  survey  of  the  number  of  workers  in  the  city  and  the  number  of  workers 
in  each  occupation,  so  that  it  would  be  determined  within  certain  pretty  well- 
defined  limits  as  to  how  many  boys  could  go  into  the  plumbing  work,  the  car- 
penter work  and  so  on,  so  there  would  be  no  overcrowding  at  any  one  point. 

Now  then,  instead  of  labor  suffering  from  any  such  scheme  as  that,  labor 
would  have  the  constant  assurance  that  it  was  not  only  getting  trained  workers, 
but  that  they  were  not  getting  too  many,  also  that  all  workers  added  would  be 
thoroughly  trained,  and  because  of  that  fact  they  would  be  able  to  earn  the 
miximum  of  money,  and  that  in  itself  would  enable  that  particular  trade  to 
become  strong  because  the  strength  of  labor  depends  first  upon  its  skill. 

TEACH  CITIZENSHIP  AND  PLAY. 

One  of  the  great  difficulties  of  the  country  at  the  present  time,  it  seems  to  me, 
lies  not  in  the  fact  that  we  are  not  producing  enough  goods,  but  we  are  poorly 
distributing  the  goods  we  are  producing.  The  great  difficulty  is  not  the  producing 
of  the  goods  so  much  as  the  question  of  distribution.  Now  one  of  the  faults  of 
distribution  lies  in  the  fact  that  our  laborers  have  not  been  taught  how  to  use 
their  spare  time.  It  will  not  be  sufficient  for  laborers  to  get  simply  10  hours  or 
9  hours  or  7  hours'  work,  it  is  also  important  to  teach  the  families  of  workers 
how  to  use  their  leisure  time,  in  order  that  that  leisure  may  be  so  spent  that  it  will 
result  in  the  efficiency  of  the  workers.  Much  valuable  time  is  being  wasted  among 
our  workers  now  because  they  have  never  been  taught  how  to  spend  their  leisure. 
It  should  be  the  purpose  of  a  vocational  education  in  a  democracy,  it  seems  to  me, 
to  teach  the  pupils  how  to  spend  their  leisure.  It  will  not  be  sufficient  for  the 
industrial  course  to  be  planned  so  that  all  of  the  time  of  the  children  will  be  given 
to  manual  efficiency,  but  they  must  have  courses  in  citizenship,  courses  that  will 
show  the  relationship  of  the  individual  to  the  state,  and  courses  that  will  show  the 
duty  of  the  individual  to  the  state;  courses  which  will  teach  the  boys  and  girls  how 
to  spend  their  time  and  have  a  good  time  at  a  picnic;  courses  which  will  teach  them 
how  to  go  out  on  walks  and  outings;  courses  that  will  show  them  how  to  become 
good  citizens  after  they  become  men  and  women.  It  seems  our  workmen  lack  so 
much  in  that  respect  that  there  is  no  other  way  by  which  society  can  get  at  that 
point  except  through  the  school  system.  You  establish  certain  clubs  that  will  go 
out  and  look  after  the  recreation  of  these  children.  This  work  might  be  taken 
over  by  the  school.  My  point  is  that  the  boys  and  girls  should  learn  something 
in  the  schools  that  they  will  take  with  them  into  their  life  work  to  show  them 
how  to  spend  their  leisure  time.  What  a  boy  is  able  to  do  after  he  leaves  school 
depends  upon  his  power  to  learn  and  the  habits  he  has  established.  To  teach  this 
would  be  a  great  function  in  a  vocational  education. 

We  get  the  impression  generally  that  a  large  number  of  people  look  at  voca- 
tional education  simply  from  the  standpoint  of  making  producers  out  of  the  boys 
and  girls;  they  think  that  is  the  main  thing,  but  I  hold  to  the  idea  that  society 
at  present  is  not  suffering  from  lack  of  production,  but  from  the  waste  that  is 
going  on.  There  are  a  large  number  of  people  who  have  the  idea  that  a  vocational 
education  should  emphasize  the  side  of  citizenship,  the  side  of  democracy  as  well 
as  the  side  of  skill,  and  above  all  to  see  that  every  boy  and  girl  goes  to  school 


69 

who  is  below  seventeen  and  eighteen  years  of  age.  That  would  tend  to  put  the 
school  system  on  the  road  to  fit  into  its  proper  place  in  a  democracy.  It  would 
give  manual  service  and  efficiency  to  those  who  need  it  and  it  would  not  work  any 
inconvenience  to  anyone  so  far  as  I  can  see. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  think  it  would  be  a  practical  proposition  to  have 
every  child  going  to  a  public  school  in  Chicago  to  be  taught  some  trade  or 
occupation,  every  one  of  them? 

IGNORANCE  WILL  BANKRUPT  NATION. 

Mr.  Eoman:  Well,  it  would  seem  to  me  a  very  proper  proposition  to  say 
that  every  child  should  go  to  some  school  after  the  age  of  fourteen  or  fifteen, 
after  he  gets  his  elementary  schooling.  Now  he  has  his  choice.  If  he  wants 
to  go  to  a  literary  school  he  can  do  it;  if  he  wants  to  go  to  a  commercial 
school  he  can  do  so.  The  children  are  given  their  choice.  All  the  law  says  is  "  go 
somewhere,  because  the  state  is  too  poor  to  allow  its  boys  and  girls  to  grow  up 
ignorant."  It  is  not  a  question  of  having  enough  money  to  send  children  to 
school.  The  state  is  too  poor  not  to  allow  them  to  go  to  school.  It  is  the 
ignorance  of  children  that  will  bankrupt  the  state;  it  is  not  the  taxes  that  are 
necessary  to  educate  them,  but  their  ignorance  that  will  bankrupt  the  state. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  think  this  applies  as  strongly  to  the  training  of 
girls  as  boys;  that  is,  that  an  equal  opportunity  for  vocational  training  should  be 
given  to  girls? 

Mr.  Eoman:  Personally,  I  feel  that  the  future  strength  of  a  democracy 
depends  upon  a  like  training.  I  do  not  mean  that  they  take  the  same  courses, 
but  that  they  must  be  trained  in  their  line  of  activity,  and  in  fact  in  order  to  get 
the  best  possible  education  it  would  seem  that  you  should  connect  the  education 
with  that  line  of  thought.  I  think  I  should  have  added  that  in  my  general  state- 
ment. Experience  seems  to  show  that  if  you  can  give  a  boy  some  kind  of  work 
at  the  age  of  fourteen  or  fifteen,  and  let  him  work  part  of  the  time  and  go  to 
school  part  of  the  time,  it  seems  to  work  out  most  effectively  and  gives  him  a 
real  eductaion;  it  will  not  only  make  him  efficient,  but  it  will  give  him  some  idea 
of  citizenship,  because  you  can  teach  him  responsibilities  while  he  is  doing  that 
work.  It  seems  too  bad  that  so  many  children  go  through  high  school  without 
studying  that  side  of  life. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  A  large  part  of  the  labor  in  cities  is  called  unskilled 
labor,  now  if  through  these  various  educational  schools  their  children  are  going  to 
be  schooled,  or  schooled  where  they  get  a  vocational  training,  where  is  the 
supply  of  this  labor  coming  from  to  take  the  place  of  the  so-called  unskilled 
workers? 

Mr.  Eoman:  I  would  answer  that  by  saying  that  experience  in  the  develop- 
ment of  labor  and  machinery  seems  to  have  proved  conclusively  that  with  trained 
workers  there  is  a  large  disappearance  of  unskilled  labor.  That  is  the  first  point 
that  I  make,  you  train  all  workers  or  put  them  through  school  and  give  them  a- 
training,  and  make  them  efficient;  it  is  the  history  of  the  matter  that  a  high 
percentage  of  unskilled  labor  will  pass  out  of  existence,  and  a  large  part  of  this 
unskilled  work  so-called  is  unskilled  work  simply  because  they  can  get  it  cheaply 
and  it  does  not  pay  to  put  in  machinery,  and  the  workman  is  not  intelligent,  and 
he  could  not  do  anything  with  skilled  work  even  if  he  had  it.  My  first  point  is 
that  this  compulsory  system  of  education,  giving  everybody  a  training,  will  strike 
a  powerful  blow  at  unskilled  employment;  it  will  kill  it,  and  that  will  be  to  the 
interest  of  the  worker,  to  society  and  to  the  whole  process  of  production.  Again, 
if  you  have  all  of  these  boys  and  girls  studying,  even  the  unskilled  trade,  you  will 
thereby  be  giving  them  a  confidence  in  themselves  that  will  do  a  great  deal  in 
enabling  them  to  rise  in  the  community.  Now  if  I  could  illustrate  that  briefly 
I  would  like  to  tell  what  I  observed  from  my  experience  in  Germany. 

THREE-YEAR  COURSE  IN  JANITOR  WORK. 

In  Germany  every  kind  of  trade  is  taught  in  school,  even  the  most  unskilled 
trade.  I  was  interested  to  see  in  Germany  a  three-year  course  in  messenger 


70 

service.  Now  you  would  say  you  co-uld  learn  that  in  a  few  days.  Germany 
makes  a  grade  course  out  of  it.  They  teach  the  boys  to  write.  If  he  is  to  be  a 
messenger  he  will  often  have  occasion  to  write  and  he  will  be  given  a  course 
along  the  line  of  responsibility — as  to  the  responsibility  of  the  messenger,  and 
while  they  are  teaching  him  responsibility  they  are  teaching  him  to  be  a  citizen. 
There  is  a  whole  lot  that  he  learns  while  he  is  learning  to  be  a  messenger.  Then 
he  will  be  taught  various  types  of  work  in  which  he  could  function  as  a  messenger. 
In  other  words,  they  will  make  a  three-years'  course  out  of  it.  Now  I  want  to 
say  that  the  number  of  boys  who  are  studying  that  would  not  be  great.  Germany 
has  another  set  of  men — older  men — who  are  slightly  deficient  mentally;  they 
are  given  special  jobs.  Society  will  always  have  those  who  are  not  "there" 
mentally.  We  have  lots  of  people  in  charitable  institutions  and  almshouses  that 
will  help  along  the  matter  of  production  if  they  were  properly  handled.  I  do  not 
say  they  would  be  helped  along  at  the  top,  but  they  would  be  helped  along  some- 
where and  we  would  be  increasing  the  production.  You  take  an  unskilled  occupa- 
tion, say  a  janitor.  We  feel  that  that  is  an  unskilled  occirpation.  I  have  visited 
that  type  of  school  in  Germany  many  a  time,  and  I  have  been  impressed  with  the 
fact  that  they  could  make  a  three-year  course  out  of  janitor's  work.  After  you 
found  out  what  they  made  out  of  him  in  Germany  you  would  have  respect  for 
him.  He  knows  how  brooms  are  made.  He  knows  where  the  straw  came  from. 
He  knows  whether  it  is  good  straw  or  poor.  He  knows  when  you  ask  him  to 
buy  a  broom  where  to  buy  a  good  one.  He  will  know  what  it  costs.  He  learned  it 
in  school.  He  knows  all  about  it.  In  other  words,  you  feel  that  your  janitor 
does  know  some  one  thing  about  that  manufacture  and  he  knows  that  thing 
better  than  you  do.  That  is  the  best  fellowship.  Not  only  does  the  boy  study  this 
janitor  work  and  understand  about  the  broom,  but  he  understands  all  about  the 
oils  and  paints  that  go  on  the  floor.  He  knows  the  effect  of  oil  upon  floors. 

In  other  words,  you  get  efficiency,  and  even  the  janitor  will  not  put  the  wrong 
thing  on  the  floor  because  he  learned  what  to  do  in  his  school  course.  The  efficiency 
of  a  democracy  depends  upon  everybody  knowing  what  he  is  doing. 

Alderman  Buck:  He  learns  the  whole  operation  of  the  janitor's  work  and 
not  one  detail  of  it. 

Mr.  Koman:    That  is  it. 

Alderman  Buck:    He  learns  it  in  relation  to  the  whole  of  his  life,  does  he  not? 

Mr.  Eoman:  Yes,  sir.  I  would  like  to  add  one  more  point  if  I  may.  This 
whole  scheme  ought  to  be  so  graded  that  if  a  boy  has  done  this  work  well 
and  starts  in  to  be  a  janitor  and  then  the  teacher  discovers  that  the  boy  can  do 
some  better  work,  that  which  he  has  already  done  will  be  a  stepping  stone  to  some- 
thing else,  so  it  will  enable  a  boy  or  a  girl  to  rise  to  the  maximum  of  what  he 
can  do,  if  he  has  the  mental  ability.  If  he  has  not  the  mental  ability  to  rise  higher 
it  will  enable  him  to  do  this  work  that  he  has  learned  well. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  I  understand  there  was  some  discussion  in  Chicago 
whether  this  sort  of  work  should  be  under  another  kind  of  board  of  education. 
What  has  been  the  system  in  Germany,  have  they,  dual  boards  of  education,  or  is 
it  done  in  a  unified  way? 

Mr.  Eoman:  In  northern  Germany  the  regular  schools  have  been  under  the 
minister  of  state  on  schools  and  churches,  and  industrial  schools  have  been  under 
the  minister  of  agriculture  and  industry,  but  in  either  case  there  has  been  no 
local  board  in  Prussia,  which  is  more  than  half  the  size  of  all  Germany.  There 
has  been  no  local  board  in  northern  Germany.  It  is  all  managed  centrally,  no 
local  board,  the  theory  being  if  they  had  local  boards,  the  two  boards  would  not 
agree  and,  of  course,  that  would  tend  to  inefficiency. 

Alderman  Buck:     In  northern  Germany  who  appoints  the  minister? 

Mr.  Eoman:     The  king  appoints  both  of  them. 

Alderman  Powers:     What  minister  has  charge  of  the  industrial  schools? 

Mr.  Eoman:  The  industrial  schools  are  under  the  minister  of  agriculture  and 
commerce.  In  northern  Germany  they  are  under  his  authority. 

Alderman  Powers:     How  long  do  they  attend  those  schools,  how  many  years? 

Mr.  Eoman:  Until  the  age  of  fourteen  they  are  under  the  minister  of  schools 
and  churches.  Now  in  southern  Germany  I  want  to  say  that  the  schools  have 
been  the  most  noted.  The  schools  of  Munich  have  been  known  the  world  over 
for  their  efficiency.  In  southern  Germany  they  are  all  under  the  same  board. 


71 

« 

This  point,  however,  being  added  for  the  sake  of  efficiency — for  the  industrial 
schools  there  is  appointed  an  advisory  committee,  men  composed  of  the  various 
trades  and  their  employers  who  act  as  advisory  boards.  They  have  no  power, 
however.  There  is  no  possibility  of  conflict  between  the  two  boards,  because 
one  board  that  has  charge  of  all  'the  schools,  has  the  final  say,  and  has  authority 
over  both  schols,  the  second  board  simply  being  a  group  of  men  who  are  asked 
to  come  in  and  give  advice  concerning  the  local  conditions;  they  have  no  power 
to  act  on  the  budget;  no  power  to  appoint  teachers  and  no  power  to  fix  the 
curriculum,  but  they  are  called  in  from  time  to  time  to  give  their  advice.  There 
is  a  labor  union  of  carpenters  and  plumbers  and  sometimes  they  call  in  some  of 
those  men.  They  keep  themselves  in  touch  with  the  various  industrial  bodies, 
and  the  advice  of  the  various  crafts  is  considered.  The  point  is  this,  that  there 
is  never  a  possibility  of  getting  any  factions  in  the  local  community  over  the 
situation. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     In  your  opinion  is  it  better  to  have  one  authority,  one 
control  of  the  situation  and  no  divided  responsibility  in  the  community? 

Mr.   Roman:      That   seems  to   be  the  universal  testimony  that  I  have   been 
able  to  get,  especially  as  brought  out  from  the  investigations  I  have  made. 


STUDY  VOCATIONAL  TRAINING  NEEDS. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Take  the  conditions  in  this  country,  as  observed  here 
in  Chicago,  and  I  presume  they  must  be  the  same  elsewhere — we  have  all  done 
something  along  the  line  of  vocational  education — what  would  you  think  would 
be  the  proper  course  of  action  to  promote  the  development  of  vocational  educa- 
tion? What  do  you  think  the  needs  are  in  this  country? 

Mr.  Eoman:  Well,  I  should  think  that  the  first  step  would  be  to  make  this 
survey,  finding  out  how  many  people  we  have  employed  in  the  various  occupations. 
We  need  to  know  that.  We  have  not  the  information  upon  that  yet.  After  we 
have  that,  we  need  then  to  secure  legislation  that  will  make  this  attendance  com- 
pulsory. Then  after  we  have  had  compulsory  attendance  we  need  to  have  some 
department  of  labor,  provisions  whereby  the  number  for  the  various  occupations 
will  be  regulated  so  there  will  be  no  overcrowding,  so  that  each  gets  his  due 
share  and  no  more.  Now  after  we  have  carried  out  those  few  points  we  will 
then  need  to  see  to  it  that  the  curriculum  is  worked  out  in  line  with  the  needs  of 
the  local  industries,  and  that  would  be  a  matter  of  consultation,  it  would  seem  to 
me,  between  the  members  of  the  board  of  education,  those  making  the  curriculum, 
and  the  local  situation.  This  labor  bureau  will  see  to  it  that  each  board  gets  itsi 
due  proportion  in  each  particular  industry  and  no  more.  As  to  what  should  bo 
taught  that  again  would  be  a  matter  of  investigation,  and  then,  of  course,  as  to 
how  it  should  be  taught  would  be  a  matter  for  experts  in  methods.  That  would 
be  another  proposition. 

Alderman  Miller:  I  was  going  to  ask  whether  you  thought  schools  would  no£ 
be  best  controlled  by  the  National  Government? 

Mr.  Roman:  I  suppose  it  would  be  in  a  general  way,  but  there  are  so  many 
local  conditions  and  so  many  state  conditions  that  I  think  on  the  whole  a  certain 
amount  of  initiative  would  be  required  from  the  state,  and  I  suppose  a  certain 
amount  of  initiative  in  order  to  fit  local  conditions.  The  state  is  asked  to  take 
care  of  paupers  and  delinquents  and  if  the  state  has  to  pay  the  bills  the  stato 
should  have  something  to  say  with  regard  to- the  conditions  by  which  these  delin 
quents  are  produced. 

Alderman  Buck:  We  have  had  a  very  pleasing  exhibition  before  this  com 
mittee  in  the  last  few  weeks  of  the  willingness,  not  only  the  willingness  but  the 
eagerness  of  the  men  who  are  versed  in  special  branches  of  education  in  the 
schools  of  the  country  to  come  here  to  Chicago  and  to  help  us  in  our  situation, 
diagnosing  our  case  and  finding  out  what  is  the  matter,  and  in  our  search  that  we 
are  making  here  for  remedies. 


72 


WILLIAM  H.  MAXWELL, 

Superintendent  of  Schools,  New  York  City. 

Mr.  Maxwell's  letters  were  read  November  4,  1916: 

Alderman  Buck:  Mr.  Chairman,  the  committee  invited,  among  others,  Mr. 
Maxwell,  Superintendent  of  Schools  of  the  City  of  New  York,  to  come  and  advise 
us  upon  our  situation.  Mr.  Maxwell's  health  is  somewhat  broken  and  he  was 
unable  to  come  upon  that  account. 

He  has  sent  to  Professor  Judd  some  letters  containing  some  of  his  views  on 

feneral  school  administration  policies.    Mr.  Judd  has  sent  copies  of  them  here  and 
should  like  to  have  them  read  and  made  part  of  the  record. 

"THE  CITY  OF  NEW  YOEK 

OFFICE  OF 
THE   CITY  SUPEEINTENDENT  OF   SCHOOLS. 

17th  October,  1916. 
Dear  Professor  Judd: 

I  am  very  sorry  that  I  cannot  go  to  Chicago  to  appear  before  the  Education 
Committee  of  the  City  Council  and  give  them  my  views  on  the  organization  of 
a  school  system  for  a  large  city  like  Chicago.  I  have  already  written  to  Alderman 
Buck,  telling  him  that,  on  account  of  a  prolonged  illness  from  which  I  have  not 
yet  entirely  recovered,  it  is  out  of  the  question  for  me  even  to  think  of  going. 
You  will  understand  how  glad  I  should  be  to  go  if  I  were  able  to  do  so,  and  how 
much  I  regret  that  I  cannot  go.  I  assure  you  I  Regard  the  invitation  as  a  very 
high  honor. 

Inasmuch  as  I  cannot  be  present,  however,  I  beg  leave  to  lay  before  you  a 
few  suggestions  regarding  the  organization  of  public  schools  in  a  large  city,  which 
you  may  lay  before  the  council,  or  not,  as  you  see  fit.  These  suggestions  are 
as  follows: 

Finance: 

Inasmuch  as  the  State  is  responsible  for  educating,  at  public  expense,  the 
children  of  the  State,  the  State  Legislature  should  lay  down  a  minimum  tax  for 
the  support  of  the  schools.  This  minimum  tax  may  be  either  a  fixed  rate,  such 
as  is  the  five-mill  tax  set  aside  by  the  Pennsylvania  Legislature  for  the  support 
of  the  Philadelphia  schools,  or  it  may  be  a  variable  rate.  If  the  rate  is  to  be 
variable,  however,  it  should  depend  upon  the  average  cost  of  the  schools  for 
each  preceding  year  for  a  period  of  ten  years.  The  Board  of  Education  should 
prepare"  annually  an  educational  budget,  to  be  laid  before  the  financial  authorities 
of  the  city.  This  budget  should  be  prepared  in  three  divisions: 

1.  Salaries  of  teachers,  school  officers  and  supervisors. 

2.  The  material  expense  of  running  the  schools,  such  as  the  cost  of  fuel  and 
lighting,  janitors'  salaries,  etc. 

3.  The  expense  involved  in  the  erection  of  new  buildings  and  the  repair  of 
old  buildings. 

In  case  the  aggregate  of  this  budget  exceeds  the  minimum  tax  prescribed 
by  the  Legislature,  the  financial  authorities  of  the  city  shall  carefully  consider 
the  requests  of  the  Board  of  Education.  In  case  the  financial  authorities  believe 
that  more  money  is  asked  for  than  should  be  expended  for  the  purpose,  they 
shall  refer  back  the  budget  to  the  Board  of  Education.  If  the  final  authorities 
and  the  Board  of  Education  come  to  an  agreement,  all  well  and  good.  In  case 
the  financial  authorities  and  the  Board  of  Education  do  not  agree,  the  amount 
asked  for  by  the  Board  t>f  Education  shall  be  submitted  by  referendum  to  the 
voters  of  the  city,  whose  decision  shall  be  final. 

Employment  of  Teachers,  etc.: 

All  teachers  and  supervising  officers  shall  be  appointed  by  the  Board  of 
Education  on  the  nomination  of  the  Superintendent  of  Schools,  who  shall  nominate 
both  for  appointment  and  for  promotion,  from  eligible  lists  prepared  bv  a  Board 
of  Examiners. 


73 

Board  of  Examiners: 

Members  of  the  Board  of  Examiners  shall  be  appointed  by  the  Board  of 
Education  on  the  nomination  of-  the  Superintendent  of  Schools.  Nominations,  if 
not  confirmed  or  rejected  by  the  Board  of  Education  within  forty  days  after  they 
are  filed  with  the  Secretary  of  the  Board  of  Education  by  the  Superintendent  of 
Schools,  shall  be  equivalent  to  appointment. 

All  questions  regarding  the  course  of  study  in  the  schools,  the  adoption  of 
textbooks,  the  organization  of  new  schools  and  changes  in  the  organization  of 
existing  schools  shall  be  made  by  the  Board  of  Education,  after  receiving  recom- 
mendations from  the  Superintendent  of  Schools. 

Superintendent '  s  Council : 

A  council  shall  be  organized,  consisting  of  assistant  superintendent  and 
supervisors,  who  shall  advise  the  Superintendent  of  Schools  with  regard  to  his 
recommendations  for  changes  in  the  course  of  study,  the  selection  of  text-books, 
and  other  educational  questions.  It  shall  be  the  duty  of  the  Superintendent  of 
Schools  to  submit  all  his  plans  to  this  council  before  submitting  them  to  the 
Board  of  Education,  and  to  consider  all  recommendations  coming  from  said  council. 
After  hearing  and  considering  the  recommendations  of  the  council,  however,  the 
Superintendent  of  Schools  shall  be  free  to  make  such  recommendations  to  the 
Board  of  Education  as  he  deems  fit.  All  his  nominations  for  supervising  positions 
shall  likewise  be  submitted  to  such  council.  Before  submitting  nominations  for 
transfer  of  teachers  or  for  appointment  of  teachers  to  a  particular  school,  the 
Superintendent  of  Schools  shall  sumbit  his  proposals  to  the  principal  of  the 
school  concerned,  the  assistant  superintendent  assigned  to  the  supervision  of  such 
school,  and  three  representatives  selected  by  the  faculty  of  the  school.  As  in  the 
case  of  the  general  council,  he  shall  be  required  to  submit  his  proposals  to  this 
advisory  body  and  to  listen  to  any  recommendations  or  criticisms  the  members 
desire  to  make.  He  shall  be  free,  however,  to  adopt  or  to  reject  the  suggestions, 
as  he  sees  fit. 

Discipline  of  Teachers: 

In  case  charges  of  gross  misconduct,  neglect  of  duty,  inefficiency,  or  conduct 
unbecoming  a  teacher  are  preferred  against  any  member  of  the  teaching  or  super- 
vising force,  the  Superintendent  of  Schools  shall  appoint  three  teachers  or  supervis- 
ing officers,  who  shall  hear  the  charges  and  the  evidence  offered  in  their  support, 
and  who  shall  hear  the  defense  of  the  accused  person.  The  committee  so  appointed 
shall  submit  its  conclusions  and  recommendations,  together  with  a  copy  of  the 
evidence  taken,  to  a  committee  of  three  assistant  superintendents,  appointed  by  the 
Superintendent  of  Schools,  who  may  confirm,  modify,  or  reject  the  report  of  the 
committee  that  conducts  the  trial.  From  the  decisions  of  this  body,  an  appeal 
may  be  taken  to  the  Board  of  Education,  whose  decision  shall  be  final. 

Superintendent '  s  Assistants : 

The  Superintendent  of  Schools  shall  have  the  power  to  designate,  subject  to 
confirmation  by  the  Board  of  Education,  one  of  his  assistants  as  Deputy  Superin- 
tendent of  Schools,  who  shall  act  as  Superintendent  during  the  absence  or  disability 
of  the  Superintendent  of  Schools,  and  who  shall  perform  such  other  duties  as  the 
Superintendent  of  Schools  shall  assign.  The  Superintendent  of  Schools  shall 
further  have  the  power  to  assign  the  assistant  superintendents  to  such  duties  as 
he  believes  to  be  for  the  best  interests  of  the  schools  of  the  city. 

This  outline  of  my  thought  on  this  great  subject  is  dicated  hastily,  when,  as 
you  know,  I  am  not  very  strong.  If  it  is  of  any  use  to  you  and  my  other  friends 
in  Chicago,  you  are  very  welcome  to  it.  I  shall  be  glad  to  learn  what  you  do 
with  it. 

Very  truly  yours, 

(Signed)      WM.   H.   MAXWELL, 

City  Superintendent  of  Schools. 
Prof.  Charles  Hubbard  Judd, 
University  of  Chicago, 
Chicago,  111. 

P.  S.  In  dictating  I  omitted  to  state  one  feature  of  the  New  York  system 
which  I  regard  as  of  the  first  importance.  All  appointments  are  made  for  one  year 


74 

and  for  three  successive  years  are  revocable  at  the  will  of  the  Superintendent. 
After  three  years  appointments  should  be  more  permanent.  Teachers  should  then 
be  discharged  only  after  the  procedure  I  have  suggested  above." 


"19th  October,   1916. 
Dear  President  Finley: 

I  am  glad  you  did  not  ask  me  to  talk  to  the  Convocation  by  telephone.  I  find 
there  is  nothing  that  makes  greater  demands  on  my  shattered  nerves  than  either 
talking  or  listening  over  the  telephone. 

Concerning  New  Legislation  in  New  York: 

Perhaps  you  will  recall  that,  when  we  met  at  Hanover,  New  Hampshire,  I 
suggested  to  you  that  Assistant  Commissioner  Finegan  was  engaged  in  what 
would  probably  prove  an  impossible  task,  even  for  his  great  ability,  namely,  to 
weave  into  one  general  statute  the  various  plans  for  city  schools  found  in 
the  cities  of  the  State,  and  that  a  brief,  comprehensive  statute,  embodying  certain 
fundamental  prinicples  of  administration,  without  going  too  much  into  detail, 
would  be  not  only  more  useful,  but  would  be  more  likely  to  be  adopted.  In  my 
judgment,  if  such  a  measure  is  to  be  introduced  next  year,  it  should  be  introduced 
very  early  in  the  session  and  an  attempt  should  be  made  to  secure  the  general, 
if  not  the  unanimous,  support  of  the  superintendents  of  schools  of  the  State,  and 
possibly  the  boards  of  education. 

Finance  and  Administration  Most  Important: 

As  a  small  and  probably  very  poor  contribution  to  the  compilation  of  such 
a  statute,  I  send  you  a  copy  of  a  letter  I  have  just  addressed  to  Professor  Charles 
Hubbard  Judd,  of  Chicago.  You  will  notice  that  I  have  not  gone  into  the  questions 
of  the  size  of  the  board  of  education  or  how  the  members  shall  be  elected  or 
appointed,  or  the  powers  of  committees,  etc.  In  my  judgment,  these  are  com- 
paratively unimportant  matters,  if  the  great  questions  of  finance  and  school 
administration  are  settled  as  I  have  suggested.  Possibly  it  might  be  well  to  have 
them  settled  by  local  authority.  If  it  is  thought  so,  I  would  suggest  that  a  com- 
mission with  power  to  draw  up  a  plan  might  be  appointed  in  each  city.  Of  such 
a  commission  the  Mayor  might  well  be  president  ex  officio,  while  the  members 
might  consist  of  five  delegates,  from  its  own  number,  selected  by  the  existing 
board  of  education,  five  members  selected  by  the  common  council,  who  should 
not  be  members  of  that  body,  and  five  members  selected  by  the  city  Chamber  of 
Commerce.  The  conclusions  of  this  commission  should  be  submitted  to  the  Com- 
mon Council,  to  be  adopted  as  city  ordinances.  In  case  they  are  not  adopted 
within  a  given  time,  the  Mayor  should  be  authorized  to  appoint  a  temporary  board 
of  education,  to  hold  office  until  the  Common  Council  or  the  Legislature  acts. 

Favors  Elected  Board: 

Upon  the  whole,  I  am  inclined  to  favor  the  elective  plan,  rather  than  the  ap- 
pointive plan,  for  members  of  the  Board  of  Education,  provided  the  members 
are  chosen  for  the  city  at  large,  and  not  by  districts,  and  provided  each  voter 
may  vote  for  individual  members,  and  not  for  nominations  as  a  whole. 

I  think  it  may  be  claimed  for  the  plan  I  have  outlined  (1)  that  it  gives  the 
board  of  education,  the  superintendent  of  schools,  etc.,  their  due  rights  and  powers; 
(2)  that  it  provides  ample  financial  support  for  the  schools,  which  will  not  be 
controlled  by  political  bodies;  and  (3)  that,  while  it  makes  the  State  the  supreme 
authority  (perhaps  a  section  should  be  included  providing  that  the  local  course 
of  study  shall  be  at  least  equivalent  to  a  minimum  course  laid  down  by  the 
State,  and  may  go  as  far  beyond  that  as  the  local  authorities  determine),  it 
leaves  to  local  authorities  the  determination  of  questions  which  are  better  settled 
by  them  than  by  the  State  Legislature. 

Very  truly  yours, 

(Signed)     WM.  H.  MAXWELL, 

City  Superintendent  of  Schools. 
HON.  JOHN  H.  FINLEY, 

State  Commissioner  of  Education, 
Albany,  N.  Y." 


75 


DR.  LEONARD  P.  AYRES, 

Director  of  the  Division  of  Education,  Eussell  Sage  Foundation. 

Dr.  Ayres  appeared  November  4,  1916. 

Alderman  Buck:  We  have  secured  the  attendance  today  of  Dr.  Leonard  P. 
Ayres,  director  of  the  Division  of  Education  of  the  Kussell  Sage  Foundation, 
New  York  City,  who  is  one  of  the  big  educators  of  the  country,  who  was  formerly 
superintendent  of  schools  of  Porto  Kico,  and  who  has  probably  conducted  a  good 
many  more  school  surveys  than  any  other  educator  in  the  country.  Therefore 
his  -  information  and  his  knowledge  of  school  subjects  covers  a  wider  research 
than  perhaps  any  man  we  could  possibly  have  address  us. 

Dr.  Ayres:  Mr.  Chairman,  I  understand  that  the  object  of  your  committee  is 
to  assist  in  the  drafting  of  a  new  law  which  shall  provide  for  the  organization 
and  administration  of  the  public  school  system  of  Chicago.  I  have  made  a  memo- 
randum of  the  items  that  I  think  such  a  fundamental  school  law  for  a  great  city 
should  contain.  There  are  ten  items  and  if  it  be  your  pleasure  I  will  read  them, 
comment  on  them  very  briefly,  and  then  answer  or  discuss  such  questions  as  you 
may  wish  to  bring  up. 

First:  The  law  should  be  brief.  It  should  lay  down  the  general  powers  and 
duties  of  the  board  of  education  and  leave  it  to  the  new  board  to  work  out  the 
details  of  organization  of  the  system. 

ELECTED  BOARD  PREFERRED. 

Second:  The  law  should  provide  for  a  small  board.  My  own  choice  will  be 
a  board  of  seven  members  elected  by  popular  vote  on  alternate  years  and  serving 
for  six  year  terms.  The  elections  should  be  held  in  the  spring  so  that  they 
would  not  coincide  with  regular  city  elections  and  they  should  be  held  in  the 
schoolhouses  so  as  to  reduce  the  expense  of  holding  them.  Personally  I  should 
go  still  further  and  have  the  elections  conducted  by  the  school  teachers,  prinicpals, 
and  other  employees  so  as  to  reduce  still  further  the  necessary  cost.  The  im- 
portant feature  of  the  plan  is  to  separate  school  elections  from  other  elections 
and  this  will  not  be  done  if  the  expense  is  too  great. 

Third:  The  law  should  provide  for  a  single-headed  system  with  power  and 
responsibility  definitely  located  and  headed  up  in  the  executive  leader  of  the 
system,  who  is  the  superintendent. 

Fourth:  The  board  should  have  the  power  to  elect  the  superintendent  and 
fix  his  salary.  I  personally  favor  giving  the  board  power  to  elect  him  for  any 
term  up  to  five  years.  All  the  other  employees  should  be  appointed  by  the  board 
on  the  nomination  of  the  superintendent. 

Fifth:  The  board  should  be  charged  with  the  duty  of  providing  standard 
educational  facilities  such  as  elementary  schools,  high  schools,  night  schools,  and 
the  rest  and  it  should  be  given  large  latitude  of  power  to  support  special  educa- 
tional facilities  such  as  playgrounds,  libraries,  recreational  centers,  etc. 

Sixth:  Employees  should  be  elected  each  year  for  a  probationary  period  of 
three  years  and  after  that  either  by  successive  terms  of  three  years  each  or  by 
indefinite  tenure  after  the  conclusion  of  the  probationary  period.  I  personally 
favor  the  election  for  successive  terms. 

Seventh:  The  board  should  be  charged  with  the  duty  of  adopting  salary 
schedules.  The  amounts  of  salaries  should  not  be  fixed  by  law  but  the  board 
should  not  be  left  free  to  pay  each  new  employee  whatever  it  may  please. 

.  Eighth:  The  board  should  be  given  power  to  build  and  repair  buildings,  buy 
land,  take  property  through  right  of  eminent  domain,  etc. 

Ninth:  The  board  should  prepare  annually  a  budget  for  the  succeeding 
year.  This  budget  should  be  submitted  to  the  mayor  of  the  city  for  approval. 
If  approved,  it  should  become  a  part  of  the  general  budget  of  the  city  and  enter 
into  the  tax  dudget.  If  the  mayor  should  disapprove  of  any  item,  he  should 
return  the  budget  with  a  message  stating  his  reasons  for  disapproving  of  that 
item.  The  school  board  should  then  reconsider  that  item  and  hold  a  public 


76 

hearing  on  it.  If,  after  holding  this  hearing  and  after  considering  the  message 
of  the  mayor,  five  out  of  the  seven  members  of  the  board  should  still  vote  to 
adopt  the  budget  in  its  original  form,  it  should  be  passed  despite  the  disapproval 
of  the  mayor.  This  process  should  continue  item  by  item  until  a  complete  budget 
was  adopted.  Until  such  a  budget  was  adopted,  that  of  the  preceding  year 
should  remain  in  force. 

Tenth  and  last:  Bond  issues  should  be  submitted  to  the  vote  of  the  people 
at  the  school  elections  and  provision  should  be  made  for  holding  special  elections 
for  this  purpose  if  necessary. 

SMALL  SCHOOL  BOARD  DESIRABLE. 

The  principal  characteristics  of  this  proposed  law  are,  first,  that  it  is  clear 
and  brief  and  leaves  the  details  to  be  settled  within  the  city;  second,  that  it 
provides  for  a  single-headed  system  and  a  small  board;  third,  that  it  aims  to  keep 
the  public  interested  and  to  build  up  an  informed  public  opinion  about  educational 
problems;  and  fourth,  that  it  provides  for  the  co-operation  of  the  school  and 
municipal  authorities  in  financing  the  city  school  system. 

I  shall  be  very  brief,  Mr.  Chairman,  in  recapitulating  and  shall  speak  about 
these  prinicpal  characteristics  in  a  little  more  detail.  I  thoroughly  believe  in  the 
small  Board  of  Education.  It  will  be  argued  that  this  board  should  be  big  because 
the  city  is  big  and  the  business  is  big.  Not  at  all.  The  board  should  be  small 
because  the  business  is  big.  The  board  of  education  is  really  a  state  body  provided 
for  by  state  law  to  do  one  thing.  Its  duty  is  to  get  the  schools  run,  not  to  run 
them;  to  get  things  done,  not  to  do  them.  That  is  why  the  small  board  that  can 
get  together  and  work  directly  as  a  committee  of  the  whole  is  the  efficient  board. 

This  is  one  of  the  rules  that  works  only  one  way.  The  small  board  may  be 
inefficient.  The  big  board  cannot  be  efficient.  In  a  large  city  like  this  the  action 
of  the  board  must  be  informed,  united,  and  energetic  and  the  only  way  these 
conditions  can  be  secured  in  the  conduct  of  a  big  business  is  to  have  a  small 
board  that  can  discuss  and  decide  the  matters  of  policy  that  are  essential  to 
getting  things  done.  If  you  want  to  have  a  board  that  will  run  the  schools  itself 
through  its  own  committees,  you  must  have  a  big  board  but  you  will  also  have 
a  poor  school  system. 

The  board  should  be  unpaid.  Some  of  the  arguments  for  a  paid  board  are 
plausible  but  the  verdict  of  experience  is  on  the  side  of  the  unpaid  board.  There 
are  six  paid  boards  in  large  cities.  They  are  found  in  San  Francisco,  Rochester, 
Memphis,  Los  Angeles,  Oakland  and  Milwaukee.  The  pay  varies  from  $3,000  per 
year  in  San  Francisco  to  $3  per  meeting  in  Milwaukee. 

If  you  organize  your  school  system  so  that  it  is  the  business  of  the  board  to 
decide  large  matters  of  general  policy  instead  of  dealing  with  small  details  of 
specific  application,  you  will  so  greatly  reduce  the  amount  of  time  required  and 
so  elevate  the  character  of  the  work  done  that  you  will  find  it  entirely  possible 
to  secure  the  services  of  the  best  types  of  men  and  women  without  pay.  In 
scores  of  cities  all  over  the  country  it  is  found  possible  to  get  the  best  and  ablest 
people  to  serve  on  unpaid  boards. 

The  system  should  be  a  single-headed  one  because  the  character  and  efficiency 
of  every  organization  is  largely  determined  by  the  leadership  that  directs  it.  You 
cannot  have  an  efficient  organization  with  dispersed  authority  and  scattered 
responsibility.  The  foundation  of  effective  management  of  large  affairs  is  to 
organize,  deputize,  and  supervise.  In  every  large  business  and  organization  there 
are  to  be  found  men  and  women  who  are  able  to  organize  and  supervise  but  there 
are  few  indeed  who  possess  the  ability  to  deputize  others  to  care  for  details. 
The  school  business  of  this  city  is  so  large,  complex,  and  ramified  that  it  can  be 
conducted  efficiently  only  if  it  is  presided  over  by  a  large  caliber  executive  and 
so  planned  as  to  enable  him  and  the  board  to  organize,  deputize,  and  supervise. 

ONE  HEAD  FOR  THE  WHOLE  SYSTEM. 

For  these  reasons  I  favor  the  single-headed  system.  I  am  opposed  to  a  division 
of  the  system  either  along  the  two  lines  of  education  and  business  on  the  six  or 
seven  lines  along  which  great  school  systems  are  often  subdivided. 


77 

I  need  not  comment  in  detail  on  the  legal  provisions  requiring  the  board  to 
organize  the  ordinary  types  of  education  and  empowering  it  to  support  the  special 
types.  I  shall  not  take  your  time  commenting  on  provisions  giving  the  board 
power  to  build  buildings  and  buy  land  or  charging  it  with  the  duty  of  drawing  up 
salary  schedules.  All  of  these  matters  may  be  passed  without  comment  -f  OIL  it 
will  be  generally  agreed  that  they  should  be  included  in  the  fundamental  law. 

There  is  opportunity  for  much  discussion  concerning  financial  provisions. 
Three  types  of  systems  are  found  in  different  cities.  Under  the  first  sort  of 
arrangement  the  duty  of  raising  and  allotting  school  funds  is  left  in  the  hands 
of  the  city  council.  That  plan  is  in  force,  for  example,  in  Eichmond,  Virginia. 
In  general  it  is  not  a  good  system.  In  the  second  place  there  is  the  arrangement 
in  which  the  school  board  is  entirely  independent  of  the  municipality  and  levies 
such  taxes  as  it  may  need  and  spends  the  money  as  it  thinks  wise.  The  system 
generally  works  well  and  does  not  result  in  higher  tax  rates  for  school  support 
than  are  found  in  cities  where  the  schools  are  run  under  the  first  system.  The 
shortcoming  of  this  system  is  that  where  the  school  board  does  not  have  to  discuss 
financial  problems  with  the  public  or  the  city  government,  the  public  are  apt  to 
lose  confidence  after  a  time  and  begin  to  suspect  that  the  schools  are  being 
extravagantly  managed. 

The  third  arrangement  is  a  compromise  between  the  first  two.  Under  this 
plan  the  board  is  given  ultimate  control  over  the  raising  of  its  funds  but  the  other 
municipal  authorities  are  given  the  power  to  step  in  and  require  a  full  and  public 
discussion  of  any  or  all  items  of  the  proposed  budget.  This  third  type  of  arrange- 
ment is  the  one  that  I  have  recommended  for  your  new  law. 

Mr.  Chairman,  I  have  commented  on  the  salient  points  of  the  law  I  have  out- 
lined. I  shall  be  glad  at  this  point  to  follow  your  wishes  and  either  talk  more 
extensively  about  the  problems  I  have  laid  before  you  or  to  answer  such  questions 
as  you  may  wish  to  ask. 

Alderman  Buck:  I  think,  Mr.  Chairman,  that  the  committee  should  take  ad- 
vantage of  Dr.  Ayres'  suggestion  and  ask  at  this  time  questions  about  these 
problems  of  administration. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Would  you  give  the  board  of  education  unlimited  power 
to  raise  money?  Would  you  have  no  fixed  limitation? 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  should  prefer  no  fixed  limitation.  It  is,  of  course,  possible  to 
fix  a  limit  which  will  probably  be  about  five  mills.  In  New  York  we  need  ap- 
proximately 4.7  mills.  When  the  present  system  was  organized,  a  limit  of  three 
mills  was  fixed.  The  schools  get  the  taxes  as  represented  by  that  limit  each  year 
and  then  additional  sums  have  to  be  secured,  bringing  the  total  up  to  about  4.7 
mills.  I  am  not  opposed  to  a  minimum  limit  but  it  is  so  hard  to  foresee  the 
developments  of  the  future  that  I  am  inclined  to  think  the  plan  as  proposed  is 
rather  more  economical  in  its  results. 

Alderman  Buck:  Dr.  Ayres,  in  recommending  an  unpaid  board,  do  you  main- 
tain that  a  board  of  education  should  be  composed  only  of  persons  who  are  able 
to  afford  the  luxury  of  devoting  considerable  portions  of  their  time  to  public 
service  without  recompense? 

BOARD  SHOULD  NOT  ADMINISTER. 

Dr.  Ayres:  No,  sir,  I  do  not  if  you  mean  by  that  persons  of  independent 
means.  In  general  people  of  leisure  do  not  make  good  board  members.  The 
best  board  is  one  composed  of  busy  people.  The  efficient  board  is  apt  to  be  com- 
posed of  merchants,  manufacturers,  bankers,  contractors,  and  professional  men 
of  large  practice.  Such  men  can  generally  think  independently,  explain  the 
reasons  for  their  actions,  take  the  advice  of  experts,  and  spend  money  intelligently. 
The  arguments  in  favor  of  paid  boards  are  mostly  based  on  the  proposition  that 
the  board  members  must  spend  a  large  part  of  their  time  in  dealing  with  the  vast 
mass  of  details  involved  in  running  the  school  system.  The  fact  of  the  matter 
is  that  these  matters  should  not  be  dealt  with  by  board  members  but  by  the 
employed  executives  of  the  system.  The  board  should  decide  what  it  wants  to 
have  done,  select  people  to  do  these  things,  study  results  to  see  how  well  they  are 
being  done,  and  keep  telling  the  people  about  the  problems  faced  and  the  progress 
made. 


78 

This  does  not  mean  that  the  deliberative  work  of  the  board  should  be 
limited  to  telling  the  superintendent  what  the  public  wants  and  the  work  of  the 
superintendent  limited  to  putting  these  orders  into  execution.  In  addition  to  his 
work  as  executive,  the  main  business  of  the  superintendent  is  to  think,  to  plan,  and 
to  propose,  and  the  business  of  the  board  is  to  make  decisions  about  these  pro- 
posals. The  administrative  details  should  be  handled  by  the  employed  officers  of 
the  board  who  are  trained  for  their  work  and  who,  if  well  selected,  are  more 
efficient  in  doing  it  than  the  members  of  the  board  can  possibly  be.  Experience  in 
such  cities  as  Boston,  Cleveland,  and  St.  Louis  indicates  that  if  the  work  of  the 
board  is  properly  organized  it  will  be  found  entirely  possible  to  secure  as  board 
members  people  who  have  no  independent  means  but  who  will  render  the  most 
efficient  sort  of  service  to  the  city. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  How  much  time  do  you  think  a  board  of  education 
ought  to  give  to  the  consideration  of  a  budget  of  $25,000,000? 

Dr.  Ayres:  In  New  York  City  the  budget  was  passed  two  days  ago.  It  was 
the  1917  budget,  not  that  for  1916.  It  has  been  under  close  consideration  for  a 
term  practically  covering  September  and  October.  Preliminary  work  on  it  began 
last  summer.  This  indicates  something  of  the  amount  of  work  required  for  pre- 
paring so  enormous  a  budget  as  one  amounting  to  $25,000,000.  In  New  York 
the  total  is  more  than  $40,000,000.  Let  me  explain  what  I  have  just  said  by 
saying  that  I  believe  the  budget  should  be  a  real  working  budget,  that  it  should 
be  sufficiently  discussed  and  finally  adopted  before  it  goes  into  force  and  that  its 
items  should  be  subject  to  the  closest  scrutiny  in  prospect,  not  in  retrospect.  I  am 
opposed  to  adopting  a  budget  after  the  money  has  largely  been  spent. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  consider  it  the  function  of  a  board  of  education 
to  scrutinize  the  budget  closely  and  balance  one  item  against  another  in  order  to 
arrive  at  conclusions  as  to  the  way  the  money  should  be  expended  for  the  best 
advantage  of  the  pupils  and  the  taxpayers? 

Dr.  Ayres:     Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Would  that  not  take  a  great  deal  of  time  if  the  work 
be  well  done? 

SALARY  OF  $3,000  FOR  MEMBERS  TOO  HIGH. 

Dr.  Ayres:  In  a  well  organized  system  it  does  not  take  so  long  after  it  has 
been  done  for  two  or  three  years,  because  it  is  perfectly  possible  to  make  each 
bureau  chief  or  division  head  throughout  the  system  explain  the  items  pertaining 
to  his  work  and  especially  those  in  which  any  change  or  increase  is  involved.  This 
work,  like  other  features  of  board  business,  can  be  so  organized  that  the  board 
will  not  have  to  consider  the  details  but  will  pass  on  reasons  presented  for 
changes. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  If  the  question  involved  methods  for  raising  money 
to  introduce  vocational  education,  would  not  a  good  deal  of  investigation  be 
required  by  the  board? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Yes,  the  board  must  give  much  consideration  to  any  such  funda- 
mental problem  as  you  have  suggested.  The  real  question  is  whether  or  not  it  is 
possible  to  secure  such  service  better  if  the  members  of  a  board  are  paid  a  salary 
of  say  $1,500  a  year  than  it  is  for  an  unpaid  board.  Of  course  if  you  regard 
this  as  an  annual  salary  you  will  at  once  agree  that  you  could  not  employ  for 
any  such  amount  any  one  whom  you  would  want  to  have  on  your  board.  Never- 
theless the  result  of  establishing  a  $1,500  salary  is  sure  to  be  that  the  public  will 
immediately  begin  to  regard  the  board  memberships  a  set  of  seven  $1,500  jobs 
to  which  various  people  want  to  be  elected.  If  you  place  the  salary  higher  at 
$3,000  or  $5,000,  then  you  have  simply  added  to  your  educational  force  seven 
untrained  assistant  superintendents  who  will  be  expected  to  devote  practically 
full  time  to  their  duties  because  they  are  in  receipt  of  fair  sized  salaries  for 
doing  it.  Now  if  you  decide  to  employ  seven  more  assistant  superintendents  at  a 
salary  of  $5,000  each,  you  would  better  get  trained  ones  and  place  them  under 
the  superintendent  instead  of  getting  untrained  ones  and  placing  them  over  the 
superintendent.  The  experience  of  other  cities  indicates  that  the  lack  of  salary 
does  not  exclude  from  the  board  men  of  breadth  of  vision  and  small  income  such 
as  an  intelligent  and  public  spirited  artisan  might  be. 


79 

Alderman  Kennedy:     We  have  never  had  any  such  here  in  Chicago. 
Alderman   Buck:      We   never   elected   a   school   board   in    Chicago,   Alderman 
Kennedy. 

NEW  YORK  BOARD   DESCRIBED. 

Alderman  Powers:  Is  the  Board  of  Education  of  New  York  elected  by  the 
people? 

Dr.  Ayres:     In  New  York  the  members  are  appointed  by  the  mayor. 

Alderman  Powers:     How  many? 

Dr.  Ayres:     Forty-six. 

Alderman  Powers:     You  are  twice  as  badly  off  as  we  are. 

Dr.  Ayres:  The  organization  and  board  control  of  our  New  York  system 
illustrates  almost  all  the  evils  of  faulty  educational  organization  and  administra- 
tion except  those  of  gross  dishonesty.  The  board  is  too  big,  too  cumbersome,, 
and  inefficient  in  action,  and  it  does  not  enjoy  the  confidence  of  the  people  or  the 
support  and  respect  of  the  press. 

Alderman  Powers:  Do  you  not  think  that  the  school  system  should  have  a 
business  manager? 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  believe  that  there  should  be  in  the  school  organization  an 
official  with  the  rank  and  title  of  assistant  superintendent  in  charge  of  business 
affairs.  He  should  be  an  assistant  to  the  superintendent.  I  am  opposed  to  a 
two-headed  form  of  organization  in  which  the  superintendent  is  in  charge  of 
educational  matters  and  the  business  manager  is  in  charge  of  the  business  and 
financial  matters.  A  school  system  exists  for  only  one  purpose  and  that  is  the 
teaching  of  the  children.  Everything  that  it  does  should  have  as  its  object  the 
improvement  of  the  education  of  the  children.  Every  educational  action  is  in 
some  measure  financial  and  every  financial  transaction  is  in  some  measure 
educational.  They  cannot  be  completely  separated  and  that  is  why  a  system  should 
have  a  unit  instead  of  a  double  organization. 

Alderman  Buck:  How  much  further  would  you  carry  your  plan  of  organiza- 
tion? How  many  other  departments  would  you  create  under  officers  having  the 
rank  of  assistant  superintendents? 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  would  not  create  any  more  by  action  of  law.  I  should  build 
up  the  organization  by  action  of  the  board  through  its  by-laws.  There  will  be  in 
the  system  a  number  of  men  of  status  similar  to  that  of  the  assistant  in  charge 
of  business  affairs  but  they  should  not  have  the  rank  of  assistant  superintendents. 
Such  officers  are  the  architect,  the  engineer,  the  auditor,  and-  the  superintendents 
of  supplies. 

SECRETARY  SHOULD  BE   SUBORDINATE. 

Alderman  Buck:     What  should  be  the  status  of  the  secretary  of  the  board? 

Dr.  Ayres:  The  secretary  of  the  board  was  originally  a  clerk  and  often  the 
treasurer  in  addition.  As  cities  developed  he  began  to  take  on  the  duties  of  the 
business  manager  and  in  some  states,  Ohio  for  example,  he  is  charged  by  law 
with  some  of  those  duties.  In  my  opinion  the  clerk  of  the  board  should  do  work 
similar  to  that  done  by  a  chief  clerk  in  an  office  of  the  federal  government.  He 
should  be  an  office  director  having  duties  relating  to  the  efficiency  of  the  office 
management.  He  should  not  have  independent  power  to  influence  general  policies. 

Alderman  Buck:  Whom  would  you  have  him  serve,  the  superintendent  of 
schools? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Yes,  sir.  In  point  of  fact  that  will  hardly  become  an  issue 
because  in  such  a  system  as  I  have  outlined,  the  status  of  positions  of  authority 
and  responsibility  will  be  so  definitely  formulated  that  the  impersonal  rule  of 
duties  and  responsibilities  will  largely  take  the  place  of  the  personal  rule  of 
superior  over  subordinates. 

Alderman  Buck:  Would  you  have  the  clerk  serve  in  the  department  of  the 
business  manager  or  would  you  have  him  independent  of  that  department? 

Dr.  Ayres:     I  would  have  him  serve  in  that  department. 

Alderman  Buck:     As  a  subordinate  to  the  business  manager? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Yes,  sir.  It  would  make  him  a  less  important  official  than  he 
often  is  in  school  systems  at  present.  Many  systems  would  benefit  by  such  a 
change. 


80 

Alderman  Miller:     Who  would  keep  the  record  of  the  board  proceedings? 

Dr.  Ayres:  This  secretary.  He  would  be  the  secretary  of  the  board  meet- 
ings. This  is  true  in  many  localities  at  present  because  in  many  places  the  law 
says  that  the  superintendent  shall  be  secretary  of  the  board  as  well.  Now  what 
happens  in  such  cases  is  that  the  superintendent  delegates  to  an  assistant  the 
work  of  being  secretary  of  the  board. 

Alderman  Buck:  Reverting  to  the  question  of  the  budget,  would  you  say 
that  it  should  be  made  and  finally  passed  if  possible  before  the  money  is  ap- 
propriated? 

Dr.  Ayres:     Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:     Before  the  tax  is  levied? 

Dr.  Ayres:    Yes,  sir. 

Alderman  Buck:  So  that  bugetary  control  would  be  real  control  and  the 
appropriation  would  be  dependent  on  a  program  worked  out  in  advance? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Yes,  sir.  With  a  certain  small  leeway  for  unforseen  contingencies, 
perhaps  met  through  power  to  issue  revenue  bonds  in  small  amounts  during  the 
year. 

FINANCIAL  INDEPENDENCE  FOR  BOARD. 

Alderman  Buck :  Will  you  state  in  somewhat  more  detail  your  opinion  as 
to  whether  the  board  of  education  should  have  financial  independence  or  be 
dependent  upon  the  municipal  authorities. 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  believe  in  giving  the  board  of  education  ultimate  financial 
independence  but  in  arranging  to  hold  it  publicly  responsible  for  its  acts.  The 
scheme  I  have  outlined  provides  that  the  board  of  education  shall  submit  a  budget, 
that  the  financial  authorities  of  the  city  shall  take  part  in  discussing  it  before  it 
is  adopted,  and  that  these  authorities  can  challenge  any  item  and  require  a  public 
hearing  on  it.  In  case  of  final  disagreement,  I  would  give  the  board  power  to 
settle  any  disputed  item  by  a  vote  of  five  out  of  seven.  In  case  of  failure  to  do 
this,  the  item  of  the  preceding  year  would  stand.  The  object  is  to  give  the  board 
power  combined  with  enforced  publicity  and  responsibility. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  If  we  had  a  city  manager  plan  of  government  would  you 
be  in  favor  of  having  the  school  system  run  in  the  same  way  that  all  of  the  other 
•departments  of  the  city  government  would  be? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Many  students  of  municipal  government  believe  that  such 
a  plan  would  work  well.  That  would  do  away  with  the  board  of  education  and 
trust  the  direction  of  the  schools  to  a  superintendent  who  would  have  the  same" 
relationship  to  the  work  as  exists  between  the  chief  of  police  and  the  chief 
of  the  fire  department  and  their  assistants  and  subordinates.  If  the  work  of  the 
board  of  education  had  to  do  with  adults  and  if  it  largely  consisted  of  dealing 
with  a  mass  of  routine  business  details,  this  view  would  probably  be  sound.  In 
my  opinion  Chicago  will  need  a  board  of  education  for  many  years  to  come  because 
its  proper  work  consists  in  large  measure  in  dealing  with  new  problems  of  policy 
and  in  only  small  degree  in  disposing  of  routine  business  details.  To  an  exceptional 
degree  the  educational  system  of  this  city  demands  continuously  intelligent  policy- 
making  activity.  The  city  is  growing  with  unremitting  rapidity.  Its  economic 
life  is  exceptionally  varied  and  mobile.  New  and  large  alien  communities  spring 
up  almost  periodically  and  in  unexpected  places.  All  these  conditions  combine  to 
make  it  necessary  that  its  educational  government  shall  be  flexible  and  adaptable. 
It  is  more  likely  to  have  these  qualities  if  it  has  the  advantages  of  lay  counsel 
than  if  its  policies  are  exclusively  decided  by  its  professional  officials.  A  requisite 
for  unbroken  progress  in  public  government  is  to  go  forward  rapidly  enough  to 
enlist  the  confidence  of  the  public  but  not  so  rapidly  as  to  arouse  their  suspicion 
and  distrust. 

DROP  NO  TEACHERS  WITHOUT  NOTICE. 

Alderman  Powers:  What  method  do  you  think  a  superintendent  should  adopt 
regarding  the  discharge  of  teachers  and  keeping  a  record  of  the  efficiency  and  con- 
duct of  the  teachers? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Conditions  under  which  teachers  may  be  dismissed  must  be  just 
to  both  the  teachers  and  the  school  system.  No  teacher  should  be  discharged  as 


81 

unsatisfactory  who  has  not  been  notified  of  the  deficiencies  in  her  work  and  been 
given  careful  assistance  in  attempting  to  remedy  them.  If  the  official  records  of 
the  teacher's  services  continue  to  be  unsatisfactory  after  she  has  been  given 
opportunity  to  better  them  and  assistance  in  helping  her  to  do  so,  then  the  superin- 
tendent should  recommend  that  a  written  notice  be  served  on  the  teacher  telling 
her  that  the  board  desires  to  dispense  with  her  services  at  the  end  of  the  year. 
This  written  notice  should  set  forth  in  detail  the  reasons  for  the  action  and  the 
records  on  which  it  is  based.  The  superintendent  and  the  board  should  be  the 
judges  of  the  sufficiency  of  the  reasons  for  terminating  the  contract.  There 
should  be  no  meddling  by  lawyers  or  interference  by  the  courts.  Teachers  who 
receive  no  such  notifications  should  continue  in  service  from  year  to  year  up  to  the 
end  of  their  contract  period  or  indefinitely  according  to  the  system  in  use  in  the 
city.  If  teachers  desire  to  leave  the  system  they  should  in  their  turn  notify  the 
superintendent  or  their  principal. 

This  system  gives  indefinite  tenure  to  all  worthy  teachers  and  school  officials 
but  reserves  to  the  board  the  right  to  remove  from  the  schools  those  who  should 
not  be  there  after  they  have  been  given  full  opportunity  to  improve  the  quality 
of  their  work.  The  whole  process  should  rest  on  a  system  of  carefully  made  and 
frequently  revised  records.  No  teacher  should  receive  satisfactory  marks  year 
after  year  and  then  be  suddenly  dismissed  for  inefficiency. 

Alderman  Powers:  Do  you  think  a  board  of  education  should  prohibit  a 
teacher  from  affiliating  herself  with  labor  organizations  or  should  forbid  the  teach- 
ers to  have  unions  of  their  own? 

Dr.  Ayers:  No,  sir,  I  do  not  believe  that  the  board  of  education  should 
prohibit  teachers  from  affiliating  themselves  with  labor  organizations.  I  believe 
the  teachers  have  the  right  to  organize  for  the  promotion  of  their  professional 
welfare.  They  have  that  same  right  when  one  of  the  objects  of  their  organization 
is  collective  bargaining  for  increased  salaries.  It  is  very  unfortunate  for  a  body 
of  teachers  to  get  into  the  habit  of  thinking  most  of  the  time  about  more  pay  or 
less  work  or  both,  but  sometimes  organized  campaigns  for  increased  salaries  are 
necessary.  I  think  as  a  matter  of  principle  that  the  board  has  no  right  to  pro- 
hibit such  organization.  The  solution  of  the  problem  does  not  lie  in  forbidding 
the  teachers  to  take  concerted  action  with  regard  to  their  own  pay  and  work 
conditions.  It  lies  rather  in  stimulating  an  active  participation  of  the  entire 
teaching  force  in  dealing  with  problems  and  conditions  of  the  school  system 
and  keeping  them  thoroughly  informed  and  individually  interested  in  matters  of 
organization,  curricula,  teaching  methods,  resources,  and  finances.  Most  or- 
ganized movements  of  teachers  that  appear  hostile  to  school  systems  grow  out  of 
their  conviction  that  they  are  being  treated  as  outsiders. 

ABOLISH   ALL   STANDING   COMMITTEES. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  are  your  opinions  in  regard  to  the  methods  of 
the  board  in  working  through  committees? 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  am  much  opposed  to  the  usual  methods  of  organization  by  which 
the  school  board  divides  itself  into  a  number  of  standing  committees  and 
transacts  its  business  through  them.  There  are  boards  of  five  in  this  country 
which  have  11  standing  committees.  I  may  say,  in  passing,  that  the  board  of  five 
members  is  the  commonest  sized  board  among  the  larger  cities  of  the  country. 
There  are  more  boards  of  five  among  the  50  largest  cities  than  there  are  boards 
of  any  other  size.  The  next  commonest  number  is  nine  and  the  next  is  seven. 
Boards  of  these  three  sizes  constitute  two-thirds  of  all  of  the  boards  of  educa- 
tion in  cities  of  more  than  100,000  population.  In  most  cases  these  small  boards 
still  divide  themselves  up  into  a  large  number  of  standing  committees.  In 
my  opinion  they  thereby  nullify  in  large  measure  the  advantages  which  were 
mainly  influential  in  bringing  about  the  reductions  in  the  size  of  the  boards. 

Unified  action  is  impossible  if  the  board  is  split  into  several  small  commit- 
tees handling  detailed  matters  and  tending  to  become  independent  of  each  other. 
Because  of  accumulated  experience  with  the  unsatisfactory  work  of  large  boards 
acting  through  committees  American  cities  have  almost  unanimously  replaced  the 
large  board  by  a  small  one  precisely  for  the  purpose  of  making  it  possible  for 


82 

the  board  to  act  as  a  committee  of  the  whole.  There  is  no  good  reason  to 
have  most  matters  considered  by  three  or  four  of  the  seven  members  of  the 
board  and  immediately  .thereafter  reconsidered  by  the  seven  members.  Yet  that 
is  what  happens  continually  under  the  committee  system. 

If  a  small  board  has  standing  committees  they  should  be  only  three  in 
number:  one  on  business,  one  on  education,  and  one  on  buildings.  A  still  better 
plan  is  for  the  board  to  have  no  permanent  committees.  In  that  case  almost 
all  of  the  business  can  be  transacted  by  the  board  as  a  whole  and  committees 
can  be  created  from  time  to  time  for  temporary  purposes.  After  they  have  re- 
ported they  go  out  of  existence. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  believe  that  it  is  the  function  of  the  board 
of  education  to  educate  the  adults  of  a  community  through  the  wider  use  of  the 
schools? 

Dr.  Ayres:     Yes,  I  do. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     And  the  school  system  should  be  so  used? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Yes,  sir,  and  in  drawing  up  a  law  the  school  system  should  not 
be  required  to  undertake  such  activities  but  it  should  be  empowered  to  do  so. 

Alderman  Buck:  What  views  have  you  concerning  the  wisdom  of  the  super- 
intendent or  the  board  obtaining  from  time  to  time  the  views  of  the  teachers? 

Dr.  Ayres:  The  superintendent  and  board  should  not  only  get  in  close  touch 
with  the  teachers  from  time  to  time,  they  should  keep  in  close  touch  pretty  much 
all  the  time.  The  question  you  have  asked  rises  most  frequently  in  connection 
with  adopting  a  new  course  of  study.  There  are  several  ways  in  which  this  may 
be  done.  The  first  is  to  get  the  course  of  studies  of  other  cities  and  with  a 
pair  of  scissors  and  a  paste  brush  construct  a  new  one  for  your  city.  This  is 
frequently  done.  It  is  a  rapid,  inefficient  method.  A  second  and  better  method 
is  to  get  the  advice  and  assistance  of  competent  people  in  different  parts  of  the 
country.  With  the  cooperation  of  such  educational  experts  a  good  course  of  study 
can  be  constructed. 

SUPERINTENDENT  AND  TEACHERS  COOPERATE. 

A  third  way  is  to  start  in  with  the  teachers  and  by  a  long  and  rather  diffi- 
cult process  of  study,  conference,  and  consultation  evolve  a  course  of  study.  It 
will  take  from  three  to  ten  times  as  long  and  involve  about  ten  times  as  much 
work  to  make  the  new  course  with  the  cooperation  of  the  teachers  as  it  will  to 
make  it  at  headquarters  without  them.  When  the  work  is  all  done  the  course  of 
study  will  be  about  the  same  as  if  it  were  created  in  the  other  way.  The  differ- 
ence is  that  the  process  of  making  it  has  been  enormously  valuable  to  the 
teachers.  When  the  work  is  done  they  have  the  personal  interest  in  the  course 
of  study  and  feel  that  it  is  their  own  product.  They  respect  it  and  believe  in  it. 
This  is  the  way  that  team  work  is  developed  in  a  school  system.  The  schools  may 
be  run  efficiently  by  edict  but  that  method  does  not  build  up  a  progressive  and 
virile  organization. 

Alderman  Buck:  In  your  judgment  is  it  worth  the  expenditure  of  time  and 
energy? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Yes,  sir,  and  in  the  long  run  it  is  the  only  way  in  which  a  school 
system  can  become  a  self-sustaining  organization.  A  dictator,  like  Diaz  of  Mexico, 
may  run  the  organization  very  well  for  a  long  time  but  he  does  not  develop 
associates  who  can  take  his  place  when  he  drops  out.  When  he  drops  out  the 
system  goes  to  pieces.  The  "great  man"  theory  of  sociology  is  subject  to  the 
weakness  that  it  does  not  provide  any  method  by  which  the  great  man  will  train 
up  succeeding  great  men  to  take  his  place. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  You  speak  of  a  salary  schedule.  How  would  it  be  ar- 
ranged? Would  it  be  progressive  by  years? 

Dr.  Ayres:  The  board  should  be  charged  by  law  with  the  duty  of  drawing 
up  salary  schedules  and  putting  them  into  effect.  It  should  not  be  allowed  to  pay 
each  new  teacher  whatever  salary  it  wishes  although  many  boards  follow  that 
policy.  The  salary  schedules  should  provide  for  increases  based  in  part  on 
years  of  service  and  with  additional  rewards  for  growth  and  efficiency  after  a 
common  maximum  has  been  reached.  The  stimulus  needs  to  be  kept  up  for  a 


83 

rather  long  period  of  time  until  the  habit  of  keeping  professionally  active  has  been 
well  established.  In  teaching,  as  in  other  lines  of  work,  the  intensity  of  the  desire 
for  personal  improvement  is  in  direct  proportion  to  the  stimulus  it  receives.  There 
are  cities,  notably  Detroit  and  Milwaukee,  where  the  teachers  get  at  ±he_  st_art 
practically  the  maximum  salary.  This  represents  a  poor  policy  and  one  which 
offers  little  stimulus  to  professional  growth.  In  New  York  the  increments  con- 
tinue in  many  cases  for  as  long  a  term  as  eighteen  years. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  After  a  teacher  has  passed  the  probationary  period 
should  he  or  she  be  subject  to  a  salary  reduction  as  a  matter  of  discipline?  Should 
that  weapon  be  used  by  the  board? 

Dr.  Ayres:  Certainly  not  in  the  case  of  groups  and  almost  never  in  the 
case  of  individuals.  In  general  it  is  better  to  suspend  a  teacher  in  case  of  need 
than  to  reduce  her  salary. 

PROVISION  FOR  RETIREMENT  AND  PENSION. 

Alderman  Powers:  If  teachers  enter  the  service  at  the  age  of  twenty-one  how 
many  years  elapse  before  they  begin  to  deteriorate,  on  the  average? 

Dr.  Ayres:  That  is  a  matter  of  opinion.  In  my  own  opinion  many  teachers 
reach  their  highest  degree  of  efficiency  after  six  years  of  service.  Teachers 
are  quite  definitely  divided  into  two  groups.  Among  each  group  of  100  teachers 
about  fifty  drop  out  in  the  first  eleven  years.  They  get  married  or  go  into  some 
other  profession.  The  other  fifty  stay  until  they  die  or  are  retired  on  a  pension. 
There  is  almost  no  middle  group. 

Alderman  Powers:     You  have  a  pension  system  in  New  York  City? 

Dr.  Ayres:     Yes,  sir,  we  have  a  bankrupt  pension  system. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     Do  you  believe  in  an  age  limit  for  teachers? 

Dr.  Ayres:     Yes,  sir,  I  do. 

Alderman  Kennedy:     How  should  that  be  determined? 

Dr.  Ayres:  There  should  be  an  age  limit  arbitrarily  determined  with  pro- 
visions for  individual  exceptions.  In  general  it  can  be  a  little  older  for  adminis- 
trative officials  than  for  classroom  teachers.  Sixty  years  is  possibly  the  best 
limit  for  classroom  teachers  and  sixty-five  years  for  administrative  officials. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Of  course  that  would  not  be  feasible  unless  there  were  a 
pension  system. 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  can  hardly  agree  to  that.  Although  I  fully  recognize  the 
claims  of  the  teacher  I  should  say  that  the  claims  of  the  child  are  so  much 
greater  than  if  we  were  so  unfortunate  as  to  pay  our  teachers  no  more  than  a 
living  wage  and  have  no  pension  system  it  would  still  be  necessary  to  retire  teach- 
ers at  about  the  age  I  have  mentioned.  This  would  be  a  most  unfortunate 
combination  and  I  do  not  believe  it  needs  to  exist  in  aay  American  city. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Do  you  believe  that  our  public  school  system  should 
include  a  city  college,  something  as  they  have  in  Cincinnati  and  in  New  York? 

Dr.  Ayres:  I  think  it  is  entirely  within  the  legitimate  purview  of  the 
school  system  to  have  city  colleges.  I  think  we  are  going  to  have  many  more 
of  them  in  the  next  few  years.  I  do  not  think  we  should  have  them  in  every 
city.  A  great  deal  depends  on  what  other  institutions  the  city  already  possesses. 
I  think  that  the  city  colleges  in  Cincinnati  and  in  New  York  are  valuable  at  the 
present  time  and  will  be  still  more  valuable  in  the  future. 

Alderman  Kennedy:  Are  the  funds  for  the  support  of  the  New  York  institu- 
tion derived  entirely  from  the  tax  levy? 

Dr.  Ayres:  So  nearly  entirely  that  one  might  answer  your  question  in  the 
affirmative. 


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